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Bait and Sweep

Archer said:
I run Extrasensory... Its great for Mixape and Machamp Leads.

U-Turn is only there for scouting. It can deal a bit of damage to particular pokes (HAI CELEBI!!), but that's all. I think it can learn Ancient Power...
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That's all fine and dandy, besides the fact Heatran's the one who's leading. And the pure utility of U-Turn is enough to make it a staple on the set (not to mention lack of a better move heh). Ancient Power is just silly, when Thunderbolt hits much much harder even when neutral.

The team looks solid in my eyes. Good job.
 
Yeah, Ancientpower isn't the best option. Extrasensory is a good choice BB, as I've stated previously. It gives you a non Scarfgar revenge killer, but also works well against DD LO Gyarados. It DD's as you switch to Zapdos, and you're like 'ohai, meet mai T-Bolt' :x

For Heatran, I think the main attraction of HP ICE is revenge killing Garchomp...but it's not on the suspect ladder. Why not run Grass or Electric? I don't like the idea of Stealth Rock on it tbh. I know it's been used by people, but if you outspeed a Gengar lead first up, they will know you've got scarf, and if you SR...well, you switch to your Gengar counter, and they switch to something that counters common Gengar counters. You're on the back foot.

IMO, Fire Blast/Earth Power/HP Grass or Electric/Dragon Pulse

~T_S
 
Tortured_Soul said:
Yeah, Ancientpower isn't the best option. Extrasensory is a good choice BB, as I've stated previously. It gives you a non Scarfgar revenge killer, but also works well against DD LO Gyarados. It DD's as you switch to Zapdos, and you're like 'ohai, meet mai T-Bolt' :x

For Heatran, I think the main attraction of HP ICE is revenge killing Garchomp...but it's not on the suspect ladder. Why not run Grass or Electric? I don't like the idea of Stealth Rock on it tbh. I know it's been used by people, but if you outspeed a Gengar lead first up, they will know you've got scarf, and if you SR...well, you switch to your Gengar counter, and they switch to something that counters common Gengar counters. You're on the back foot.

IMO, Fire Blast/Earth Power/HP Grass or Electric/Dragon Pulse

~T_S
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Well, you should have seen me yesterday I was throwing around Thundershocks! :D (Stupid shoddy buttons so frea-- Uh, nevermind)

Salamence and Dragonite run wild on the suspect ladder, so HP [Ice] wasn't just for Garchomp, anyway. But I've been testing HPs and such. They've notably been effective to dent Vaporeon switching in and such, setting up other sweeps on it yadayada.

As for SR, I'd rather have it instead. Works just fine, and SR support really does help Luke ensure OHKOs late game, helps out with Gyarados and friends, you know, yadayada. I'll admit Extrasensory has done better then expected, but I'll keep testing.

So far through testing... Heracross has probably been the weakest link, just to note~
 
I didn't see the point of MoP Cross from the start, it didn't seem to fit. Lucario is your clean-up speed sweeper, why not Choice Band, or go for something that doesn't need to set-up? Two SD'ers on a team i've tried to avoid more times than not.
 
well Garchmp and Deoxys-S... no I'm kidding I'm not going down that road. I think though that your team while somewhat solid could benefit from a Defensive Walling force. Since you really like the offensive style of play, then go with something like mixpert or Gliscor.

I guess that's it the only other thing I wanted to say is that if everything you posted is true, then I'm impressed. Getting the Nature you want, I assume the IVs you want and the appropriate Hidden Power takes alot of patience. I don't have a lot of that so nobody on my team has hidden power. I tried for Jirachi and gave up within a few hours.

Also, I'll like to bring up that while I am a Heracross fan, 'm not too wild about your moveset. It's an odd one so it will catch your opponents off guard, but obviously your objective for his moveset is to bring him down to that 1/3rd HP. But while you're throwing up those substitutes and such, Heracross is fairly fragile and pretty slow so watch out that a faster sweeper packing a super-effective move doesn't come in and KO it.
 
Romo_Owens said:
well Garchmp and Deoxys-S... no I'm kidding I'm not going down that road. I think though that your team while somewhat solid could benefit from a Defensive Walling force. Since you really like the offensive style of play, then go with something like mixpert or Gliscor.
No. Offensive teams work by revenging anything that becomes an issue.

 I guess that's it the only other thing I wanted to say is that if everything you posted is true, then I'm impressed. Getting the Nature you want, I assume the IVs you want and the appropriate Hidden Power takes alot of patience. I don't have a lot of that so nobody on my team has hidden power. I tried for Jirachi and gave up within a few hours.
Hence why people play Shoddy...
Also, I'll like to bring up that while I am a Heracross fan, 'm not too wild about your moveset. It's an odd one so it will catch your opponents off guard, but obviously your objective for his moveset is to bring him down to that 1/3rd HP. But while you're throwing up those substitutes and such, Heracross is fairly fragile and pretty slow so watch out that a faster sweeper packing a super-effective move doesn't come in and KO it.
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That set could work wonders, but it just seems not quite right. It's also doing pretty much the same thing as Lucario, with similar coverage. Shouldn't hurt to drop it altogether...
 
Tortured_Soul said:
I didn't see the point of MoP Cross from the start, it didn't seem to fit. Lucario is your clean-up speed sweeper, why not Choice Band, or go for something that doesn't need to set-up? Two SD'ers on a team i've tried to avoid more times than not.
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Yeah, I'll probably give Choice Band a run. :) Or if something fits better over Heracross?

Romo_Owens said:
well Garchmp and Deoxys-S... no I'm kidding I'm not going down that road. I think though that your team while somewhat solid could benefit from a Defensive Walling force. Since you really like the offensive style of play, then go with something like mixpert or Gliscor.

I guess that's it the only other thing I wanted to say is that if everything you posted is true, then I'm impressed. Getting the Nature you want, I assume the IVs you want and the appropriate Hidden Power takes alot of patience. I don't have a lot of that so nobody on my team has hidden power. I tried for Jirachi and gave up within a few hours.

Also, I'll like to bring up that while I am a Heracross fan, 'm not too wild about your moveset. It's an odd one so it will catch your opponents off guard, but obviously your objective for his moveset is to bring him down to that 1/3rd HP. But while you're throwing up those substitutes and such, Heracross is fairly fragile and pretty slow so watch out that a faster sweeper packing a super-effective move doesn't come in and KO it.
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Well, this team is on Shoddy, of course. Getting the proper natures and Hidden Powers is rather like a flick of the switch. (Well, not so easy for legends, but still. XD) Yeah, that's the problem, while I'd love to set up and rampage, it's just not really fitting. =/ Instant impact with Choice Band doesn't sound bad, I'll definitely give that a go, or look for a replacement for Heracross altogether.

Thanks, Romo_Owens. :D
 
Well, as I did say, CBLax is potent yet provides a very decent Special tanking force. You could try it over Heracross. It shores up the special defensive side, and Salamence is decent enough with Intimidate and resistences to work over physical. Just a thought.

(btw, CB STAB Selfdestruct is nothing to sneeze at...)

~T_S
 
max out speed evs on heatran and give it specs it will hurt more
since your using stealth rock and are going to get hit in the first turn it doesnt matter
if you outspeed or not
 
dark_seeker said:
max out speed evs on heatran and give it specs it will hurt more
since your using stealth rock and are going to get hit in the first turn it doesnt matter
if you outspeed or not
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...Losing scarf decreases the effectiveness of the team, first off. Revenge killing, and numerous others, T_S even mentioned a few. Think about the impacts to a team before rating. :/ I'm just going to ignore that option honestly, as I don't see at all how that improves the team, when ScarfTran works wonders. Couples with others in the team to take down the ever-so-common Lucario who's everywhere on the suspect ladder. While Specstran fails to touch Lucario.

As for your suggestions, Aquilae and T_S, I'll test them out tomorrow. Thanks for the suggestions. :)
 
BeachBoy said:
Yeah, I'll probably give Choice Band a run. :) Or if something fits better over Heracross?



Well, this team is on Shoddy, of course. Getting the proper natures and Hidden Powers is rather like a flick of the switch. (Well, not so easy for legends, but still. XD) Yeah, that's the problem, while I'd love to set up and rampage, it's just not really fitting. =/ Instant impact with Choice Band doesn't sound bad, I'll definitely give that a go, or look for a replacement for Heracross altogether.

Thanks, Romo_Owens. :D
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If you're looking for a replacement why not try Weavile? It's one of the best revenge killers around and since it's so fast and packs one hell of a punch, it could probably help make some slack on your team to get rid of at least one Scarf user and replace it with Life Orb or Expert Belt.

Or, another replacement (I'm going to get a lot of noise for this) I'm thinking Electivire. Hear me out though. With a fully offensive team, your opponents are going to try to shut you down with walls. And one of the primary functions of walls are status attacks, most notably, Thunder Wave. You're going to have Blissey and other T-Wave users in your hair trying to destroy your sweeping attempt and by getting rid of Heracross, you have nobody that can afford to take a T-Wave. That's when Electivire comes in, takes a Motor Drive boost and sets up for a sweep.

Also, I'd suggest sub/reversal/Stone Edge/Megahorn/Salac Berry for Heracross, but with Hippowdon and Tyranitar running around all over the place and Lucario having the moveset to pull off the same thing with a bonus of Sandstorm resistance, it's more of a novelty than a valid option.
 
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