My Goal - Destroy all Sweepers! [RMT - Stall]

[Anti]

Introduction:

Okay, so I'm digging through old files to see what I can delete and my first DP stall team brings back good old times...of getting hammered by Boah >.> Anyways, I edited it out a bit and got a pretty good result. Still, this is the rough draft, and I'm facing a few problems at the moment. Either way, enjoy another one of my teams...of course you will not find any sweepers :) STALL STALL STALL!

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Team:

Gyarados - DD Sweep FTW? - Bulky Water

Gyarados @ Leftovers ** DD Sweep FTW?
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 200 Def / 56 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Waterfall
- Toxic
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

I usually hate Gyarados leads, but not this kind :) This survives Thunderpunches from Infernape :P Don't hammer me for Toxic, every single one of its counters is horrified. So for all of you HP Electric Vaporeons and Milotics, come and meat your maker! Really though, Resttalk Gyarados is pretty dang tough. Those expecting DD sweepers WILL be torched...except Starmie, but that's another story >.>

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Snorlax - Charlie Weis - Special Wall

Snorlax @ Leftovers ** Charlie Weis
Trait: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Body Slam
- Earthquake
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

I'm sorry but Blissey, you SUCK! Well not really, but Snorlax is still awesome. THE best Heatran counter in the game, period. Also this nickname wins and there's nothing you can do about it ^_^ Really though, with the next pokemon you're about to see this walls everything. Sandstorm from Hippo is annoying to it, but it still walls so much stuff and can outstall some of the best stallers in the game.

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Spiritomb - Tornado Warning - Rapid Spin Blocker

Spiritomb @ Leftovers ** Tornado Warning
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 96 Def / 160 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
- Shadow Ball
- Rest
- Calm Mind

Boring old Spiritomb it may be, but with Snorlax nothing gets by! Also, Lucario really hates this thing and it blocks Rapid Spinning attempts at Forry's darling Spikes! It counters the Azelfs and Gengars of the world very well. Don't whine about the EVs, they're pretty much the standard only with a minor tweak to adapt to HP Fighting's IV changes. Also, Pressure stalling with CM is awesome :) The EVs are still being played around with though.

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Hippowdon - Sandstoned - Physical Wall / SRer

Hippowdon @ Leftovers ** Sandstoned
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Slack Off
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang
- Roar

While not being the staller my other pokemon are, Hippowdon is a great wall. It SRs stuff and stops all the usual threats in Tyranitar. Not much else to say really, other than the fact that it rocks. Slack Off is also a cool way to recover as opposed to the resttalkers on this team.

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Cresselia - el oh el - Mixed Wall

Cresselia @ Leftovers ** el oh el
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 140 HP / 192 Def / 176 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Reflect
- Ice Beam
- Psychic
- Rest

Don't ask about the EVs...lol. Either way, this grants maximum lefties recovery with a nice 416 HP stat. I figure that buffing up the defenses a little more could help...don't kill me over this, just experimenting. Eithyer way, this kills what my team gets fried by.

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Shaymin - Celebi - Wish Support

Shaymin @ Leftovers ** Celebi
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SAtk
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Grass Knot
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Aromatherapy
- Rest

CM tank stuff, Wish Support...yeah.

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Strategy:

Stall. That's it, that's how I win. I just stall so that I wear the other team down totally while spiking the field and inflicting Toxic on what I can. It's pretty simple really.

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Problems:

Other walls can really only be done by outstalling them if they're immune to Toxic or if Gyarados isn't a safe switch. It can be done, but it stalls the battle out so long even I wouldn't enjoy it. Some pokemon I just don't know enough about to say I counter lol. Steel walls are really annoying as well.

Go ahead and post comments, I'll probably listen lol.

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Threat List:

NOTE: I recently changed Spiritomb up a bit, replacing Sleep Talk with Calm Mind, so some things might be messed up.

Abomasnow: Forretress / Spiritomb / Gyarados

I have no idea, feel free to kill me for what I posted, lol. Forretress can take most of its attacks though from what I've read. Spiritomb doesn't take anything from Focus Punch and can try and stall it I guess. Gyarados can take ones without Sub by unflicting poison. I really don't know ._.

Aerodactyl: Hippowdon

Aero is hammered by Hippowdon pretty badly.

Alakazam: Spiritomb

lol at Psychic.

Ambipom: Spiritomb / Forretress / Hippowdon / Celebi

Celebi beats the BPer with Perish Song, while attacking sets are walled by the other three pokemon mentioned.

Articuno: Snorlax / Spiritomb / Forretress

I basically stall Articuno to beat it by using Tomb or Lax. Forretress can set up Spikes on it as well.

Azelf: Spiritomb

gg Azelf :)

Azumarill: Gyarados

Don't know much about this thing, but I do know that Focus Punch and Waterfall won't be doing anything and Toxic will about shut it down.

Blissey: Gyarados / Forretress

STALL STALL STALL! Forry can spike up the field on those lacking Flamethrower and Gyarados will scare it away.

Breloom: Spiritomb / Gyarados / Forretress / Hippowdon

Like I know 0_o Anything without Seed Bomb runs into trouble with Spiritomb though, and Gyarados also resists STAB fighting attacks and can Sleep Talk after Spore. Forretress can take Seed Bombs well and Hippowdon can take Brelooms without Seed Bomb. I do have trouble with this one.

Bronzong: Gyarados / Celebi

More stalling. Bronzong can't hurt Gyarados or Celebi, and I can stall it. Celebi also stops the CM sets.

Celebi: Spirirtomb / Celebi

STAB Shadow Ball hurts. My own Celebi stops the BPer sets.

Claydol: Gyarados / Celebi

lol

Cresselia: Gyarados / Celebi / Spiritomb

More stalling. Spiritomb can really annoy it and Celebi's Perish Song is no pal for the CM sets either. Gyarados Toxistalls those lacking Charge Beam fairly easily.

Donphan: Gyarados / Celebi

Must I explain?

Dragonite: Hippowdon

Outrage hurts and all, but so does Ice Fang.

Dugtrio: Gyarados / Hippowdon / Forretress

Obvious.

Dusknoir: Spiritomb / Gyarados

I can't get enough of stalling. Spirirtomb can beat it and Gyarados hammers it with Toxic, destroying it. However, switching in with Thunderpunch around is very difficult. Spiritomb can stall it out though.

Electivire: Hippowdon / Forretress / Spiritomb

Vire gets murdered by Forretress and Hippowdon, and can't really hurt Spirirtomb much.

Empoleon: Snorlax

Obviously it can't beat a special wall.

Espeon: Spiritomb / Snorlax / Celebi

Spiritomb FTW! Snorlax can also wall it and Celebi bugs EspyJump a lot.

Flygon: Hippowdon

Sup Ice Fang.

Forretress: Celebi / Gyarados / Forretress

Just more stalling. Forretress is there to Spin away their Spikes.

Garchomp: Hippowdon / Forretress

Um isn't this thing uber? lol

Gengar: Spiritomb

gg Gar ^_^

Gliscor: Gyarados / Celebi

Pretty obvious. Celebi can mess the the BPer.

Gyarados: Celebi

Grass Knot hurts and Ice Fang...lol.

Heatran: Snorlax

Heatran gets absolutely OWNED by Snorlax.

Heracross: Gyarados / Hippowdon

Hippowdon is the first switch usually, Gyara walls both STAB attacks really badly and STAB Waterfall is no pal.

Hippowdon: Gyarados / Celebi

See Donphan.

Houndoom: Snorlax / Gyarados

Um I guess? If I knew something about stupid Houndoom...

Infernape: Gyarados / Hippowdon

MixApe is pretty tough on me. Still, Gyarados can take Grass Knot well enoguh to KO back with Waterfall. Shaky though...Hippowdon for physical variants.

Jirachi: Snorlax / Hippowdon

Snorlax takes special sets and Hippowdon physical.

Jolteon: Snorlax / Celebi

Snorlax beats up on it while Celebi is a nice answer to those BPed boosts. go go go Perish Song!

Jynx: Snorlax / Spiritomb

Both make its sleep move backfire and both also KO it. Snorlax laughs at Ice Beam. Or I would think >.>

Kingdra: Snorlax / Gyarados

Eh, not too sure on this either. Still, all special Kingdra will obviously fall to Snorlax while mxied sets are handled fairly well by Gyarados.

Lucario: Spiritomb / Hippowdon / Snorlax

Spirirtomb's Fighting immunity is great! HP Fighting FTW after that. Snorlax can EQ SpecsLuke after anything but Aura Sphere and Hippowdon does okay against SDluke.

Ludicolo: Celebi / Snorlax / Gyarados

lol I have no idea. Celebi can't be hurt by Leech Seed though, and Gyarados can Toxic it with little risk of being hurt. Snorlax walls the sweeper sets.

Machamp: Spiritomb / Hippowdon / Gyarados / Forretress

Spiritomb and Gyarados eat up its STAB attack. Forretress takes Ice Punches and Hippowdon takes everything else.

Magmortar: Snorlax / Gyarados

Snorlax walls everything but focus Punch, and we have Gyarados for that.

Magnezone: Snorlax / Celebi

Celebi Perish Songs it to stop MS madness. Snorlax beats those without Magnet Rise.

Mamoswine: Gyarados

Not too familiar with Mamoswine, but both STAB moves can't really hurt Gyarados much and Waterfall will inflict pain.

Marowak: Gyarados / Hippowdon / Celebi

I have no idea >.> If Celebi manages to survive the switch-in, it can Grass Knot it. Hippowdon just kind of buys time and Gyarados can Waterfall.

Medicham: Spiritomb / Hippowdon / Gyarados

Spirirtomb takes both STABs. Hippo and Gyara can generally take a hit from it as long as I'm careful for those supereffective killers.

Mesprit: Celebi / Snorlax

Perish Song annoys it to high heavens. Snorlax can wall attacks from choice sets and that jkind of thing.

Metagross: Forretress / Hippowdon

Pwned.

Milotic: Gyarados / Celebi

Toxic and Grass Knot = Win.

Mismagius: Spiritomb

Pretty much like Gengar I guess. I don't know much about this little creature though, so I'm probably wrong.

Moltres: Snorlax

lol at you Moltres!

Ninjask: Celebi / Hippowdon

Meh. Celebi can Perish Song it if it lacks X-Scizzor. Hippo can kill it with Ice Fang if it tries attacking me.

Porygon-Z: Spiritomb / Snorlax

:) Spirirtomb walls it.

Raikou: Snorlax

Yeah...

Rampardos: Hippowdon

Yeah...

Regice: Snorlax / Gyarados

Just more stalling. Toxic owns anything non resttalk. thunderbolt is troubel for Gyarados though.

Regirock: Celebi / Gyarados

Grass Knot hurts, as does Toxic.

Rhyperior: Hippowdon

Rhyinferior proves its nickname true.

Roserade: Snorlax

Eh, I guess.

Salamence: Snorlax / Hippowdon

Snorlax beats special sets while Hippowdon beats physical ones. MixMence is trouble, but Gyarados can Toxic it at least and hope for the best.

Sceptile: Snorlax / Celebi

Celebi takes Leech Seed like a pro and Snorlax takes special sweeping stuff.

Scizor: Gyarados / Forretress / Hippowdon

More stalling and resisting its STAB moves.

Skarmory: Gyarados / Forretress

STALL STALL STALL! Forretress spins away Spikes.

Slaking: Forretress / Hippowdon / Spiritomb

Normal resist FTW! Tomb and Hippo are also helpful.

Slowbro: Gyarados / Celebi / Spiritomb

Grass Knot, Shadow Ball, and Toxic FTW

Snorlax: Celebi / Gyarados

MORE stalling. Perish Song ends Curselax.

Spiritomb: Snorlax / Gyarados

Um just stalling again. Toxic beats any variant without Rest.

Staraptor: Hippowdon

Owned. CB Brave Bird hurts though.

Starmie: Snorlax

WALL in the way :)

Suicune: Celebi

Perish Song FTW!

Swampert: Gyarados / Celebi

Grass Knot...ooh. Toxic also does the trick.

Tangrowth: Gyarados

Toxistall time!

Tauros: Forretress / Hippowdon

Forretress just laughs at it.

Tentacruel: Snorlax

EQ hurts a lot.

Togekiss: Snorlax / Celebi

Celebi for passers, Snorlax for everything else.

Torterra: Forretress / Celebi / Gyarados

Torterra is easily stalled and can't break me really.

Tyranitar: Hippowdon / Forretress / Spiritomb

Hippo walls physical Tar like nothing else and Forretress does pretty well too. Boah is handled by Spiritomb. Tar lacking Stone Edge is defeated by Gyarados (I'm looking at your DDtar set, Dark_Azelf :P)

Umbreon: Celebi / Gyarados

Gyarados can Toxic Umbreon while Celebi can Perish Song and make BPing backfire totally.

Uxie: Gyarados / Celebi / Spiritomb

Jyst stalling stuff, its counter depending on its set. Tomb will usually work.

Vaporeon: Gyarados / Celebi

Toxic or Grass Knot...both will hurt.

Venusaur: Spiritomb / Snorlax / Forretress / Celebi

I have no idea.

Weavile: Forretress

Weavile can't touch Forretress. Period.

Weezing: Snorlax / Celebi / Forretress

I mostly beat Weezing by stalling. It can't hurt it, but it's extremely easy to outstall.

Zapdos: Snorlax / Celebi

Snorlax walls it pretty badly, MS Zappy is annoying but Thunderbolts are easy to predict, and we have Celebi for that. HP Grass Zappy is destroyed by Celebi for that matter. I mostly rely on Snorlax, SS, and SR to do damage to Zapdos. Resttalk versions will be stalled to death. It's not the easiest thing to beat, but it isn't a huge threat to this team.

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Results:

This team hasn't lost yet. Generally the defenses bend a lot, but don't break. Snorlax is a total monster. This stalled a team with Heracross/Gengar/Porygon-Z/Electivire with ease (nothing fainted) before the opponent just quit. It also somehow defeated Sya's amazing rain team, with Celebi taking almost nothing from Garchomp's Outrage. I have to say it shocked me to death. I wish I would have saved the log, I can never beat Sya...lol. I'm also proud that Gyarados has survived Explosions...it's pretty awesome. All and all, this team has been a success...so far. The pokemon I fear the most I have yet to face, so we'll see how it all pans out.

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Conclusions:

Stalling is fun, and with this team it is more fun! <3

 

[sims796]

I hate stall teams, but you must beware of...

VILEPLUME!

Yeah, I know you won't see it much at all, but seriously, he can hurt this team a bit. Nothing, you know, GG, but a defensively minded one (like the one I'm currently working on) may cause problems. Since it may pack Sludge Bomb, it could even hammer Celebii.

Personally, I think you should have a sleep setter in this team. I don't see a thing that can really hammer it, cept Perish Song from Celebii.

Vileplume@Black Sludge
Nature:Calm
EV:244 HP, 136 DEF, 130 SP.DEF
Leech Seed
Toxic
Sleep Powder
Energy Ball/Sludge Bomb


Just a set I was fiddling around with, and it could indeed hurt this team a bit. In fact, even the mighty Hippowdon has problems. Or maybe it's stall teams in general? I mean, stallers could weaken you, or is that all stall teams? I dunno. It's 1 am now, so forgive me right now if I'm spouting out nonsense, especially since you won't see Plume much at all.

Although I was serious on the sleeper.

EDIT:I see you've noticed this when you mentioned Venasaur, but remember, Plume can carry Aromatherapy.

 

[Pirate Dave]

Disgruntled Psychic Lover :P

Yuk - Tanks.

Right, now I've got that out of my system, the main problem I can see is that you have what, one Ice move?

So if some one had enough Dragons with Dragon Dance you could be a bit troubled...

As for you comment -

'Lol at Psychic'

If you got put to sleep, and Mean Look / Switched an Alakazam with Encore or something similar (maybe even a Mr. Mime??) might be able to Calm Mind the hell out of itself to beat your remaining Pokémon... I don't know really though as my battling skills are somewhat limited.

EDIT:- Lol - I guess my judgment may be clouded as I still long for the days when I completed Pokémon Red with just two Kadabras and some utility Pokémon :P

 

[BeachBoy]

I thought you would post this. Hehe...

Well through various tests, lost twice. An amazing UU team beat the hail out of this. (Dead Serious)

The main problems that have been encountered are a lack of pure right away phazing, and two, lack of ice it seems, a leafeon/venomoth/blastiose was a very large hand full surprising, heck the guys entire team was. :\

I keep thinking about Skarmory, but not sure where it would fit. And in all the battles I tested, forretress seems to be the least helpful. So, maybe try skarmory > forretress. It makes you lose the valuable rapid spin though. Also somewhat covers that vileplume problem sims suggested. :x

Overall, a solid team, incredibly annoying to test due to my gears, but solid.

I'll have more input later.

 

[Syaoran]

Lovely team there, Anti! haha, I should know ;)

Just 2 things about your threat list - beware of Gengar and Togekiss! Gengar can sleep your only counter to it, which is Spiritomb, so beware. Snorlax and Forrey can't even touch him! A fast Togekiss could cause you some trouble if it manages to get a Nasty Plot.

 

[sims796]

Yuk - Tanks.

Right, now I've got that out of my system, the main problem I can see is that you have what, one Ice move?

So if some one had enough Dragons with Dragon Dance you could be a bit troubled...

As for you comment -

If you got put to sleep, and Mean Look / Switched an Alakazam with Encore or something similar (maybe even a Mr. Mime??) might be able to Calm Mind the hell out of itself to beat your remaining Pokémon... I don't know really though as my battling skills are somewhat limited.

EDIT:- Lol - I guess my judgment may be clouded as I still long for the days when I completed Pokémon Red with just two Kadabras and some utility Pokémon :P

Dragons can't even touch this team. All setter uppers are stopped cold by Celebii & Perish Song.

That is a very situational...situation. Not ever likely to happen. No matter how many CMs it gets, it ain't hurting Snorlax.

 

[Ársa]

Hey, well Garchomp isn't Uber forever, just a month until we decide, but ya. =P

Hippowdon activates Sand Veil and the dreaded and very common Life Orb, Outrage, Swords Dance Garchomp will kill you! >_>

Well, apart from that, I can't see too much problem.

~T_S

 

[sims796]

You mean, other than other stallers? It's all about who stalls what better. I mention Plume (& Venasaur) because they can take everthing that this team can dish out, to either sleep the choice threats, or poison the rest. And it can even take out Celebii with Sludge Bomb. Of course, he has a problem with defensive pokes in general, so...

Because they are immune to Toxic, it can hurt this team. So I say add a sleeper.

 

[Anti]

Forretress was actually chosen not just for its spinning ability, but also its resistances. I'm no fan of Skarmory this gen anyways, lol.

As for Gengar, my initial switch is actually Snorlax to see if it sleeps me. If it does, sleep clause is activated and Tomb can come in. If not, I know it probably doesn't carry Hypnosis and I bring Tomb in.

As for Alakazam, Spirirtomb and Sbnorlax both beat it into the ground.

Vileplume is...very interesting. I can't hurt it, but I CAN outstall it. That's pretty much how I beat a lot of things. Gyarados mainly takes Plume with its ability to shrug off status, all of Plume's attacks, and not really care about Leech Seed. Spikes/SR/Waterfall/Sandstorm should take their toll on Plume enough that it will fall. I will admit, Plume is actually tough to handle in this case :0 NO!

As for Garchomp, you really can't prepare for it. CBChomp is walled by the collective efforts of Gyarados and Forretress...SDchomp is hurt by full health Hippowdon pretty badly, and Gyarados can get off a Toxic before dying.

I didn't really go after Garchomp due to its uber status on PC. I agree with that placing, but generally it isn't a problem when Celebi starts surviving Outrages with plenty to spare, lol. It's about as well as you can counter it really...meh.

As for the wall problem, it usually isn't one, as they are pretty easy to stall. those that can stall are beaten by Spirirtomb (as they almost never carry a sleep move). Gyarados can also Toxic stallers. Poison/Grass pokemon are annoying, but stalled nonetheless. Also, Celebi can Perish Song and let Spikes and SR dish out some serious hurt.

Also, surprise attackers are hard on about any stall team since they can put all of your walls at about 20% health, lol. Lack of Ice? Well...hmm...I don't think there's anything I can do about that, lol.

I haven't lost with this team yet, which rarely happens since something usually messes up, lol. I don't think opposing walls are the problem you might think they are...Tomb beats most of them and Gyarados/Celebi/Spikes beat the rest. If there's one thing you shouldn't worry about, it's this team's stalling ability :P

What was said about Garchomp and Pulme is probably true though, lol. Luckily, Plume doesn't have the OU stats of an OU pokemon, which is a blessing in this case (don't kill me sims...)

Basically, I pretty much agree, with a few objections...lol

DESTROY ALL SWEEPERS!

 

[jc_rcw]

What's with the random wall hating, they are essential :/

 

[Cloud_85]

Well, as you say "Steel walls are really annoying as well", I really see that Skarmory can Wall you really well... It will be an eternal stall...

 

[sims796]

I will have to hurt you for that. Plume is actually uber, but no one wil listen. Of course, nothing Gya has will hurt Plume in the least. It shrugs off Waterfall from an unboosted Gya (with no offensive EV's at all) and Leech Seed will take it's toll, especially since you will have to constantly recover using Rest, and Sleep Talk is useless, since Waterfall & Toxic won't work, while I am free to Toxic you to force Rest. Celebii falls to Sludge Bomb & Toxic, and will possibly lose before Perish Song can scare off the opponent. Personally, I think you put far too much dependance on SR/Spikes for reisidual damage, but I suppose that's what Stall teams do.

And don't forget, you need to put in some effort to wipe out this one poke. Or two. Remember, Vileplume may be uber, but Venasaur isn't.

I still say Sleep can help put out counters.

 

[Syaoran]

I definitely agree. You also have no way of countering stat uppers - no Encore, no Roar or Whirlwind.. you rely simply on Perish Song. Togekiss can come on anything and Nasty Plot, sweeping the rest of your team, even Snorlax who won't be able to take boosted Aura Sphere.

I don't think you need Rapid Spin support that much, what you do need is a fast pokemon to be able to take care of stat uppers and threats like Vileplume as mentioned by sims. I'm thinking Encore Infernape.. no more Skarm / Plume problems. You can even use Mach Punch for the annoying Lucario.

 

[luke]

Deleted the rude, unnecessary post. No worries. Thanks everyone for not jumping on him.

 

[sims796]

What was said about Garchomp and Pulme is probably true though, lol. Luckily, Plume doesn't have the OU stats of an OU pokemon, which is a blessing in this case (don't kill me sims...)

I just noticed this sentence. Vileplume does indeed have very good stats (Although Bellossum has the more "proper stats. They'd benifit if they would swap stats). Healthy HP, reasonable defense, and a nice sp.def, copped with a great, or so-so typing.

Only halting point is it's shabby movepool, and it is nearly outclassed by Venasaur. IT does get Aromatherapy, and can use it better than Roserade.

 

[Anti]

Gyarados WILL outstall Vileplume. It will take an incredible toll, but it can do it.

The general agreement seems to be to take out Forretress. Still, I simply will not use Skarmory (I like it, but it just isn't all that...good...) Kill me for saying Skarmory isn't good, I just don't think it's all that great, definitely not the physical wall it used to be. I WOULD consider Registeel though :)

If I keep Forry, I would be willing to take out Rapid Spin for SR and put Roar on Hippowdon, which would further hurt BPers.

Remember with Vileplume also, it only has one attack move. If it has Sludge bomb, forretress laughs at it, and really its hits are pretty easily shrugged off. If it has Energy Ball, Celebi time!

Nasty Plot Togekiss is quite a problem, luckily I've only seen one ever. As for Skarmory, it's pretty easily stalled. Generally, I like painfully stalling things to death rather than taking a more aggressive approach. My problem is that I simply cannot lose my layer of spikes...

 

[sims796]

WILL? How the hell did you come up to that crap? You hardly even battled it before. You only have but so many Rest at your disposal, and you can't hurt Plume AT ALL. What are you gonna do, Toxic it? No, it's immune. Waterfall won't do much either, in fact, it won't do anything at all. You'd run out of Rest far before he will run out of moves, and you'll still get sapped from Leech Seed, Rest or not. Plus, he may have his own Sleep Powder, instead of your set 2 turn sleep.

Forry can easily be put to sleep, and Celebii will be removed when you try to heal it. And that's IF it doesn't have a good Hidden Power. Stop beating around the bush. Plume, Venasaur, and other defensive pokes can cause you some isues, and as Syaoran said, no real way to stop stat uppers. To say "Forry laugh at it's attacking moves" i a pretty tupid thing to say, especially since it's comming from you. You know as well as I do, attacking isn't the only way to cause harm.

As I said, this needs more sleep, and less relying on spikes, and other forms of residual damage. I know that is how a stall team works, but it seems far too situational. Sure, you beat most sweepers, but you can get stalled yourself pretty easily by other stall teams. Not having a loss doesn't mean this team isn't flawed in a way, just means you haven't run into it yet.

Plus, this is only ONE of the pokes that will cause you problem. If you need such an effort just to put this out, you may need to fix some things.

Bigget problem, Vileplume is defensive. He can take almost everything you can throw at him, even Hippowdon has issues with it, since it takes about 3 hits to take him out with Ice Fang. All he needs is one attacking move to put you out, as it has it's status to disable everything else. I can see this having issues with other stall teams. It is NOT game breaking, like I said, but you put far too much effort into putting this thing out that should't actually be needed. As you said "I have no idea how to stop Venasaur". Well, this is just another Venasaur.

If you do give Roar to Hippo, it will solve this. You keep saying "SR/Spikes/Sandstorm will already have taken their toll". So, that situation will always happen, every match, without a doubt? Stealth Rock will always be up & running? With Roar, you can at least get rid of it, SO R/Spikes can damage it.

 

[Ársa]

WILL? How the hell did you come up to that crap? You hardly even battled it before. You only have but so many Rest at your disposal, and you can't hurt Plume AT ALL. What are you gonna do, Toxic it? No, it's immune. Waterfall won't do much either, in fact, it won't do anything at all. You'd run out of Rest far before he will run out of moves, and you'll still get sapped from Leech Seed, Rest or not. Plus, he may have his own Sleep Powder, instead of your set 2 turn sleep.

Forry can easily be put to sleep, and Celebii will be removed when you try to heal it. And that's IF it doesn't have a good Hidden Power. Stop beating around the bush. Plume, Venasaur, and other defensive pokes can cause you some isues, and as Syaoran said, no real way to stop stat uppers. To say "Forry laugh at it's attacking moves" i a pretty tupid thing to say, especially since it's comming from you. You know as well as I do, attacking isn't the only way to cause harm.

As I said, this needs more sleep, and less relying on spikes, and other forms of residual damage. I know that is how a stall team works, but it seems far too situational. Sure, you beat most sweepers, but you can get stalled yourself pretty easily by other stall teams. Not having a loss doesn't mean this team isn't flawed in a way, just means you haven't run into it yet.

Plus, this is only ONE of the pokes that will cause you problem. If you need such an effort just to put this out, you may need to fix some things.

Bigget problem, Vileplume is defensive. He can take almost everything you can throw at him, even Hippowdon has issues with it, since it takes about 3 hits to take him out with Ice Fang. All he needs is one attacking move to put you out, as it has it's status to disable everything else. I can see this having issues with other stall teams. It is NOT game breaking, like I said, but you put far too much effort into putting this thing out that should't actually be needed. As you said "I have no idea how to stop Venasaur". Well, this is just another Venasaur.

If you do give Roar to Hippo, it will solve this. You keep saying "SR/Spikes/Sandstorm will already have taken their toll". So, that situation will always happen, every match, without a doubt? Stealth Rock will always be up & running? With Roar, you can at least get rid of it, SO R/Spikes can damage it.

Sorry Anti, but I agree with sims here. You DO need to find a way to combat Vileplume. There is no way at all that Gyarados will outstall the great lume. I actually don't think Hippowdon does that great a job other than setting Sandstorm, so you could perhaps think of switching it with Tyranitar. Tyranitar gets the Sp. Def boost and can provide some sort of resistence if you run into another stall team (i.e. Tyraniboah). The major physical threats such as Heracross are still taken care of by the likes of Forretress, and although you may have a problem with no being able to counter opposing Tyranitar, Gyarados can intimidate and only needs to fear a Stone Edge, Forretress doesn't care for anything bar Fire Blast/Flamethrower, Spiritomb can...2HKO with Hidden Power?

~T_S

 

[Dark Azelf]

Im surprised no one has played against a SUB-Seed Vileplume, the sheer hatred that thing can install in others is amazing lol


Ive found a weak after looking through it some more


Salamence@Life Orb
120 ATT / 252 SP.ATT / 136 SPEED
Mild Nature
- Brick break
- Draco meteor
- Fire Blast
- Roost

A Draco meteor from this set

Defender HP: 304
Damage: 216 - 254
Damage: 71.05% - 83.55%

On 252 hp / 160 sp.def positive spiritomb.

Also i would be VERY Careful with anything you switch into this, it has the potential to break all your walls.

And mixape is a problem actually, it does 75% Minimum to Gyarados with a Nasty Plot Life Orb'd Grass Knot, so keep it healthy, is my only advice.

 

[sims796]

He can beat Plume (and Venasaur) but he will take too much to deal with someting that shouldn't be an issue.