Chit-Chat: Back to the Grind(stone)

[JJ Styles]

???

okay, i officially didn't know what i was talking about. That video though.

I'd still pick the game up, why because it involves killing North Korean soldiers who are ripping our democratic heads off. I'd do it for MURICA! FOR FREEDOM! FOR DEMOCRACY!

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Speaking of Homefront Revolution Reviews: Here's a nice tagline to a review: Homefront: The Revolution boasts solid gameplay and impressive level design, but tonally it's a disaster.

is TONALLY a new word that I'm not aware of? Oh wait, he's trying to refer to the "Tone of the game" being a disaster. K.

I'll reserve everything at some other time, while we all enjoy some reading material aye Sunnyjims and Sunnyjills?

 

[ZetaZaku]

Guys, Satoshi is going to explode on us when he comes in here next. Explode.

Neptunia's Japanese voice cast is so damn BLAND, though. I can't imagine playing the games without Melissa Fahn sassing my ear off. I was so relieved when the anime got dubbed so I could watch it properly, too...

Also, I buggered my wrist up good and proper writing out a response to that thread...and I abridged it, too. I could have written a post three times that length. xD

You say bland when in fact it's voiced by mostly high tier VAs haha. I think the problem is more that the Japanese version of Neptunia is much more toned down than the dub. I mean sure you have Noire which has that generic tsundere voice in Japanese, but the other characters sound too normal. The dub really spices things up by giving their voices more personality and making them stand out, even if it's like a meme. Playing in Japanese is annoying though, since the script is too heavily altered anyway, so you're hearing one thing while reading a different thing. Makes Japanese audio pointless if you're not even listening to the right words.

Not even sure where I stand when it comes to Japanese audio vs English audio in games. I used to play everything in its original language, but recently I stopped caring and decided to give dubs a chance. In case of Nippon Ichi's games like Disgaea and ZHP Unlosing Rangers, I have to say the dub made the experience much better. Recent Tales of games seem to have decent dubs as well, so I stuck with the dub for Vesperia and Zestiria. Although one franchise I'll probably never ever play dubbed, and that's Final Fantasy. How FF13 managed to have a horrible dub despite having decent cast is a mystery. Even Troy Baker delivered his worst performance there. So Final Fantasy is a franchise where I'll gladly stick to the original audio.

 

[JJ Styles]

I don't want to trigger anyone regarding the whole SUB vs DUB issue since that issue itself is as polarizing as my RatedR life. *inb4slapped*. I tried to play (or at least watch someone) play Persona 4 in its Japanese voices and I felt that the English Dub was just much more immersive to me. I don't know jimmies and jillies. JP Rise doesn't sound as alluring, as seductive, and as lovingly adorable as ENG Rise. (because she totally is able to carry every desirable quality that every guy needs from a video game woman. Truly the Lovers Arcana wielder)

Of course, there are still more games meant to be played on its original JP audio. What are those games? well i think everyone already knows most of them so i don't have to point them out.

Guilty Gear XrD is the first in the GG series of games aside from Overture to receive an English Dub (i think, I hope i am right) and i actually found SOME of the voice deliveries in some characters to be off-par (Ramlethal ugh). But English Elphelt Valentine is so much fun to listen to. Oh and for those who play and have GGXRD, BEDMAN MUST BE PLAYED ON ENGLISH AUDIO. That is the Guilty Gear Bro code of this era.

Speaking of Elphelt Valentine: HERE'S MORE ELPHELT VALENTINE!

 

[pkmin3033]

Sure, why not, I'll delve into my thoughts about this in-depth again.

I have nothing against dual audio. But that's the thing - DUAL audio. Japanese voices should NEVER be given priority over English dubs, because it shows a lazy, incomplete localisation job when that happens. The whole point of localisation is to adapt a video game to make it understandable to Western audiences, and voice work is a huge part of that, because the vast majority do not speak Japanese.

It's not cultural censoring or whatever else, it's adaptation so that foreign culture can be communicated in a manner understandable to others outside of it. Purists can argue this all they like, but they defeat their own purpose solely by not being born Japanese. You will never truly understand it unless you are either born into it or spend years immersed in it; you can kid yourself all you like, but there it is. It's more than being able to read and speak the language; it's a way of life. The subtle nuances will be lost on you unless you are immersed in that life. If you want the original experience, you need to import the Japanese version. Simple as that. So there is no argument that English dubs, specifically, distort the experience. The experience is distorted the second the localisation process starts. These things do not translate properly.

Personal preference: I said Neptunia's Japanese voice cast is bland, because that is exactly how it sounds to me. Every Japanese voice cast sounds that way, regardless of how good or bad the English voice cast is. I don't speak Japanese, so the language is incomprehensible to me, and subtitles don't help matters: they can't convey the more subtle emotions, attitudes, or values. Just the words themselves. My interpretation of those words is going to be flawed based on this, so I prefer English dubs, so I know I fully understand the situation. I speak, read, and understand English. The same can be said of the majority of people who play niche titles. Japanese audio, if you're not Japanese, only gives you a partial experience, even if you can read and understand the words. Unless you have a full, innate grasp of the attitudes and values of Japanese culture, I would argue that you cannot truly understand Japanese audio.

I am not going to accept this argument from sub purists that "you buy these Japanese games knowing they're Japanese so you should put up with the Japanese audio" or whatever other logical fallacy is going to be thrown at me in response to that, because text and voice are both equally important to a video game experience. Japanese titles should all have proper localisation if they are brought to Western territories, and a proper localisation includes English dubbing. Whether that English dub is good or bad is a matter of personal taste, but it isn't automatically inferior just because it adapts the game to make it more understandable to Westerners. The two versions cannot be truly compared due to the cultural differences, and the idea that the original is always superior is, to me, laughable. But that's another topic entirely that I'm not going to get into at this point, because it's outside of the point I'm trying to make and it's 7 in the morning, good god.

...yeah, I spend too much time on Siliconera and Gematsu. The comments on there irk me. I don't advocate the removal of Japanese audio, so their advocating the removal of English audio seems selfish to me. We should be able to enjoy things however we choose. Simple as that.

 

[JJ Styles]

their advocating the removal of English audio seems selfish to me

That's pretty harsh and low to me as well. That kinda triggers me BUT WAIT. OH WAIT. I'm here to show LOVE, HUGGING YOUR NEIGHBORS, AND BEING A FRIEND TO ALL. So ladies and grunts:

Here's a picture of a puppy:
...

well i ran out of puppy pictures since the decent ones are not fit for VG DCC. so to compensate, let us all relax, think about ourselves, prevent any tilting and triggering and lets stare at this admirable picture of:

MECHA RAIKOU. Which totally looks like it may have came out of Zoids.

(PS you have valid points btw)

Okay jillies and jimmies. Every time we are tempted to argue about Dubs vs Subs again, think about the life of Mecha Raikou. Every time we think of starting some LEL arguements about Dubs vs Subs again that might result in unnecessary roasting, our chances of getting a Pokemon Spinoff game set in the Super Sci-Fi year of 2769 AD where people, pokemon, and mecha technology are the themes, will be long gone, and that Mecha Raikou will be gone as well.. Along with our chances of Half Life 3 and Left 4 Dead 3, and Lord Gaben being able to count the Number 3. :))))) (okay. i might be going way below but still)

Breathe people. Breathe.

Though i do agree that more efforts should be exerted in making sure that localizations are properly executed. And yes, the manner of dubs being bad is again of everyone's own tastes and preferences.

Its actually quite funny when English or Western games suddenly get localized in Japanese. The reverse is quite a story actually.

 

[machomuu]

Oh boy, Sub v. Dub talk! My favorite definitely. Here's this completely original, totally not written almost a year ago text version of how I feel about subbing and dubbing.

If you play a game or watch a show with subs or english-translated dialogue, unless you can actually understand what's being said or go raw, the "original creative vision" is lost on you. Sure, you can appreciate how things are said, but you can do the same with English. Hell, that's half the reason I watch dubs, to see the writing choices they've made, how they're executed, and how they attempt to tailor what they said, both in writing and in audio, to match what the original audio attempted to do for its audience.

Because, in the case of undubs, the script is still written for the dub, and in the case of subs you're still getting a translated script that in no way implies that it's being done faithfully. Plus, in the case of subs, unless they're done by a company or a studio, they'll be done by hobbyists who won't be able to contact the writers or the original production studio(s) for suggestions and checks. So really, unless you're going raw (or if you just plain understand what's being said), I'm not seeing how you even take advantage of the original writing.

I'm very much a fan of the writing process and the execution, which is why I enjoy subs and dubs equally. I'm no particular stranger to either of the two, though it'd be impossible for me to say I've watched as many subs as I have dubs.

There are various cons to each. With subs there's having to look down to see the subs (not always a problem, especially if you're watching on a computer or the subbers are courteous enough not to drop paragraph bombs on you) and subbers can get super liberal when trying to match the words to the mood (My favorite examples include "Tits McGee" and "What the shit", the latter translating "Nandayo"). With dubs there's a smaller pool of voice actors and Bryce Papenbrook exists. They each have their problems, but for me it's also in their specific charms that I can gravitate towards one or the other.

For instance, I couldn't watch Steins;Gate in English because Okabe's laugh and his overall voice don't match his personality as much, Mayuuri can't "Tuturu", and Makise's a cynical asshole. But on the flipside, they managed to make a joke where Okabe speaks English to a guy equally as funny in English- though in the case of the former it's because of Okabe and in the latter it's because of the response.

Then there're shows like Cowboy Bebop where the Westernisms get me in English, Yu Yu Hakusho where the dub does a much better job of portraying the main character than the sub/original does (Excel Saga's first Excel does this, too), and B Gata H Kei, where the euphemisms are colorfully delightful.

But in gaming and anime, I've always been huge on examining the various parts (art, animation, writing, music, etc) of how a production is made, so I can certainly respect where you're coming from and, hell, I don't completely disagree with you. I'm not a purist by any sense but I'd be lying if I wasn't interested in the same thing. It's just that I'm big on the adaptation process so it's just something else for me to enjoy in dubs (though, again, I hold them in the same regard as subs, albeit for various different reasons). Then there are older dubs like Those Who Hunt Elves which is so liberal (though less liberal than, say, Pokemon or Samurai Pizza Cats) that it's far more enjoyable than the original. It's the variety of the various dubs, subs, voices, and overall writing choices that I just love about Japanese games and anime. It's fun.

Similarly, I don't particularly have anything against those who don't like subs- I can understand the reasons for such and, generally I don't mind, but these ideas that all dubs are bad or that they betray the original meaning of the work, those bother me because the former...well, if you think that I'd imagine you just had a bad first impression, since the idea that all dubs (or even most) are bad is pretty obtuse. In the case of the latter, well, I've already spoken on that twice on this page, and I honestly don't get where the notion comes from except for, possibly, older anime where dubbers could get as literal as they liked. Altogether, though, these notions just seem dated and inaccurate. Like what you like, but don't rag on something you haven't actually experienced.

Let it be known that I did not just stitch together 2 posts that I made in the past, in a thread that still exists, even, and post them because I found that they were still relevant. That would be ridiculous.

---

So as for what really has me today

https://store.steampowered.com/app/409870

Fuck these guys. I HAAAATE them. I love this game so much, and now I'm gonna buy it for the fourth goddamn time. Why can't they just let me live in peace...

Really, though, as long as it's a port of Hermuda Triangle and fixes the lag that the PSP version had in the hubworld, I'll buy the hell out of this. I've been looking for an excuse to play it again, and there'd be no better one than the chance at playing a definitive version :q

 

[pkmin3033]

Phantom Brave again. I want Makai Kingdom and Soul Nomad, damnit! Also La Pucelle. Preferably for PS4, but if they came out on Steam I'd snap them up in a heartbeat.

I don't mind re-buying these games (now there is a potential topic...let me stew on it for a bit) but I wish they'd let me get the ones I really want..

 

[JJ Styles]

Checking at Phantom Brave's PC requirements:

MINIMUM:
OS: Windows 7/8/10
Processor: Intel Core2 Quad Q9300 2.5 GHz
Memory: 2 GB RAM
Graphics: Radeon HD 5450

Well definitely possible given those requirements. Most laptops these days have those 2.5GHz processors and a Radeon HD 5450 is dirt cheap and probably is in other people's lappys.

Ya'll don't need an NVIDIA 9069 video card to run the game amirite? That's for your delicious AAA titles coming out this year :3

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So I'm playing Quake 2 again, thanks to some warez that i randomly found, and I tried playing it on Hard like I usually do with my idsoftware games and dear lord I'm so out of practice. I forgot how Quake 2 worked so I was getting my butt kicked. Unlike classic Doom, Quake 2's enemies are far stronger than the player and move just as fast (unlike in classic Doom where the monsters are usually slower), even the basic of grunts take a beating before dying, and in Hard, not only are they numerous, they are also less prone to pain chance or getting hit stunned. And getting them staggered by firing lead on them is one of the key things in killing those Stroggs, especially those upper tier Strogg enemies.

TLDR: Quake 2 is actually quite challenging on Hard difficulty.

 

[machomuu]

Yeah, it shouldn't take much to run. Considering it went from PS2 to Wii to PSP, it should be pretty budget PC-safe.

In a perfect world, we'd have a current platform English ports of La Pucelle: Ragnarok or Makai Kingdom Portable. No way they'd want to shell out the five dollars it'd take to dub the new content (and I'd truly hope they wouldn't do the sleazy thing and leave it unvoiced just because). But ports of their currently translated versions would be neat, too.

Except for Soul Nomad. Apparently that doesn't exist.

 

[pkmin3033]

ZHP could use a re-release, too. That was an unsung hero of the PSP era. I really wish I hadn't sold my copy of Hexzyz Force, too...that game is like gold dust now. So many good PSP titles, and none of them available for current generation consoles...

...and FFXII. I'm not going to let that go until I get an HD remaster or re-release with trophies.

 

[EC]

So apparently 2K came out and said every game that is coming from them this year has already been announced.

So either they are bluffing and the Bioshock Collection that was rated/had official boxart leaked is still coming this year, or they are pushing it to 2017... at which point I won't be interested.

 

[JJ Styles]

I'd want to have some of dat Bioshock, some nice Big Daddy and Little Sister interaction, and I'd play all of them, the original up to the latest and see where the appeal comes from.

I'll be a lil positive and hope that the collection will come out with the usual: BioShock, BioShock 2, BioShock Infinite, and all of the DLCs from the games.

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it kinda doesn't help that my Facebook feed is full of my IRL contacts and friends throwing Overwatch left and right, OH RIGHT since the game will be out tomorrow. HYPPPPPPPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!? Well sorta.. but as always i need to save... getting DOOM a few weeks ago against massive odds (RL stuff + loads of people buying) was still quite a journey.

And to help me relax, i was playing some PKMN White 2 since its all i had to play for the past 2 nights.

 

[pkmin3033]

I'd like a Bioshock collection, if only so I have an excuse to play the games again. Gives me something else to do between now and Dishonored 2, the next first-person game I plan on buying...in November. God damnit.

 

[Judge Mandolore Shepard]

When it comes to the BioShock games, I happen to have all three of them, so I don't need a BioShock Collection. As for games I am waiting to come out, well I am certainly looking forward to Lego Star Wars The Force Awakens next month. Other than that, I still have a long wait until November for Pokemon Sun and Moon to come out.

 

[EC]

Just bought Hitman: GO on sale on the PlayStation store today. Can't wait to dive in to the puzzling sometime this week.

 

[JJ Styles]

GIANTBOMB MADE A REVIEW THAT MADE SENSE! WHOOOOOOOOOOOO!!! Obviously thanks to Chameleon for sharing the link in the appropriate thread. And its the first of a few online reviews that I actually would agree on ;)

Speaking of it, the gaming world really needs more protags who could easily agree with all of us: "**** YOUR OVERLY SERIOUS STORY! LESS STORY! MORE MURDER!" A certain space marine certainly told it as wordlessly as he could. I really find it humorous when I'm playing a game, and then the game is like "please immerse yourself in this story that we're supposed to take seriously. Do you feel the gravity of it all?" and i'm like "NO! SMASH EVERYTHING! SCREAM LIKE A MAN!". I wonder if any eastern game had a protag like that.... hmmm... lemee check with google.

Well i need to continue my playthrough of Quake 2 on Hard mode so that i can get my lovely dose of arse whooping, while making sure that I don't get my own d**k torn off.

 

[pkmin3033]

The merits of story vs. no story...that'd make an interesting discussion.

I don't mind a good story...but that's the thing, I don't mind a GOOD story. Finding one of those in a serious JRPG these days is extremely uncommon, as writers seem to think that overloading us with tween drama, obscure terminology and world-shattering event cutscenes makes for a good story. It doesn't. The appeal of those things a few generations ago was that the exposition was weaved expertly into the narrative, rather than dumped on us all at once and then ignored, expecting us to pick up the pieces. It's like someone up-ends a 1000 piece jigsaw onto your head.

This isn't to say good storytelling is dead - I could rattle off a half dozen examples right now if I were of a mind to - but it IS becoming increasingly uncommon. Especially in series like the Tales series that recycle the hell of plot elements and just swap the characters around.

 

[JJ Styles]

Trigger Warning: I'm not drunk enough to make sense so this might be an incoherant rant about the whole Game + Story issue

it still depends on the whole genre. Like if is an RPG, then a great well written and gravitational Story really makes it all worth. Its what most of us grew up with. But then again, people have been finding ways to freshen up the scene. Shin Megami Tensei is like great and all but i do have to admit that the whole Order (aka god and heaven is evulz) vs Chaos (aka I wrote Lucifer and demons to be a lil less evulz) issue that the SMT series have is kinda getting repetitive to me. As for Persona, well I have a lot of good things to say about why Persona is awesome but I'll have mercy for the post limit D:

But if its an action game that focuses more on raw action then at times "the overly serious story with loads of Dialogue" somewhat makes me feel like i wanna smash the skip button at times. I mean, in DOOM 2016, the game basically is all about "Shooting demons in Mars" but its cut with some scenes of dialogue that like really interrupts all of the action (which may be helpful for some people who need to relax a bit after an action sequence), but the Doom Marine is like "**** YOUR DIALOGUE! SMASH EVERYTHING" which i find really humorous and so cleverly put in, as if the Doomguy was agreeing with most of the people while those NPCs with dialogues are under the Doomguy's mercy and rage since many of the game's cutscenes basically end with the Doomguy smashing a TV or an electronic device after a long non-action sequence. Those long dialogue scenes do not really ruin the game however, since i've mentioned before that some people who play these kinds of action games do need their rest, especially for those playing in Ultraviolence mode. But dear lord at least have the dang courtesy to have a skip button. But that's a challenge for something that is basically a revival from the classic good ole days of mindless action that was the 90s to our more modern world where most people (who aren't me) have outgrown the whole "mindless supermurder of olde" thing.

Then again, I don't mind having an overly serious or at least serviceable story in an action game. I mean, I've mentioned previously that Borderlands 1 has a more believable tone than the Clown fiesta that is Borderlands 2. Sorry kiddies, i mean Handsome Jack is handsome but even he can't carry the game's overly silly story (Is this going to be part of the drinking game? me mentioning Borderlands along with WolfTNO and whatever else i like mentioning all the time XD). There's games like Wolfenstein The New Order which is basically one of the best examples of a good story + action game that mixes in quite nicely. (and i bet it becomes a drinking game here in daily chat when i mention WolfTNO as like one of my best examples of a game that appeals like both the old generation of meat hungry meatheads like myself and the newer generation of the more critical and analytical people) Then again Wolf TNO is such a great game that it deserves all of its praise and the attention it got from its time.

And then there's Metal Gear Rising Revengeance. I had to admit, actually thought that this game was going to be quite a serious one with the way it tries to present itself as "THE RAIDEN SPINOFF GAME THAT THE MGS PLAYERBASE MAY HAVE WANTED" along with some hot sexy high frequency blade hack and slashing. I actually like MGRR's story (inb4shotbyMGSpuristswiththeirFAMASSES). I feel like I can sympathize with Raiden and understand many of the analogies, symbolisms, and philosophical discussions on War, Humanity, and whatnot that MGRR tries to uncover. Oh god, is that him!? is that me!?

Then there's Duke Nukem Forever which unlike our previously mentioned vidya games, DNF somehow manages to make even DUKE NUKEM look bad not just in the gameplay, but also in the eyes of the more modern age of people. I mean sure, I'd still find Duke's jokes funny like how it was in Duke Nukem 3D, but for some reason in DNF, who ever wrote Duke's character in said game feels like he forgot what made Duke funny in the first place for a wider audience. I dunno. Then again, my mentioning of DNF is already beyond the argument of "Story vs Supermurder" where I'm pointing out how people would argue that Duke in DNF feels more like a 13 year old Internet Troll than the badass muthawisecraking action hero that we all loved in the 90s.. Rest in pepperonis our hopes of a proper Duke Nukem game for the modern age.

Then there's fighting games where its rare to actually find a series that has a story that's actually quite a mouthful to follow. Blazblue manages to be one of those games that made me care about its in-game lore. And then there was Tekken which could have been something interesting. Street Fighter.. well, the fact that SF3 is treated as the "last period" in its fictional chronological timeline and SF5 is more of a PRE-SEQUEL, it being a sequel to SF4, which is a prequel to SF3. OH GOD. Please readers, i hope you are able to absorb all of this.

I mean, we've all been there. For most of us at least. We came from basically playing games that made no sense whatsoever, then to playing something without any hint of back story, then we started playing games with such rich and beautiful character development and story writing, then we also have the unfortunate roadblocks of classic characters trying to integrate themselves in the more modern world (Like Duke and DNF Failing, but Doomguy and DOOM 2016 succeeding). Its such a beauty in the world of interactive fictional media that is Video Games VS the playerbase's ever changing preferences and tastes. I love it.

I dunno what the F**k I'm talking about.

 

[Sir Codin]

But I don't think BethSoftworks will learn from their mistakes because I'm obviously an RPGCodex troll. I love being smug and stuck-up, I love making 24-paragraph tangents about how much Real-Time-With-Pause sucks, I appreciate dark and cynical roleplaying games where life sucks for everyone and none of it will ever get better, I have tremendously high standards because everything has to be perfect or else it's not worth my money and this makes me a hypocrite because in the same breath I'll also call Arcanum an "under-appreciated gem," I refuse to give praise to highly advertised games...or just in general; I refuse to give praise to games in general because if I did I would get crucified on 4chan's /v/-board and it's super important to stay on the good side of THOSE people....so yeah.

Sometimes I'm just so proud of the things I write. XD

 

[JJ Styles]

Dang it, now i need to find more of my past posts in other messageboards where i could simply say that i had "I dunno what the feck I'm talking about" or "I did know what the f I was talking about"

I'm so tempted to get Gears of War Ultimate Edition for my hot new PC with a Win 10 OS once its done. Oh man, DOOM and GEARS. Too much testosterone. Oh wait, no. There is never too much testosterone. There should always be more testosterone on everyone's gaming rig.