1st Gen I honestly think that Gen 1 is horrible

[BettyNewbie]

The only time it applies is if their suppose to be the next big thing in the series. And remakes generally aren't that. their a service to old fans and new fans to experience or re-experience something with new updated graphics of modern times and give things in a new perspective (not a new experience). some mechanics changes to fix the bad stuff of the old. Additions are also there. but not "changes". Mega evolution is a major change....

You realize that a lot of people want to go through old stories and settings and see old characters with access to modern graphics and mechanics, right? That's the purpose that remakes serve for many people (in Pokémon, that is).

 

[Mega_Kris]

You realize that a lot of people want to go through old stories and settings and see old characters with access to modern graphics and mechanics, right? That's the purpose that remakes serve for many people (in Pokémon, that is).

access to them is one thing, but not highlighted. that is the major difference

 

[curiousnathan]

Generation I certainly isn't my favourite generation of Pokemon, but it does hold quite a few Pokemon that I do like. Namely the Kabuto/Kabutops, Exeggutor etc.

 

[LaVida]

I agree with the people who said that generation 1 had horrendous sprites and a couple of flaws... but let's be honest on this: Wasn't generation 1 the most innovative one in the whole series? :P I mean, Game Freak has added a couple of new features over the last years, sure, but the main part of the game has stayed the same: Training and collecting Pokémon, challenging 8 gym leaders and the Elite 4 while defying some evil organization. That's why I love generation 1. For its time, it was something completely new. Without generation 1, we wouldn't have generation 6, remember that :3

 

[Mega_Kris]

I agree with the people who said that generation 1 had horrendous sprites and a couple of flaws... but let's be honest on this: Wasn't generation 1 the most innovative one in the whole series? :P I mean, Game Freak has added a couple of new features over the last years, sure, but the main part of the game has stayed the same: Training and collecting Pokémon, challenging 8 gym leaders and the Elite 4 while defying some evil organization. That's why I love generation 1. For its time, it was something completely new. Without generation 1, we wouldn't have generation 6, remember that :3

Pokemon in general is unique as it allowed you to capture 150 pokemon all within a gameboy (a system most people heavily underestimated before pokemon).

But overall, Gen 1 in specific isn't innovating. its the entire Pokemon series that was innovative.

 

[LaVida]

What I meant to say was that since generation 1, the main Pokémon series has not changed dramatically regarding gameplay. The main elements in recent Pokémon games are the same as they were back then. (Training and collecting Pokémon, beating 8 gyms, the Elite 4 and an evil organization.) Game Freak has added some new features (e.g. EV training, mega evolution) but the core of the games has been the same since generation 1. Compared to recent games, it looks old and shabby, but it was very innovating at its time and has been the most innovative generation because Game Freak has kept the overall concept and has only added a few new gimmicks here and there in each new Pokémon game.

 

[Mega_Kris]

What I meant to say was that since generation 1, the main Pokémon series has not changed dramatically regarding gameplay. The main elements in recent Pokémon games are the same as they were back then. (Training and collecting Pokémon, beating 8 gyms, the Elite 4 and an evil organization.) Game Freak has added some new features (e.g. EV training, mega evolution) but the core of the games has been the same since generation 1. Compared to recent games, it looks old and shabby, but it was very innovating at its time and has been the most innovative generation because Game Freak has kept the overall concept and has only added a few new gimmicks here and there in each new Pokémon game.

The overall concept is what kept it alive yes. although if you look at it strictly as an RPG, going to beat 8 gyms (dungeons) and Elite 4 (main bosses) and an evil organization (villains) seems to be alright.

Again, the series is what's innovative, not Gen 1, it was the series itself. Gen 1 just has the luxury of be the beginning. Gen 2 although i believe is truly innovative, adding in special def and special attack, shinies, and breeding pokemon. Gen 2 introduced twiced as much as gen 1 and most of it was a staple to the series.

 

[LaVida]

Gen 2 although i believe is truly innovative, adding in special def and special attack, shinies, and breeding pokemon. Gen 2 introduced twiced as much as gen 1 and most of it was a staple to the series.

Are you kidding me? Generation 1 introduced EVERYTHING but special defense (special attack did exist in generation 1 btw), shinies and breeding. Every Pokémon game after generation 1 is a copy of generation 1 with some minor new features.

 

[BettyNewbie]

Are you kidding me? Generation 1 introduced EVERYTHING but special defense (special attack did exist in generation 1 btw)

Special Defense existed in Gen 1, too; it was just the same stat as Special Attack. (Which had the unintended effect of making Alakazam a powerful Special wall and Chansey a powerful Special sweeper.)

Every Pokémon game after generation 1 is a copy of generation 1 with some minor new features.

Seriously? If any game has been "copied" by later Gens, it's RSE, not RBY. Almost every (non-remake) game released since Gen 3 has followed the formula established by Ruby and Sapphire: Brand new isolated region (Hoenn, Sinnoh, Unova, Kalos), brand new characters, brand new Pokédex that doesn't include every Pokémon, plot revolves around Box Legendaries (Weather Trio, Creation Trio, Tao Trio, Xerneas/Yvetal/Zygarde), brand new Evil Team that's directly involved with said Box Legendaries (Magma/Aqua, Galactic, Plasma, Flare), no postgame besides a Battle Facility (Battle Tower, Battle Frontier, Battle Subway, Battle Maison), etc.

 

[Mega_Kris]

Are you kidding me? Generation 1 introduced EVERYTHING but special defense (special attack did exist in generation 1 btw), shinies and breeding. Every Pokémon game after generation 1 is a copy of generation 1 with some minor new features.

Gen 1 introduced what made pokemon....like i said, its innovation encompasses the series more than gen 1 specifically. Generation 1 is the beginning therefore, it's the base of the entire series. However to say "Generation 1 is innovative" you would have to say it holds something none of the current generations have ever used. Generation 1 is the staple of the series, its not innovative compared to any other generation.


Please use the word correctly. Gen 1 introduced everything because Gen 1 was the introduction.

 

[mew_nani]

Personally I don't think the original games were bad at all; I actually like them a bunch. Sure the sprites are horrendous, there were only 151 Pokemon, there was absolutely no post game, but you can't judge a game based on graphics alone, and even with all the glitches and bad sprites the game is still very fun to play. The music is awesome, even with the rampant glitches the game works just fine, and still has the same essential basis all the Pokemon games have; befriending wild creatures and becoming champion.

Humorously the sheer amount of glitches makes the game even more fun to play than it would usually be. Pokemon Red is one of the few games I know of where you can capture an 80' tall Ghost hybrid and make it your best friend, and there's over 100 of these things. Even when the game crashes it's entertaining, cause everything just goes bonkers as opposed to just shutting off with an error message, and you can even battle Professor Oak and trainers that are even harder than most regular trainers with Pokemon that go way over the level cap. Heck you can even program your own minigames in and play them; what other game can you do that in?

 

[Zoinkity]

The changes to the battle system in Gen 2 were very welcome. Multi-turn attacks especially. Adding in moves for ghost and dragon types, even if there weren't many, made those existing Pokémon more viable to use.


Special being one stat was handy though. Chansey could only really be hurt by physical attacks and could learn counter via TM.

 

[BettyNewbie]

Special being one stat was handy though. Chansey could only really be hurt by physical attacks and could learn counter via TM.

Even better, Chansey actually had firepower. It didn't need to rely on moves like Toxic to inflict damage.

 

[Cerberus87]

1st gen was the first, but it doesn't have much influence in what the game is today. 2nd gen had far more influence. Its type chart survived through 5th gen, it introduced breeding and held items. Then 3rd gen revamped the stat system and added abilities, and 4th gen added the P/S split. The game is far departed from 1st gen, to the point it's become irrelevant.

 

[Zoinkity]

I wouldn't go so far as to say it's irrelevant. The game balance hasn't changed in any notable way. The moveset from Gen 1 was never quietly replaced or radically altered, and many of these moves--tackle, confuse ray, flamethrower, hydro pump, etc.--are still the backbone of the current generation. The game balance has never radically changed and the internal logic--the "rules" moves and effects follow in power and PP, for instance--hasn't changed either.

A Gen 1 player like myself can pick up a demo of X/Y and play the game without batting an eye. Subsequent generations add to the world and the experience, but they're all rooted in the basic gameplay of Gen 1.

-and as a cheap parting shot, Gen 1 has the most awesome starters of all ;*)

 

[Cerberus87]

I wouldn't go so far as to say it's irrelevant. The game balance hasn't changed in any notable way. The moveset from Gen 1 was never quietly replaced or radically altered, and many of these moves--tackle, confuse ray, flamethrower, hydro pump, etc.--are still the backbone of the current generation. The game balance has never radically changed and the internal logic--the "rules" moves and effects follow in power and PP, for instance--hasn't changed either.

A Gen 1 player like myself can pick up a demo of X/Y and play the game without batting an eye. Subsequent generations add to the world and the experience, but they're all rooted in the basic gameplay of Gen 1.

-and as a cheap parting shot, Gen 1 has the most awesome starters of all ;*)

The problem is that people are saying 1st gen is more innovative relative to other gens, when it can't be compared to them that way, because it came first. 1st gen's innovation must be compared to other RPGs of the time, not to subsequent gens of the same game.

 

[BettyNewbie]

1st gen was the first, but it doesn't have much influence in what the game is today. 2nd gen had far more influence. Its type chart survived through 5th gen, it introduced breeding and held items. Then 3rd gen revamped the stat system and added abilities, and 4th gen added the P/S split. The game is far departed from 1st gen, to the point it's become irrelevant.

I have to agree with Cerberus on this. As I said, the backbone of the modern Pokémon games is really Ruby and Sapphire, not Red and Blue. Things like having Regional Dexes, new Evil Teams, plots that center around Box Legendaries, and simply always being plopped into a brand new isolated region that doesn't have any connections to the previous ones are all things that originated with RSE and still survive to this day in XY.

 

[mew_nani]

The problem is that people are saying 1st gen is more innovative relative to other gens, when it can't be compared to them that way, because it came first. 1st gen's innovation must be compared to other RPGs of the time, not to subsequent gens of the same game.

Still going along that line it is pretty innovative. There's not a lot of RPGs out there in which there's more than maybe 16 available party members, especially at that time, and Pokemon Red and Blue were pretty unique in their core concept. You weren't some spiky haired teenager trying to save the world, and you weren't wrapped up in several different conspiracies. You were just a kid, handed a Pokemon, and told to catch more and become champion. If you were a fan of more complex RPGs maybe it wasn't your thing, but for a child the concept was perfect and relatable. Every kid could imagine themselves commanding a fiery dragon and becoming the best. Heck just the first part was the only thing needed to inspire a kid. And there was a boatload of Pokemon a kid could choose from if they didn't like commanding a giant fire breathing dragon. In short, the game was every kid's dream, and even if it was a bit rough around the edges it was still just fine with them.

(Also technically Gold and Silver had a Regional Dex. Just thought I'd point that out.)

 

[BettyNewbie]

(Also technically Gold and Silver had a Regional Dex. Just thought I'd point that out.)

No, they didn't. What they had was simply the "New Pokédex" and "Old Pokédex," and since both included every single Pokémon that existed up to that point, the only real difference between the two was order. The New Pokédex put things in a more thematic order and grouped cross-Gen pre/evolutions together, while the Old Pokédex just continued from where Gen 1's Dex left off.

The phrase "Regional Dex" wasn't even spoken in the games until Ruby and Sapphire, as they were the first games to give you a Pokédex that was closely tied to its region, focused on new Pokémon, and didn't include every Pokémon that existed at the time.

The Old/New Pokédexes were later retconned into being Regional Dexes, aka. the Kanto and Johto Dexes, but that only applied to FRLG/HGSS, not RBY/GSC.

 

[mew_nani]

No, they didn't. What they had was simply the "New Pokédex" and "Old Pokédex," and since both included every single Pokémon that existed up to that point, the only real difference between the two was order. The New Pokédex put things in a more thematic order and grouped cross-Gen pre/evolutions together, while the Old Pokédex just continued from where Gen 1's Dex left off.

The phrase "Regional Dex" wasn't even spoken in the games until Ruby and Sapphire, as they were the first games to give you a Pokédex that was closely tied to its region, focused on new Pokémon, and didn't include every Pokémon that existed at the time.

The Old/New Pokédexes were later retconned into being Regional Dexes, aka. the Kanto and Johto Dexes, but that only applied to FRLG/HGSS, not RBY/GSC.

It is technically a Regional Dex though as it's not a direct continuation of the National Dex; even though it includes the older Pokemon it's still grouped so that the Johto Pokemon come first. Thus, it's a Regional Dex of sorts, placing emphasis on the Pokemon located in Johto. I did say "technically" there, meaning it could be considered a Regional Dex.