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Peaked at 1st On Shoddy Ladder...

Archer said:
Never trust D_A... Simple. Besides, If he used Metalkid's, it's wrong.
Click to expand...

YES WE KNOW METALKIDS IS POOP, HENCE WHY I DONT USE IT.

And Some other people cant read my sig can they ? IT SAYS A CHANCE TO OHKO CHOMP!

Nobbers


LOL

Anyways, DD/SE/Crunch/EQ LO.T-Tar is a problem as i said on pokelounge, most dont stat up on the first turn and your going to be in a world of pain should you predict wrong.

Also what i find peculiar is that, granted its poop, SD weavile, is a pest aswell, able to 2hko that Gyarados after swords dance, even after the -1 from intimidate, with a Life Orb Ice Punch (53% min) and you only 2hko said weavile. Its also able to ohko Zam, Celebi with the same +1 (due to said intimidate) Life Orb Night Slash, and Blissey and heatran are OHKO'd@ Brick break with SR up. It OHKOs chomp regardless.


This is just theory-mon and it most likely wont get a chance to switch in, but still something to think about, even more so with SR up.

Anyways, looks like a really cool team,and has some good synergy so i dont want to replace anything.

However, i DO wanna try that zam as i like sub minding pokes.
 
It 3HKO's Gyarados after Leftovers...X_X I played an SD Weavile and Gyara beat it 1 on 1.

wait...you said minimum...

Do standard run Jolly or adamant? Zam would outspeed Adamant would it not?

~T_S
 
Tortured_Soul said:
It 3HKO's Gyarados after Leftovers...X_X I played an SD Weavile and Gyara beat it 1 on 1.

wait...you said minimum...

Do standard run Jolly or adamant? Zam would outspeed Adamant would it not?

~T_S
Click to expand...

Jolly is the standard, and yes i said min, the max it does is like 60 something % =X.
 
oh well. It's actually rather easy to play around IMO. If I can get SR up, waterfall OHKO's it from Gyara. I've battled quite a few without hitch.

and, tbh, taking something out for another loses team synergy. =(

~T_S
 
Just a quick description of weaknesses here.

Rain teams almost completely walk over your strategy, those who do not use Bronzong to lead and setup Rain Dance, meaning Jirachi/Kingdra, can basically get a free setup on Heatran and sweep. Kabutops OHKOs 5/6ths of your team with an SD up, except Garchomp which takes 99% or more from SD Waterfall, meaning a KO.

Agiligross also gets in easily on Celebi and can proceed to setup and down 5/6ths of your team with Thunderpunch/Meteor Mash/Earthquake, again Garchomp is saved but takes 70% min from LO Meteor Mash.

Very DDLOGyara weak if it gets past Celebi which isn't really a problem since DD LO Ice Fang does 53% min, and 27% min with Reflect up, and after probable SR damage, it does min 80% to Celebi meaning its down after Gyarados Ice Fangs three times, factoring in Reflect.
 
Thanks.

I've already established the DD LO Gyara weakness, I posted it on the first page. Celebi can go the rounds if I get it in on the DD.

Kabutops issue is...a worry. It's becoming more common in Rain Dance teams I suppose, so what exactly can I do to counter it, that won't hinder anything else? Because you've given me lots of questions to think about, but not many answers...:(

~T_S
 
If you get it on the DD, LO Ice Fang would 3HKO if you use either Leech Seed or Reflect, and Grass Knot cannot deal any significant damage in the meantime. You still haven't considered the Agiligross weak.

Generally one of the best strategies against Rain Dance is to either stall the turns out or stop it from setting up Rain Dance entirely both which I feel your team can't really address.
 
I Reflect after i've switched into the DD, then recover off damage, slowly increasing my health, then Grass Knot it for....2 or 3HKO?

let's say the first Ice Fang does.....58%

Celebi uses Reflect ~42%
Gyarados uses Ice Fang (let's say...31%?) - 1 Turn
Celebi uses Recover ~11% - 61%
Gyarados uses Ice Fang (31%) - 2 Turn
Celebi uses Recover ~30%-80%
Gyarados uses Ice Fang (31%) - 3 Turn
Celebi uses Grass Knot (--%) ~49%
Gyarados uses Ice Fang (31%) - 4 Turn
Celebi uses Recover ~ 18% - 68%
Gyarados uses Ice Fang (31%) - 5 Turns - END
Celebi uses Recover ~37% - 87%
Gyarados uses Ice Fang (58%)
Celebi uses Reflect ~29%
Gyarados uses Ice Fang (Chance of KO)

Gyarados LO recoil is rather high by now, so I'm not sure how much Grass Knot does, but 60% recoil, plus possible SR damage means it's gone...

- - - - - - - - - -

So I can say that it is possible to take it down. Also it should be shown, that the common set runs either Ice Fang or Stone Edge[/i] not both, so I can switch in my own Gyarados and resttalk stall it until it faints from LO recoil.

P.S. In regards to Rain Dance, do the starters normally stay in? Because Ala outspeeds Jirachi, so it can encore then sub on the switch. (Or not sub, then encore a SD from Kabutops, expecting a switch. If it does KO Ala, then I can switch in Celebi, without Swords Dance, does it OHKO? I wouldn't think so...)

~T_S
 
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You would have to count on Celebi being above ~75% to counter Gyarados which I feel isn't good. I run both Ice Fang and Stone Edge on my own, and there is no gurantee that Gyarados will not run both.

Its a lose-lose situation either way, Kabutops outspeeds Alakazam with Rain up and can net an easy KO, Jirachi will most probably U-turn or just switch to an appropriate pokemon. Regarding Celebi it gets OHKOed by an X-Scissor.
 
Aquilae said:
You would have to count on Celebi being above ~75% to counter Gyarados which I feel isn't good. I run both Ice Fang and Stone Edge on my own, and there is no gurantee that Gyarados will not run both.

Its a lose-lose situation either way, Kabutops outspeeds Alakazam with Rain up and can net an easy KO, Jirachi will most probably U-turn or just switch to an appropriate pokemon. Regarding Celebi it gets OHKOed by an X-Scissor.
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That's the whole point. It would SD, expecting me to switch, then I encore the SD.

If it does KO Zam, then I can bring in Gyarados. (51.30% - 60.42% from non SD Stone Edge after Intimidate, Gyarados does 54.45% - 64.06% with Rain up. Factoring in Leftovers, Kabutops fails to 2HKO without a SD, and I will always 2HKO, especially because of Life Orb recoil.)

I know I would need to predict well, but I can get around it...using Theorymon. >_<

~T_S
 
The problem with theorymon is that, it's just that, a theory.

While the situation you're suggesting is a perfectly viable one, there could be other ways the situation ends.
 
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