6th Gen About TMs and HMs

[FaeRose]

HMs and TMs have changed a lot sense the original Gen III. Flash and Rock Smash, which were commonly used as HM's are now TMs. The boulders used by strength are also a whole lot more larger than the original.

Do you think that there will be changes from the XY TM/HM line up to accommodate abilitys like Rock Smash, Strength, Dive, and Flash?

I know that they would use HMs for Rock Smash to block off parts of the world so you wouldn't be able to access it until you've got that gym badge. Flash was also used to make navigating through that cave easier once you got the gym badge.

Due to TMs and HMs not being transferable like they were in Gen 4 and below, they could redo some of the TMs and HMs, and make a list that fits Hoen a lot more.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

I think they'll replace the Tm number that Flash and Rock Smash cover with two moves while making those two moves HM moves again in order to keep the number of Tm's the same. I would like to see Dragon pulse be one of those two moves. I was hoping that it'll return in XY.

 

[pryce10]

Apart from making Dive HM again ( kinda like how they changed whirlpool as HM in HG/SS) I don't think there will be that big of a change...

 

[Cerberus87]

This isn't even a question. Of course they will. HGSS had Whirlpool HM but not Defog, for example.

 

[FaeRose]

The concern is though that you can have a Pokemon with rock smash be traded into the game, and access content earlier than you are suppose to. Rock Smash (maybe not flash) should be an HM to prevent this. Or maybe at least the game breaking blocks are replaced with strentgh boulders.

 

[fenyx4]

HMs and TMs have changed a lot sense the original Gen III. Flash and Rock Smash, which were commonly used as HM's are now TMs. The boulders used by strength are also a whole lot more larger than the original.

Do you think that there will be changes from the XY TM/HM line up to accommodate abilitys like Rock Smash, Strength, Dive, and Flash?

I know that they would use HMs for Rock Smash to block off parts of the world so you wouldn't be able to access it until you've got that gym badge. Flash was also used to make navigating through that cave easier once you got the gym badge.

Due to TMs and HMs not being transferable like they were in Gen 4 and below, they could redo some of the TMs and HMs, and make a list that fits Hoen a lot more.

I think they'll replace the Tm number that Flash and Rock Smash cover with two moves while making those two moves HM moves again in order to keep the number of Tm's the same. I would like to see Dragon pulse be one of those two moves. I was hoping that it'll return in XY.

This would seem like an ideal solution, re-assigning Flash and Rock Smash as HMs and giving their previous TM slots to other deserving moves. Personally, since TMs and HMs can't be transferred anymore, I would love a revamp of the TM list; hopefully with the return of things like Focus Punch as TM01 (although Hone Claws is still somewhat usable).

The concern is though that you can have a Pokemon with rock smash be traded into the game, and access content earlier than you are suppose to. Rock Smash (maybe not flash) should be an HM to prevent this. Or maybe at least the game breaking blocks are replaced with strentgh boulders.

Although I haven't tried trading over a Pokemon with Rock Smash to access content early within Generation 3, the player needs the Dynamo Badge from Mauville Gym to use Rock Smash in the overworld in Pokemon Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald anyway, so I imagine that Pokemon OmegaRuby/AlphaSapphire would simply place some sort of check that prevents the player from using Rock Smash outside of battle (even if a Rock Smash-knowing Pokemon is traded over early) until the Dynamo Badge is obtained.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

Oh that won't be an issue as in Hoenn we couldn't use the field feature of the HM's unless we had the badges. So even if say someone got a Pokémon with Rock smash early on they wouldn't be able to break the rocks. Also they could prevent trading until the post-main story like they did in the originals and in the Kanto remakes.

 

[Zeturic]

Flash doesn't matter (it's not required even in games that it is an HM), but Rock Smash does.

Most likely, Rock Smash will become HM06, and Secret Power will replace it as TM94.

 

[Salzorrah]

I'm pretty sure Rock Smash should be back but not Flash. Maybe it could be replaced by Rock Slide or something? Or perhaps Whirlpool?

 

[Pepperton]

Game Freak has certainly established that they will change the existing HMs list based on what region the player's in. Since Defog isn't a necessary move outside of battle, it lost its HM status to a move that was necessary in HGSS, Whirpool. Dive will follow a similar route in ORAS, as well as possibly a rearranging of old HMs like Flash to accommodate new TMs from Kalos.

 

[Rivvon]

They could redesign some areas so that Flash and Rock Smash aren't required, at least to the point where they regain HM status (for example, while Whirlpool was given HM status in HGSS but not DPP, Flash did not regain its HM status in HGSS despite being an HM in gen 2 because it was not mandatory to progress through the region). But if they keep the areas similar to the originals they can easily be changed into HMs, since TMs can no longer be traded. And I'm sure trading Pokémon who know those HM moves wouldn't be an issue because the game wouldn't let you use the HM until you have the appropriate badge.
But starting with BW, it seems as though Game Freak has been trying to make HMs less and less required and more for optional exploration purposes so it's hard to say which way they'll go for now.


On a slightly related note, I hope some Pokémon get their TM/HM learnset altered a bit for ORAS. For example, looking at Mega Swampert now, I see no reason why Swampert shouldn't be able to learn Bulk Up.

 

[Bobbylicious]

Hopefully the make flash and rock smash as TM's and just change rock smash to strength in areas where you need rock smash as an HM to progress, or redesign places if needed.

And strength boulders will probably be big again.
They were probably enlarged in XY because in the previous games the boulders are the same size as the characters, and in XY since they made them bigger, they probs upped the size of the boulders so they were the same size as the characters, so yes they will probs be big again just to match characters height

 

[Altairis]

Dive is obviously going to become an HM again, although since it's not currently a TM and there isn't an HM limit (XY only had 5, while they've had 6 before!) I think they're just going to add it in. I can see them removing Flash, simply because it's not necessary to get through several areas and I'm sure it was only an HM in previous gens just so it was able to be reused since it was pretty useful.

Dunno what else they would change, though I could name a bunch of TMs that I think deserve the boot. /coughquashcough/

 

[Salzorrah]

It is actually weird that Whirlpool wasn't implemented in Hoenn despite its popularity with trumpets and water so I hope we see Whirlpool back in the game despite not being there in RSE. I'm okay with the abolishment of Flash and replacing Whirlpool as HM05 and bringing back HM06 which is Rock Smash.

If we go at it this way then the HM Badge Requirement can go something like this:

Rustboro: Cut usable outside battle
Dewford: Rock Smash
Mauville: Strength
Lavaridge: Whirlpool or Surf
Petalburg: Surf or Whirlpool
Fortree: Fly
Mossdeep: Dive
Sootopolis: Waterfall

 

[Bobbylicious]

It is actually weird that Whirlpool wasn't implemented in Hoenn despite its popularity with trumpets and water so I hope we see Whirlpool back in the game despite not being there in RSE. I'm okay with the abolishment of Flash and replacing Whirlpool as HM05 and bringing back HM06 which is Rock Smash.

If we go at it this way then the HM Badge Requirement can go something like this:

Rustboro: Cut usable outside battle
Dewford: Rock Smash
Mauville: Strength
Lavaridge: Whirlpool or Surf
Petalburg: Surf or Whirlpool
Fortree: Fly
Mossdeep: Dive
Sootopolis: Waterfall

Eh, I don't want whirlpool as an HM. that would mean there'd be 4 water HM's which is too much IMO.

 

[Elaitenstile]

Eh, I don't want whirlpool as an HM. that would mean there'd be 4 water HM's which is too much IMO.

That's true. They've already made more than enough and while Surf and Waterfall are useful in-battle, Dive doesn't really cut in as a usable move. If they limit the HMs to, say, seven, then I'm sure many would be steamed about the fact that they need to waste seven slots to HMs, or take two HM slaves. The five-HM thing makes sure that Fly and Surf are already added to one of your Pokémon, and three others handled by a slave. Two slaves is... too much. So is seven slots. They need to remove both Waterfall and Flash, because even though Waterfall is, like, symbolic to Ever Grande, let's face it: we all found it a bother to add that extra water move. Flash obviously because it would be annoying in 3D and even though dark caves are realistic, it's annoying to cross Victory Road with a near-useless HM moves.