What is the big deal of Atheism?

[Gymnotide]

HIHIHIHIHI READ ME PLZ
YOU ARE ALL WRONG
You can be atheist and religious at the same time. Get it straight, people. Being atheist doesn't mean that you don't believe in an afterlife, spiritual forces, ritual, praying, and whatnot. It just means you don't care for / distrust the existence of deities.

 

[Townes]

Whilst that's true, Gymnotide, one, your approach to telling us that was totally abrasive, and two, generally, atheists don't believe in an afterlife, spiritual forces, etc. It's the minuscule minority who don't believe in a deity but do believe in other spiritual things.

 

[Alley Cat]

Gymnotide, like townes said, that is true. But your approach was abrasive. It is things like this that are "the big deal fo atheism." People make big deals or are rude about it, and then they create a bad name for the others.

I'm agnostic, leaning towards deitism. I believe in plenty of spiritual stuff. I have plenty of atheist friends who believe in ghosts and spirits. Atheism comes from the Greek word atheos meaning lack of god. Many atheist are assumed to be irreligious, but this is often NOT the case. Many have spiritual beliefs and the like, they just don't believe in any deities. People these days tend to misconstrue many words and their actual meanings in todays society.

 

[Careful With That Axe Pichu!]

Agnostic what?

With all due respect, that's none of your business. I am agnostic and that's all anyone needs to know; the only reason I stated it was to avoid prejudice against my reply... I'm sorry.

You know, I almost added a disclaimer to the end, stating "This of course doesn't apply to all religious people, only the ones that this topic is about, the ones who hate atheists".

But know what, you didn't. :s However, I still think that no disclaimer would really ease the peremptory tone of your post.

 

[Gymnotide]

I couldn't imagine myself being atheist, I mean, dying would literally be the end for them. (No afterlife)

Whilst that's true, Gymnotide, one, your approach to telling us that was totally abrasive, and two, generally, atheists don't believe in an afterlife, spiritual forces, etc. It's the minuscule minority who don't believe in a deity but do believe in other spiritual things.

Gymnotide, like townes said, that is true. But your approach was abrasive. It is things like this that are "the big deal fo atheism." People make big deals or are rude about it, and then they create a bad name for the others.

I'm agnostic, leaning towards deitism. I believe in plenty of spiritual stuff. I have plenty of atheist friends who believe in ghosts and spirits. Atheism comes from the Greek word atheos meaning lack of god. Many atheist are assumed to be irreligious, but this is often NOT the case. Many have spiritual beliefs and the like, they just don't believe in any deities. People these days tend to misconstrue many words and their actual meanings in todays society.

I laughed a bit at how serious you guys are taking this. However, I know you're good sports about it.

(1) The majority of "atheists" are actually non-deistic religious. Atheists are composed of the following: antireligious / irreligious / secular, Buddhism, Jainism, Carvaka, modern Hinduism, Taoism / Confucianism, Scientology, Spiritism, liberal Christianity, some Universal-Unitarianism, reform Judaism, some Vodoun, and many fringe religious (Neo-Paganism, Raelism, neo-indigenous religions, etc.). While it's probably useless to mention these in this thread, it needs to be pointed out that the latter half FAR outnumbers the anti/irr/sec atheists, but are still atheistic in practice. If this thread is going to mention how people discriminate against those who don't believe in God or god(s), we can't rule out the vast majority that somehow get exemption.

(2) Plenty of atheists believe in spiritual forces and the afterlife.

(3) I am not advocating atheism in any way, nor speaking on behalf of atheists. I am only mentioning the fact because this thread, like the countless others in its past, make a poor generalization of "atheism".

 

[Esper]

I think it's not generalizing as much as we're talking about two different things and using the same word for them. For you (and others) atheism includes the non-deistic religions and can include people who believe in spiritual things while for others the word 'atheism' is not quite so technical and basically means (since there's no better term) a person who doesn't believe in supernatural things commonly associated with religion.

Soooo... when you say something like

Plenty of atheists believe in spiritual forces and the afterlife.

it causes some confusion. I was skimming through this thread and was about to say something like "That doesn't make any sense. Where's your proof of that?" until I saw that we weren't talking about the exact same thing.

 

[Gymnotide]

I think it's not generalizing as much as we're talking about two different things and using the same word for them. For you (and others) atheism includes the non-deistic religions and can include people who believe in spiritual things while for others the word 'atheism' is not quite so technical and basically means (since there's no better term) a person who doesn't believe in supernatural things commonly associated with religion.

Soooo... when you say something like
it causes some confusion. I was skimming through this thread and was about to say something like "That doesn't make any sense. Where's your proof of that?" until I saw that we weren't talking about the exact same thing.

My point was that you're addressing anti/irr/sec atheists specifically now, but some of the arguments in this thread target the overarching group of atheists. My other point was that's it's completely necessary to split deism and religiousness; we do have better terms for what you're addressing: antireligious (opposes religion), irreligious (does not follow religion), and secular (separates religion).

 

[JimJams]

Agnostic what?

I'm so glad that someone posted this! :D

 

[Romantica]

You know, I almost added a disclaimer to the end, stating "This of course doesn't apply to all religious people, only the ones that this topic is about, the ones who hate atheists".

But you didn't, which basically made your entire post a great big assumption. A close-minded one at that. Bravo.


Anyway, no one can really speak for the Christian person that "hates" an atheist unless it's pertaining to themselves. I for one don't exactly hate anyone, but the minute someone decides to blatantly disrespect my beliefs in a fashion that most athiests I've encountered have done before, I will immediately write them off as not worth my time. I've met more atheists that have tried shoving their beliefs into my face before I've even gotten the chance to explain my actual beliefs other than the fact that I believe in God. It's a little ironic, considering that's the first complaint they run to whenever the subject comes up.

I once had a discussion (not an argument, as I am for gay marriage as well) with an atheist that fought fiercely for gay rights, using the argument "it doesn't affect your life, why should you have any say what they feel?". Quite funny when I turned that around on them when they just couldn't grasp the idea of me believing in a higher power.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

Most people hate Atheists such as myself. I mean, what is the big deal? We don't have the same beliefs as you, do not try to convert us... If you want to, leave us be to believe what WE WANT.

If they respect me and my religion, I'll respect them and theirs.

 

[Gymnotide]

But you didn't, which basically made your entire post a great big assumption. A close-minded one at that. Bravo.

I fail to see how that made his post an assumption if he openly admits that he was addressing a certain group. The only assumption that was made was that you would know what group he was posting about, but that isn't "close-minded". This thread is targeted at the individuals HarrisonH mentioned, so it's not like it was an inappropriate thing to say either. Yes, it may have been generalized, but it's more immature than anything to overlook his admittance of that fact.

Though, in posting this, I am also perpetuating a discussion that ought not happen; I'd rather not see this get replied to.

However, back to the actual discussion:

Anyway, no one can really speak for the Christian person that "hates" an atheist unless it's pertaining to themselves. I for one don't exactly hate anyone, but the minute someone decides to blatantly disrespect my beliefs in a fashion that most athiests I've encountered have done before, I will immediately write them off as not worth my time. I've met more atheists that have tried shoving their beliefs into my face before I've even gotten the chance to explain my actual beliefs other than the fact that I believe in God. It's a little ironic, considering that's the first complaint they run to whenever the subject comes up.

I'm not against your viewpoint in anyway, but are you sure that this is the true majority? Are you sure you aren't just noticing them because they do that (overshadowing the atheists who don't say a word)? I know that as an atheist-secular myself, I prefer to stay out of religious discussion simply because faith is a death-zone to a lot of people. I'm aware that there are atheist-antireligious who are more bellicose about their beliefs, but I also know that plenty of atheist-irreligious and atheist-secular people are rather friendly and avoid the useless rabble. Of course, it might also be your area specifically.

Overall, I feel like the whole thing is blown out of proportion anyway. It's not hard to imagine why atheist-irr/sec get angry at religion (and become atheist-anti) when there are so many religious individuals who are overly forward. I'm not saying that most are like that, but (like the phenomena I mentioned above) religion-pushers have some magical ability to overshadow others of their faith. Both sides have angry people who get angry at each other--and this makes it a lot easier to feel antagonistic toward the whole.

Also, the other day, I was approached by this extremely kind lady in the park while I was with my boyfriend; she handed the both of us a pamphlet about God and told us to convert to save us from our sins. For me, it was a major annoyance; my boyfriend, who is Catholic already, was also bothered. So it's not really like it's a two-sided war either. But, I feel like this thread is framed like it is.

 

[The Void]

Some really religious people just look down on people and think, "Oh, he's an atheist, he won't be saved. He will die for eternal blah blah blah" and all that stuff.

They think that being with them will make them "die eternally" or whatever so they stay away from the atheist. (Yes, this is almost similar to racism.)

Of course not all people are like that. Some befriend atheists, no matter what religion they are.

It can also be an atheist who thinks rude stuff. He looks down on the religious guy and says, "You believe in God and that's wrong. God didn't create humans, humans created blah blah blah blah" and they will try to prove things to them or even threaten them.

I don't really care what your belief is, "No God" or "There is a God" or "There are gods" or even "I am God." I respect you people's beliefs.

As long as you have a nice friendly attitude and as long as you don't kill or harm people, anyone could be my friend...

Yup even you, NDogg45. A complete stranger I have no idea about.

So, that's the big deal with atheism. Now that I'm done with my awesome speech, I shall return to watching my anime thingy...

 

[JimJams]

Try to prove things? You mean with logic, reason and even the dreaded science? Oh no!

And anyone who would go so far as to threaten someone for their beliefs is indeed an immense uh..butt. I do agree with you there.

 

[Oryx]

Try to prove things? You mean with logic, reason and even the dreaded science? Oh no!

If it's not asked for, it's just not polite to try to "prove things" to someone who hasn't tried to argue with you about religion, that's the point that he was trying to make.

 

[Akio123]

Lemme start by saying, I too am an Athiest.

Alright, it's been said before it has to do with how people are raised. It boils down to people not understanding people different than they are. I mean being predisposed to certain beliefs and being completely engulfed in them makes it harder for others to accept them. It's why such a thing as moral relativism exists.

 

[Romantica]

I'm not against your viewpoint in anyway, but are you sure that this is the true majority? Are you sure you aren't just noticing them because they do that (overshadowing the atheists who don't say a word)? I know that as an atheist-secular myself, I prefer to stay out of religious discussion simply because faith is a death-zone to a lot of people. I'm aware that there are atheist-antireligious who are more bellicose about their beliefs, but I also know that plenty of atheist-irreligious and atheist-secular people are rather friendly and avoid the useless rabble. Of course, it might also be your area specifically.

Overall, I feel like the whole thing is blown out of proportion anyway. It's not hard to imagine why atheist-irr/sec get angry at religion (and become atheist-anti) when there are so many religious individuals who are overly forward. I'm not saying that most are like that, but (like the phenomena I mentioned above) religion-pushers have some magical ability to overshadow others of their faith. Both sides have angry people who get angry at each other--and this makes it a lot easier to feel antagonistic toward the whole.

Also, the other day, I was approached by this extremely kind lady in the park while I was with my boyfriend; she handed the both of us a pamphlet about God and told us to convert to save us from our sins. For me, it was a major annoyance; my boyfriend, who is Catholic already, was also bothered. So it's not really like it's a two-sided war either. But, I feel like this thread is framed like it is.

I don't really remember saying that I was talking about the "true majority", in fact I purposely avoided stating that in my post because I don't like generalizing in discussions such as this. I was referring to the majority that I myself have personally encountered that have left a sour taste in my mouth the same way obnoxious Christians come across to atheists. I fully respect other people's beliefs unless they give me a reason not to, such as trying to belittle mine. It may be a little immature, but that's an admitted weakness since I'm a bit prideful.

Also, if I were in a situation like you'd mentioned above I'd also have been bothered, being a Catholic myself. I actually remember being invited to a friend's Baptist youth group when I was younger that deliberately stated my religion was wrong and the way I worshiped was completely wrong. So not only is this not a two-sided war, it's also pretty bad that there are wars between neighboring religions. It'll never stop though.

 

[Aorio]

I am an Atheist. But I suppose I'm Agnostic, really, because I don't believe in God, but at the same time I am open to any ideas.
According to Wikipedia, almost 80% of the American population is Christian. Only 16% are unaffiliated (Atheist or Agnostic). Most of my friends are Christian, my boyfriend is Christian. I love these people to death. We have no boundaries between us just because of our differing views.
There will always be good Atheists and bad Atheists, and by the same token good Christians and bad Christians. What bothers me about a lot of Christians I encounter (I truly am not trying to generalize) is that as soon as they find out I'm not religious, they look at me as if I'm less of a person. So many of them judge me. It's terrible. And of course, just because I don't believe in God, I'm automatically going to Hell, no matter how many good and just things I've done in my life, you look at me, see that I'm not Christian, and put me in this category of my own with the other 16% of the population labeled HELL. And yet, I'm just like anybody else.. I love my life. I've never touched drugs or cigarettes. I'm a virgin. I'm very kind. My morals are in all the right places. I don't judge you because you believe in what I never have. I don't judge you because of what you grew up being taught. I leave alone, so why can't you return the favor? Why can't you understand me? Why do you label me? Why do you shun me?

 

[Gymnotide]

I don't really remember saying that I was talking about the "true majority", in fact I purposely avoided stating that in my post because I don't like generalizing in discussions such as this. I was referring to the majority that I myself have personally encountered that have left a sour taste in my mouth the same way obnoxious Christians come across to atheists. I fully respect other people's beliefs unless they give me a reason not to, such as trying to belittle mine. It may be a little immature, but that's an admitted weakness since I'm a bit prideful.

Also, if I were in a situation like you'd mentioned above I'd also have been bothered, being a Catholic myself. I actually remember being invited to a friend's Baptist youth group when I was younger that deliberately stated my religion was wrong and the way I worshiped was completely wrong. So not only is this not a two-sided war, it's also pretty bad that there are wars between neighboring religions. It'll never stop though.

I meant "true majority" meaning in respect to you.

 

[Luck]

Anyway, no one can really speak for the Christian person that "hates" an atheist unless it's pertaining to themselves. I for one don't exactly hate anyone, but the minute someone decides to blatantly disrespect my beliefs in a fashion that most athiests I've encountered have done before, I will immediately write them off as not worth my time. I've met more atheists that have tried shoving their beliefs into my face before I've even gotten the chance to explain my actual beliefs other than the fact that I believe in God. It's a little ironic, considering that's the first complaint they run to whenever the subject comes up.

This has actually been my experience with most open atheists. I know they aren't the majority by a long shot, but as a whole they're more annoying than any openly religious person that I've met.

Maybe that's the big deal with 'em.

 

[Mr. X]

All I can say about athiests is that, well, when you die you've got a 50% chance of going to Hell. (I hope that someone understands this. I've had to explain this particular statement in numerous discussions about religion)

Personally, I don't care what you beleive in. You don't try shoving your beliefs down my throat and i'll won't try shoving my beliefs down yours.

That said, im Agnostic.