5th Gen Anyone else agree with Team Plasma?

[Infernal_Storm]

I disagree, because you may force them at first, but then you form a bond with them, making the happier than they originally were. Team Plasma were trying to break this bond with trainers, which is like trying to steal a best friend from you.

 

[quilzel]

I agree to a degree. Pokemon and people rely on each other for a better existence. As the dominate species, we should treat them kindly.

Spoilers:

The whole plot is about becoming friends with your Pokemon. N tells you at the end of the game that when he talked to your Pokemon in Mistralton City that your Pokemon confused him because they said they want to stay with you. Later in the game, (I think it was) Cheren states that: if a Pokemon wanted to, it would just leave. A Pokeball only captures the body, not its heart.

 

[Legobricks]

There are bad folk and monsters, and good folk and monsters. Usually they match up, like the evil Raticate with the evil Rocket grunt, so either way they tend to be content. Drayden said that Pokemon aren't actually bound to their balls and would leave if they wanted to, which says it all to me. The relationship between people and monsters could be likened to any symbiotic one found in nature, though it extends to culture as well. Granted, only human ambition really strains that relationship, but the story of life is itself one of conflict; a safe world does not progress. I don't think Plasma's ideal is right or wrong, its result is only less interesting.

 

[Luck]

I don't agree with them at all. They have a decent cause at first, but they do it by harassing players and forcibly taking their pokemon whether they want to or not. It seems like they're just trying to make an even thicker line between human and animal.

I don't really have a problem with them using pokemon to release pokemon though. It's completely understandable considering how impossible it is to do anything in that world by yourself.

There you go Nica, happy?

 

[Pecilia]

I see what they're doing and I understand why, but they're just not good at doing it. The way they're doing it, well they're using pokemon as tools like all the other groups so that doesn't really prove anything on their side when they're trying to free joyful pokemon from trainers while they are mistreating them to do this. I'll disagree with them though/

 

[theowlmanlives]

I like to think the pokemon choose whether or not to come with you, I mean in the anime they can choose to be caught by the pokeball or not to be caught. When you try to capture it it chooses either to go with you or not to, as if you just captured it then you wouldn't have to fight it just capture it.(though why do some pokemon seem happy to live in hollowed out fruit?) Also if they felt like slaves why do they feel happy around you?

 

[Shiro]

I thought it was nice to have a team that didn't come off as completely insane right off the bat. I know a lot of people questioned some of the implications that came with battling in the game, so it was really nice to see the developers address it and give people an answer!

Spoiler:

Of course, in the end it turned out that a good majority of Team Plasma actually didn't care much for Pokemon, but it's probably safe to assume at least some were tricked into thinking they were doing some good like N was? I think the message was nice and was a little excited to see a sane team, but they did turn out to be kind of insane in the end dfjdsjfdfjasdfj

 

[hikari_F]

i think i'm kinda understand N point of view,since he's been raised together ONLY with pokemon,without human friends
but for ghetsis? a big no..he is just simply hypocrite that want to dominate poke world

 

[Overlord Drakow]

I can understand the point of view Team Plasma was trying to preach to the general public. Unfortunately in this Pokemon world, Pokemon are most likely used as part of the military force for a country. I suppose you could somewhat compare it to asking our world to disarm all of their nuclear weapons or whatever. Due to the revolting nature of us humans, there will be people who will try to exploit this. In Black and White, it was Ghetsis. Just a different angle to consider I guess.

 

[Maple Leaf]

I don't think it's exactly "turning them into slaves," so I disagree with Team Plasma here. Overall, I see what they mean, except for the fact that it's not necessarily cruel. I do agree that it's "forceful" (as in the catching) - nothing else.

 

[Ω Ruby and α Sapphire]

No, team plasma talk absolute rubbish. If a pokemon didn't like you the battle would go like this. You: " alright let's go kyruem!" chucks the poke while team plasma man says "alright stunkfish show em what ya got" Then you select a move. He bites your head of and walks off.

 

[Natural Harmonia Gropius]

*Spoilers*




If you talk to Team Plasma members in N's castle, they'll reveal that they have been using pokemon all this time for their own gain, and they think of pokemon as nothing more than tools (although I think only the higher ranking Team Plasma members knew their true intentions, and most members were just innocent pawns who got manipulated). And Ghetsis himself says he only wants to use pokemon to take over the world. And of course, N is innocent, because he genuinely only wanted to prevent pokemon from being hurt in pokemon battles.

As for whether I agree or not, I'd have to say that I can see their point, but at the same time, there are people who do things other than battling with pokemon. If pokemon were real and I had pokemon, I wouldn't make them battle if they didn't want to, and if they wanted to be free, I'd free them.

Edit: Also, in the anime, when Ash was trying to catch Snivy, she resisted at first, which is why Ash's pokeballs wouldn't work on her, but then she suddenly decided she wanted to go with him (of course she didn't talk, but it was obvious), so the next pokeball suddenly worked.

 

[PlayingAmongStars]

I don't in a regular game, because I like to think Pokemon want to be with people and that they're naturally drawn to each other. But in a Nuzlocke Challenge or something similar? They're pretty much entirely justified in their beliefs, as "killing" your Pokemon is just plain cruel.

 

[M4]

Why? Humans are a primitive race. There will never be equal amongst us and Pokemon. No matter what Professor Juniper say Pokemon will always be slaves of the human population.

 

[Natural Harmonia Gropius]

Why? Humans are a primitive race. There will never be equal amongst us and Pokemon. No matter what Professor Juniper say Pokemon will always be slaves of the human population.

Well I'm not sure about the manga (haven't read that much of it) but I know in the anime and in the games, trainers have either released pokemon or said they would release them if their pokemon wanted to be released. Ash has released many of his pokemon, because they were needed by other pokemon, or so they could be with their families, or so they could become stronger.

Although just like in the real world, there are those who go against the norm and abuse beings for their own profit.

 

[FourCartridge]

This webcomic strip pretty much sums up my view (and reaction to) of Team Plasma(Language Warning):
https://in-the-machine.deviantart.com/gallery/26905367#/d3b5jpq

 

[Hyrule]

I can kinda see where they would come from. They're kinda like Maxie/Team Magma and Archie/Team Aqua. Good intentions gone horribly wrong from pride and blind ignorance.

 

[Natural Harmonia Gropius]

I can kinda see where they would come from. They're kinda like Maxie/Team Magma and Archie/Team Aqua. Good intentions gone horribly wrong from pride and blind ignorance.

Well, Ghetsis had no good intentions, he was using Team Plasma as a front for world domination, and he was planning on using N as a puppet. Although for some reason he ends up helping the player after Team Plasma is disbanded. So maybe he's not totally evil?

Same for the Seven Sages. They seemed legit, then they revealed their true colors, then they end up helping the player. Although maybe it was because they were cornered and they figured that giving the player a gift would grant them some leniency. Or they did it out of respect for the prophecy (since the player is one of the two heroes)

 

[Axiom]

So, their theory is that people enslave Pokemon?
Despite the fact that, if the Pokemon was mistreated by you, the second you sent it out it could simply turn around and burn you/freeze you/drown you/eat you/squash you/steal your soul/poison you/etc?

I don't think people enslave Pokemon. Pokemon are people's partners- they get misused and abused, but not enslaved. They have loyalty which is more than can be said for most people, so no, they aren't enslaved. They love their trainers. And they follow them for that reason.

 

[Nick]

What a nice thread!

I actually strongly agree with their ideals, despite being someone who would probably be very much interested in becoming a gym leader if Pokémon were real. I hold a lot of belief that the ideals that they were spreading were very fair and reasonable, and I highly disliked Cheren when he responded to N sharing his opinion. I do disagree with their approach, and I think that if N was more aware of things and less of an anti-social soul, that things would be different. And if his father wasn't such a jerk... :|

I don't think Pokémon enjoy being caught, and fighting against other Pokémon until the point where they faint. If they had the ability to speak their thoughts clearly to you. I don't really view Plasma as an evil team or anything like that, either. I think they were purposely misguided by Geitis (or however you spell his name), but the grunts involved had pure intentions and were taught that the best way to handle it was to force it against others by stealing their Pokémon.