Dying?

[~Teh Panda~]

Must... Drag... Attention.. Away... From... Sienna...

I think my hack can compete with Sienna, I just need a bit more time to make others realise the same thing :3

Okay, then put in as much effort as Harry to pushing it out instead of just saying how it can compete with it. Prove it. Personally after looking at your hack then looking at Sienna. I feel Sienna is without a doubt the better of the two...

Now back to the main point. I was just stating an example. ;P

 

[altariaking]

Must... Drag... Attention.. Away... From... Sienna...

I think my hack can compete with Sienna, I just need a bit more time to make others realise the same thing :3

Man I can't wait for the beta 3 of this to come out.. I'm not even sure my hack can even compare to yours Manipulation.

I mean SERIOUSLY, LOOK AT THAT WATER O_O

I think the OP is...kinda right. Kinda. There are a lot of hacks there that I really enjoy, and a lot that just really bore me (that goes for the showcase too). BUT! It is possible that a lot of hackers could be trying to hide most of the storyline and such, as they may want the player to find out for him/her self.

 

[Planetes.]

I haven't played sienna because I don't want to download Winrar or one of those rar opener programs that give you viruses and are annoyinh but I'll say I had a pretty fun time playing Rijon Adventures and Turquoise.
Honestly, I think Rom Hacking has lost some of its populace to Game Development as there is more room for creation in Game Dev. I mean look at Torzach, potential as an All-Star HACK, now where is it? The Game Development Showcase. That's where.

 

[psychicboy]

I think the OP is...kinda right. Kinda. There are a lot of hacks there that I really enjoy, and a lot that just really bore me (that goes for the showcase too). BUT! It is possible that a lot of hackers could be trying to hide most of the storyline and such, as they may want the player to find out for him/her self.

Lol. Just because I want to sompete with Sienna, doesn't mean I don't want to play it :/ I guess I should of changed my words a bit.

 

[Logan]

I haven't played sienna because I don't want to download Winrar or one of those rar opener programs that give you viruses and are annoyinh but I'll say I had a pretty fun time playing Rijon Adventures and Turquoise.
Honestly, I think Rom Hacking has lost some of its populace to Game Development as there is more room for creation in Game Dev. I mean look at Torzach, potential as an All-Star HACK, now where is it? The Game Development Showcase. That's where.

This post makes me go 'what? o_O' like seriously. Torzach was nowhere near an all-star hack. It had a few pretty good fakemon and some average maps. It had no progress whatsoever worth noting scripting wise.

Anyway, I hate this argument completely. As far as I'm concerned ROM Hacking is getting better and better daily. Everyone who says 'bro ROM hacking is dying and needs to get better' is trying to hide their own inadequacies by pointing the blame at others.

...now, that's just my opinion and has been ever since people started this argument.

 

[icychill66]

Here is my opinion on the subject, and a thoughtful idea:

If you define "dying" as "the overall quality of hacks is diminishing", then I would agree that it is dying. However, if you define it as "the popularity of hacking is dying", then I would disagree, and I think it's awesome that there are a ton of people learning to hack! I first came to PC about 7 months ago, (I think?) and the hacking scene has changed a little since I've been around. Today, there seems to be many more new hacks being created which suggests that people are extremely interested in hacking. At the same time, I think most of these people don't know what they're getting into, and this results in a generic hack that dies after little time. I was guilty of this when I first joined PC. I had read around this forum without becoming a member, and then I thought it would be awesome to make my own starting hack and post it for everyone to see! To my dismay, I quickly discovered that it takes a lot more work than I expected, and my first attempt died. Now, I have put together a much better hack simply because I gathered myself and did a lot of experimenting and learning.

My proposition:

Perhaps, to solve this problem of the great number of "blah" hacks, ROM hackers of this community should form like 10 primary teams of hackers (just throwing a number out there). Each team would create a hack of its own, of course. We could also balance the number of experienced, and intermediate skilled hackers on each team. This way, each team would be capable of producing a high-quality hack, would it not? Everyone would feel included, too. This would eliminate the ridiculous number of team threads, and stop people from joining more than one team. When people join that many teams, they're work can become low-quality and inefficient. In theory, this system would transform the high number of low-quality hacks into a low number of high-quality hacks!

Here's the way I view a community system like this:

The Good:
This system would eliminate the number of "blah" hacks, and ensure that we are creating high-quality hacks as a community. It could create a better sense of synergy throughout the PC ROM hackers. People will learn more from each other because you will always be connected to your team which will have all levels of hackers in it. The very unorganized system of the "Team Discussions" threads will become organized.

The Bad:
Naturally, people want to start they're own hacks, and they won't want to work in a big team. It could be difficult to coordinate teams. It would be hard to determine who gets to be in charge of teams.


So what do you think? I am having a hard time coming up with "the bad" simply because I thought of the idea, and it's hard to think of bad things for ideas you come up with... Anyway, let's discuss this.

 

[Quilava's Master]

This post makes me go 'what? o_O' like seriously. Torzach was nowhere near an all-star hack. It had a few pretty good fakemon and some average maps. It had no progress whatsoever worth noting scripting wise.

Anyway, I hate this argument completely. As far as I'm concerned ROM Hacking is getting better and better daily. Everyone who says 'bro ROM hacking is dying and needs to get better' is trying to hide their own inadequacies by pointing the blame at others.

...now, that's just my opinion and has been ever since people started this argument.

I disagree. I'm not hiding any inadequacies because I don't feel like theres any aspect of hacking I try that I'm inadequate at. If I try to implement it, I do it the best I can, if i don't think I can do it 100% , I don't do it at all, simple as that. Also, I don't know how often you look over the progressing hacks section but anyone can see that compared to 2007/2008 the quality of hacks is WAY down.

 

[Banjora Marxvile]

I disagree. I'm not hiding any inadequacies because I don't feel like theres any aspect of hacking I try that I'm inadequate at. If I try to implement it, I do it the best I can, if i don't think I can do it 100% , I don't do it at all, simple as that. Also, I don't know how often you look over the progressing hacks section but anyone can see that compared to 2007/2008 the quality of hacks is WAY down.

Yeah, because people are rushing, and there is no Scrapbox for their ideas to be evaluated. People are rushing to get in the Progressing Hacks, hence why quality is low to begin.

 

[NiKaNoRoU]

Yeah, because people are rushing, and there is no Scrapbox for their ideas to be evaluated. People are rushing to get in the Progressing Hacks, hence why quality is low to begin.

You're most correct here. I'm one of those people. Let's take my hack for example. As co-owner, you know best of anyone else above what happened, and the rom has been problematic. However, I rushed an update (which caused no attention whatsoever) without clearing the rom yet. And that's wrong. Fake update is fake. And after that I really hated myself, and therefore decided to not do anything like that again.
So I started a new hack lately and will keep stuff about it sheer up until I REALLY have progress to show. I'll be doing everything alone, and moving slowly, for the sake of quality and not quantity. People like Spherical Ice and hacks like Azure Horizons show those exact traces of clarity in ROM Hacking. Anyway, end of rant.


OT: What I think is dying is time for hackers to do their hobby. Most of us who started earlier realize after some time that they have less and less time to work on their precious hacks. And that's how my cookie crumbles. I'm one limited git in this situation.

Finally, about SiennaL I think it's the best hack showcased for 2010 so far (not the best of all times, though, sorry) and I'm even happier about Harry and Max because I see they do things about their hacks that others don't: they get deeper than deep, outsaide the box, and even though the original nintendo formula is maintained, I don't give a brownie whether it's original or not, in that case. It's one hell of a jewel-in-the-rough-box and it's certainly good to play.

Have fun trying to be picky, everyone.

 

[~Teh Panda~]

Maybe mods could be less lenient on hacks they let in to the progressing section. Some hacks there are complete and utter pieces of *bad word*. No offense to any of these hacks authors but they should not post them so fast and work on getting them ready. Maybe some more rules should be implemented in order to help siphon out some of these hacks with low quality. Also maybe its just me but standards have changed. I remember in '07 that I was new and every hacked looked awesome since the seen was way different, and I mean waaaayyyy different. Hackers were either in the know or outcasted scrapbox thread creators. Hacks which "made it" had to have some skills and mods then just said no when they felt a hack did not deserve to be recognized. (meaning that they new quality from others...). Also there was NO progressing hacks section meaning you had to have quality to get it moved up, you had to have progress and you had to have skill.

Times have changed though and on this site there are indeed still good hacks. Just look around. :)

 

[Alice]

How about a hack rating system? We could have a "New Hacks" section, and every time a new hack is posted there, everyone who sees the thread will vote, and if it receives a score of say... 5/10 or higher, after a decent amount of votes, it will be moved to progressing hacks. If the score is less than 5/10, the thread will be closed, and whoever made the thread can repost it after 3 days. This gives them plenty of time to think about what's wrong with the hack, and will keep that section of the forums from being flooded with repeat hacks that haven't been improved upon enough.



I think this idea would actually work really well. What are the mods' opinions on this? You'd have to make it so every thread in that section automatically has a poll for us to vote 1-10 on the hack though, or just make the poll a specific part of the posting guidelines.

 

[Tomackze]

The main one I see for "dying" is that many hacks are not being finished... either people run out of ideas or can not figure out how to fix an existing problem.

I don't think the quality is diminishing by any means...

 

[chrunch]

Perhaps, to solve this problem of the great number of "blah" hacks, ROM hackers of this community should form like 10 primary teams of hackers (just throwing a number out there). Each team would create a hack of its own, of course. We could also balance the number of experienced, and intermediate skilled hackers on each team. This way, each team would be capable of producing a high-quality hack, would it not? Everyone would feel included, too. This would eliminate the ridiculous number of team threads, and stop people from joining more than one team. When people join that many teams, they're work can become low-quality and inefficient. In theory, this system would transform the high number of low-quality hacks into a low number of high-quality hacks!

I doubt this would work. Remember, there are a LOT of people who want
to make their own hack. I definitely don't want a team. I want to do ROM
hacking myself, for example, and I'm sure there's a lot more people who want to do that.
I don't think It'd work. D:

 

[Banjora Marxvile]

How about a hack rating system? We could have a "New Hacks" section, and every time a new hack is posted there, everyone who sees the thread will vote, and if it receives a score of say... 5/10 or higher, after a decent amount of votes, it will be moved to progressing hacks. If the score is less than 5/10, the thread will be closed, and whoever made the thread can repost it after 3 days. This gives them plenty of time to think about what's wrong with the hack, and will keep that section of the forums from being flooded with repeat hacks that haven't been improved upon enough.



I think this idea would actually work really well. What are the mods' opinions on this? You'd have to make it so every thread in that section automatically has a poll for us to vote 1-10 on the hack though, or just make the poll a specific part of the posting guidelines.

I disagree. Too many cooks spoil the broth, so having only 10 with tons of hackers = no good, and there are bound to be huge disagreements. Also what chrunch said.

To be honest, I think having a "Brainstorming" section instead of a thread would kinda help, buut it brings us back to what the Scrapbox created - tons of SPAM threads. And even less quality. But then people would have a thread that had rated ideas, and criticism before being posted as a proper hack, so they can easily improve their ideas from the start, instead of making something with poor quality and releasing that straight away.

 

[Resultz]

Maybe once a Thread is approved by mods, let the community have a chance to approve it, and if not then it gets closed and can be re-submitted when the hacker fels ready, that cuts ouut the spam, and lets everyone have a say.

 

[Mab]

I really agree, it will minimize the amount of spamhacks out there.

 

[Spherical Ice]

Surely that'd just be giving the members moderator powers? If the members are (hypothetically) knowledgeable enough to know what should an shouldn't be accepted (don't get me wrong, I'm not saying some of us don't), surely they would've have been noticed and modded?

Anyway, I don't think the hacking scene is dying at all. I just think people are rushing in and want the fame more than anything. If people don't spend some time working before posting there hacks, maybe we'll have a nicer selection. Perhaps a rule in which progress up to, say, the first gym, or the equivalent (say, 10% progress?), it can be approved. I dunno if that'd be pushing the restrictions of Progressing Hacks so much so that it's the Hacks Showcase, but, I'm not sure. Any suggestions with the Scrapbox or something similar will most probably be ignored by the way, because it was failure (not trying to talk on behalf of the moderators, mind).

 

[Mab]

Surely that'd just be giving the members moderator powers? If the members are (hypothetically) knowledgeable enough to know what should an shouldn't be accepted (don't get me wrong, I'm not saying some of us don't), surely they would've have been noticed and modded?

Anyway, I don't think the hacking scene is dying at all. I just think people are rushing in and want the fame more than anything. If people don't spend some time working before posting there hacks, maybe we'll have a nicer selection. Perhaps a rule in which progress up to, say, the first gym, or the equivalent (say, 10% progress?), it can be approved. I dunno if that'd be pushing the restrictions of Progressing Hacks so much so that it's the Hacks Showcase, but, I'm not sure. Any suggestions with the Scrapbox or something similar will most probably be ignored by the way, because it was failure (not trying to talk on behalf of the moderators, mind).

I guess you're kinda right, it, it would be better if people stopped rushing and worked on thei're hacks more.

 

[Resultz]

to be fair the showcase should be for COMPLETED hacks, as its a showcase.. although that will never happen, But Spherical Ice, your idea was probably best.

either way, i wasnt saying give the Members moderator powers, because the mods would have the first say.

 

[Banjora Marxvile]

Surely that'd just be giving the members moderator powers? If the members are (hypothetically) knowledgeable enough to know what should an shouldn't be accepted (don't get me wrong, I'm not saying some of us don't), surely they would've have been noticed and modded?

Anyway, I don't think the hacking scene is dying at all. I just think people are rushing in and want the fame more than anything. If people don't spend some time working before posting there hacks, maybe we'll have a nicer selection. Perhaps a rule in which progress up to, say, the first gym, or the equivalent (say, 10% progress?), it can be approved. I dunno if that'd be pushing the restrictions of Progressing Hacks so much so that it's the Hacks Showcase, but, I'm not sure. Any suggestions with the Scrapbox or something similar will most probably be ignored by the way, because it was failure (not trying to talk on behalf of the moderators, mind).

But surely that could still be rushed with inadequate scripting and stuff. I can see your point, but in my eyes it doesn't help stop hacks being rushed.