Sandstorm team. RMT time

[Anti]

Taunt can completely shut Wobuffet down and you can make it Struggle getting 25% recoil from it every time Wobuffet uses it.Garchomp however,can't be shut down by Taunt and is very versatile and strong.

Um, what? Please tell me who is idiot enough to bring Wobbuffet in on something that can Taunt! I believe Garchomp should be uber, but Wobby is above and beyond more broken than Garchomp is.

Quite frankly, I think the argument of Taunt against Wobbuffet is the most ridiculous one ever used since Wobbuffet's Shadow Tag prevents switching. That's like saying a team with 5 pokemon weak to Dugtrio and a Skarmory laughs at Dugtrio, when in reality Duggy can trap and kill what dies to it, just like Wobby can.

Also, Garchomp's individual sets each have counters (though very few). Wobbuffet is...totally different.

But come on, who switches a pokemon in on something that counters it? That doesn't really make any sense >.>

 

[Lalapizzame]

Um, what? Please tell me who is idiot enough to bring Wobbuffet in on something that can Taunt! I believe Garchomp should be uber, but Wobby is above and beyond more broken than Garchomp is.

Quite frankly, I think the argument of Taunt against Wobbuffet is the most ridiculous one ever used since Wobbuffet's Shadow Tag prevents switching. That's like saying a team with 5 pokemon weak to Dugtrio and a Skarmory laughs at Dugtrio, when in reality Duggy can trap and kill what dies to it, just like Wobby can.

Also, Garchomp's individual sets each have counters (though very few). Wobbuffet is...totally different.

But come on, who switches a pokemon in on something that counters it? That doesn't really make any sense >.>

Encore is a less common move that can shut it down too.Although,I suppose Skarmory can taunt it and Whirlwind it away and it isn't considered a counter?Now,back to the team.Suicune could have HP Electric to hurt Gyarados while even Ice Beam from Milotic won't do much.On Tyranitar,why Dark Pulse?It has inferior coverage and Ice Beam could replace it for BoltBeam for better coverage.Focus Sash,still won't work on Cacturne.Other common weather can still ruin it and priority moves are even better at ruining it.I wouldn't consider Roar on Hippowdon a neccesity and isn't needed for losing Slack Off is losing vital recovery and your offensive choices...quite obvious.Stealth Rock is really good for Focus Sashers too.

 

[daveyboy]

Encore is a less common move that can shut it down too.Although,I suppose Skarmory can taunt it and Whirlwind it away and it isn't considered a counter?Now,back to the team.Suicune could have HP Electric to hurt Gyarados while even Ice Beam from Milotic won't do much.On Tyranitar,why Dark Pulse?It has inferior coverage and Ice Beam could replace it for BoltBeam for better coverage.Focus Sash,still won't work on Cacturne.Other common weather can still ruin it and priority moves are even better at ruining it.I wouldn't consider Roar on Hippowdon a neccesity and isn't needed for losing Slack Off is losing vital recovery and your offensive choices...quite obvious.Stealth Rock is really good for Focus Sashers too.

well so far you've mentioned 2 moves that can shut it down. Taunt and encore. Both of those are incredibly uncommon on a standard team and you wouldn't dream of including them on pokes if its only to 'counter' wobbufet as you say. And as we have already mentioned if wobbufet gets taunted/encored i am tipping theres no way anyone would be stupid enough to leave it in battle. To counter garchomp you only need to know what set its running and it becomes a bit easier provided you have a good physical wall on the team(hippowdon in my case). Anyways obviously dark pulse for stab and as iv'e mentioned i'd be switching it out in the event of a rival chomp or mence so i don't think ice beam would get much use.

 

[Lalapizzame]

well so far you've mentioned 2 moves that can shut it down. Taunt and encore. Both of those are incredibly uncommon on a standard team and you wouldn't dream of including them on pokes if its only to 'counter' wobbufet as you say. And as we have already mentioned if wobbufet gets taunted/encored i am tipping theres no way anyone would be stupid enough to leave it in battle. To counter garchomp you only need to know what set its running and it becomes a bit easier provided you have a good physical wall on the team(hippowdon in my case). Anyways obviously dark pulse for stab and as iv'e mentioned i'd be switching it out in the event of a rival chomp or mence so i don't think ice beam would get much use.

They're not that uncommon you know.I recall one of them is on a standard set of a pokemon.I think Tyranitar?in which case,isn't just to counter Wobuffet but to block Whirlwinds and Roars.Hippowdon falls to Swords Dance Outrage in 2 hits so it can't KO while Garchomp is helped by Hippowdon then the rest of your team follows Hippowdon's demise.Well,most of it anyway.Garchomp really depends on who gets the tie on speed to bless them and Cacturne might not be enough to KO the weakened Garchomp.Suicune is like Hippowdon.Even Regirock won't survive SUPER Effective Swords Dance Earthquake after like 2-3 hits.Tyranitar instantly gets OHKOed by Earthquake and your whole moveset isn't going to 2HKO Garchomp either because Ice Beam isn't there.

 

[daveyboy]

I'm aware that garchomp has the potential to sweep any team. And besides. hippowdon switches in. garchomp swords dance.Garchomp uses earthquake, hippowdon uses ice fang, puts down to low health, garchomp uses earthquake. hippowdon possibly faints(thats even debatable depending on the set.) Caturne comes in. caturne sucker punches. garchomp faints. Thats one pokemon down. If garchomp quakes first turn rather than swords dance i can slack off the damage without being 2hkod. So either way you're wrong here. And besides im not arguing that garchomp does have a direct counter, i'm saying if you tell me garchomp is broken and wobbufet is not then something is wrong here. Also daveyboy says: Gyrados, Tyranitar to an extent, maybe a few others. I already named tyranitar as one poke that has taunt. Theres about 3 maximum that have taunt in their standard sets so if you are lucky enough to have one of these on your team, maybe you could possibly take down wobbufet despite losing 1-2 pokes max. Once again provided it is your opponents last poke and can't switch out when taunted.

 

[Anti]

Encore is a less common move that can shut it down too.Although,I suppose Skarmory can taunt it and Whirlwind it away and it isn't considered a counter?

Of course it isn't. It's because Wobbuffet STOPS YOU FROM SWITCHING. Also, who uses Taunt on Skarmory? lol

Also, Taunt and Encore ARE that uncommon. DDtar is STRICTLY for late-game sweeping, and bringing it our usually isn't a good idea. In fact, it never is. Gyarados is really the only common pokemon that can Taunt, and Wobbuffet just won't switch in on it. Simple.

Seriously, nothing you say makes any sense. No matter what moves can shut down Wobbuffet, it cannot be countered. Period.

 

[Lalapizzame]

Of course it isn't. It's because Wobbuffet STOPS YOU FROM SWITCHING. Also, who uses Taunt on Skarmory? lol

Also, Taunt and Encore ARE that uncommon. DDtar is STRICTLY for late-game sweeping, and bringing it our usually isn't a good idea. In fact, it never is. Gyarados is really the only common pokemon that can Taunt, and Wobbuffet just won't switch in on it. Simple.

Seriously, nothing you say makes any sense. No matter what moves can shut down Wobbuffet, it cannot be countered. Period.

You do know that I quit that argument like 10 hours ago,right?However,If Wobuffet is the only pokemon left,and Gyarados/Tyranitar is already out on the field,do you think it can escape the wrath of Gyarados/Tyranitar or do anything at all after it's taunted?It can not switch and will die in 5 hits of Struggle.The only way it will escape using Struggle is if it can switch but it can't,so,it's trapped and becomes useless and...we all know the rest.

 

[XaRhS]

if wobuffet isn't hurt at all it won't die in five struggles,it's impossible(especially when it's ev'd in hp,if it is then yes

 

[Lalapizzame]

if wobuffet isn't hurt at all it won't die in five struggles,it's impossible(especially when it's ev'd in hp,if it is then yes

25% HP gets taken away every Struggle.That's not factoring in Gyarados' Waterfall which would make it die even faster.So,even then it still dies in 5 Struggles.

 

[XaRhS]

i didn't know that struggle makes 25% damage.......thanks.

 

[Anti]

You do know that I quit that argument like 10 hours ago,right?However,If Wobuffet is the only pokemon left,and Gyarados/Tyranitar is already out on the field,do you think it can escape the wrath of Gyarados/Tyranitar or do anything at all after it's taunted?It can not switch and will die in 5 hits of Struggle.The only way it will escape using Struggle is if it can switch but it can't,so,it's trapped and becomes useless and...we all know the rest.

IF Wobbuffet is the last pokemon. If anything is the last pokemon and it's up against something that has the upper hand, it's going to lose. That's like saying "If Moltres is your last pokemon and you're up against Snorlax, you're toast." But again, Wobby will not come in on anything with Taunt. If it's the last pokemon is a VERY big "if."

Anyways, pretty much what everybody esle has said for the rest of the team.

 

[XaRhS]

anyways.....if wobuffet is last it can't affect your team unless it has psychic......but......even then it can't affect you BADLY because of it's low stats(even with ev training,you must use all of its ev on its spattack)which means that wobbuffet isn't an appropriate pokemon for a team unless you know how to use it(cheaterly ha!)

 

[Lalapizzame]

anyways.....if wobuffet is last it can't affect your team unless it has psychic......but......even then it can't affect you BADLY because of it's low stats(even with ev training,you must use all of its ev on its spattack)which means that wobbuffet isn't an appropriate pokemon for a team unless you know how to use it(cheaterly ha!)

It can't learn Psychic.It can't even learn Rest.So you're wasting your time EV Training it in Spec.Attack.

 

[XaRhS]

but.....it's not normal.wobbuffet is a psychic type.have you tested that?

 

[Lalapizzame]

but.....it's not normal.wobbuffet is a psychic type.have you tested that?

Yes.I looked at a guide I bought and no TMs or Psychic was there.It's called common sense.Why would a Wobuffet,with base 33 Spec.Attack stat get banned to Ubers because of Psychic?Psychic bounces off Blissey and Leftovers shaves the damage right off.

 

[XaRhS]

right.the guide probably didn't take into account the ev training in spattack
without ev training in spattack wobbuffet isn't able to perform a strong psychic
i suggest you not to go with wobbuffet.you'll get into trouble.........
why don't you use something else instead of wobbuffet?

 

[Anti]

right.the guide probably didn't take into account the ev training in spattack
without ev training in spattack wobbuffet isn't able to perform a strong psychic
i suggest you not to go with wobbuffet.you'll get into trouble.........
why don't you use something else instead of wobbuffet?

No, it can't learn Psychic at all. Wobbuffet gets Encore, Destiny Bond, Splash, Mirror Coat, Counter, Charm, Safeguard, and that's about it. (There might be a few others, but Psychic isn't one of them.) Wobbuffet is immensely powerful due to its ability of Shadow Tag, however.

 

[Dark Azelf]

]

right.the guide probably didn't take into account the ev training in spattack
without ev training in spattack wobbuffet isn't able to perform a strong psychic
i suggest you not to go with wobbuffet.you'll get into trouble.........
why don't you use something else instead of wobbuffet?

What the hell ?? Why wouldnt the guide take into account of ev training in sp.att. Wobuffet isnt a sweeper and cant learn any TMS.


Wobuffett@Leftovers
6 HP / 252 DEF / 252 SP.DEF
Bold nature
- Counter
- Mirror Coat
- Encore
- Safeguard / Charm

I hope you realize how broken that combination of moves is along with its ability, Shadow Tag, you cant switch out


If you try and set up on it, Swords Dance etc, it Encores and you go to another pokemon. If you decide to attack it , you get owned simple as that.

 

[Lalapizzame]

]




What the hell ?? Why wouldnt the guide take into account of ev training in sp.att. Wobuffet isnt a sweeper and cant learn any TMS.


Wobuffett@Leftovers
6 HP / 252 DEF / 252 SP.DEF
Bold nature
- Counter
- Mirror Coat
- Encore
- Safeguard / Charm

I hope you realize how broken that combination of moves is along with its ability, Shadow Tag, you cant switch out


If you try and set up on it, Swords Dance etc, it Encores and you go to another pokemon. If you decide to attack it , you get owned simple as that.

I already told him Wob. can't learn any TMs.Although the RMT should follow your moveset.

 

[XaRhS]

]




What the hell ?? Why wouldnt the guide take into account of ev training in sp.att. Wobuffet isnt a sweeper and cant learn any TMS.


Wobuffett@Leftovers
6 HP / 252 DEF / 252 SP.DEF
Bold nature
- Counter
- Mirror Coat
- Encore
- Safeguard / Charm

I hope you realize how broken that combination of moves is along with its ability, Shadow Tag, you cant switch out


If you try and set up on it, Swords Dance etc, it Encores and you go to another pokemon. If you decide to attack it , you get owned simple as that.

if wobbuffet is the last pokemon, then encore isn't really a problem.you just raise your attack for 1-6 turns and you kill it!but if there are any other pokemon in game you're screwd because of swadow tag!then you must focus on the other pokemon until wobbuffet stays alone.and if it encores both of your pokemon then......make a wish
swadow tag and encore are the BIG problems