XY OU BP Suspect Test

[Zeffy]

After a rigorous discussion in the Smogon forums, the voting process for Baton Pass has begun. BP teams were always annoying but with the introduction of Speed Boost Scolipede, it became even more annoying. The options are:

1. Do nothing and keep the metagame as it is;
2. Forbid the use of the move Baton Pass on more than 3 Pokémon on the same team (complex ban);
3. Ban the combination of the move Baton Pass in conjunction with the ability Magic Bounce and the ability Speed Boost (complex ban).

What would you choose and why?

notable BP discussion threads: pre-suspect test, suspect test

 

[Dr. Silver]

Personally I'm all for keeping this aspect of the meta game untouched, while not an abuser of the strategy myself (yet), I do find it to be a legitimate strategy that a team-builder should consider preparing themselves for.

However with that said though, I'll bow to public opinion as many Smogonites will take great issue with my first statement and say that option number 2 seems to be the more appropriate choice. Baton Pass on 3 Pokemon alone seems like total overkill for the destructive force that Baton Pass can imbue on some Pokemon. I don't envy the person that has to go up against the Mega Aggron with +3 Speed and +4 Attack...

 

[Nah]

So they finally started the suspect test for this?

When I originally heard about this, I didn't really feel like BP teams needed to be dealt with, but after battling some of them....I really want them to do something about it.

I feel that option number three is probably the best way to go with this. It's easy enough to deal with full Baton Pass teams via phazing, but every single BP team I've ever seen has Magic Bounce Espeon on it. It's really hard to phaze with that around. Option 2 sounds nice, but all you really need to make a BP team work are a Magic Bounce Espeon and one other Baton Passer, so limiting teams to 3 BP users wouldn't really help.

But is Smogon actually considering a complex ban? If they are, I'm glad but surprised; they have never seemed to like implementing complex bans.

 

[Zeffy]

Voting phase is over. We're still missing a few votes, but they would not make any difference. Here are the results of the vote:

Option #1: 8
Option #2: 40
Option #3: 17

Options #2 and #3 together achieved a supermajority of 87.6%. For these reasons, option #1 is ruled out and option #2 (Forbid the use of the move Baton Pass on more than 3 Pokémon on the same team) wins.

The complex ban will be implemented on our official simulator as soon as possible.

Voting is now finished! Thoughts on the results?

Again, here is the voting thread for anyone who wants to confirm: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threa...ss-round-3-voting.3508983/page-3#post-5525507

 

[Anti]

This was the best outcome: nerfing an overpowered playstyle that makes the OU ladder a draaaag while keeping Baton Pass itself intact. I can't see how anyone could possibly be upset with this. Even if you don't agree with the ban/nerf, it's not like it's going to ruin OU or something lol.

 

[Hikamaru]

So apparently they decided on forbidding Baton Pass on more than 3 Pokemon in the same team, which I think is a solid enough nerfing, like what Anti said. It keeps the move's niche intact, while not ruining the OU ladders at the same time. Good decision on your part Smogon. I'm sure the OU metagame will be more balanced now.

 

[Nah]

I'm glad that they decided to nerf Baton Pass....but I'm not so sure that that particular method is the best way to do it. But whatever, at least BP teams should be less of a pain in the ass now.

 

[KorpiklaaniVodka]

Baton Pass should have not been nerfed. There are way too many counters to it, including, but not limited to:

- Prankster/Mold Breaker Taunt
- Roar/Whirlwind (preferably with Mold Breaker)
- Early offensive pressure (Dragon Dance Dragonite/Haxorus/Salamence, Kyurem-B who can defeat all members of a Baton Pass chain, Choice Band Talonflame, Belly Drum Azumarill)
- Haze Quagsire/Murkrow
- Perish Song Politoed
- Calm Mind/Taunt Mega Gardevoir
- SmashPass
- Encore
- Doom Desire Jirachi
- Red Card + Taunt Deoxys-D
- etc.

Sure, Baton Pass can get past some of these counters with proper prediction (especially with Magic Bounce Espeon), but imo that doesn't make it broken.

 

[MoxieInfinite]

And how many of those are viable outside of ♥♥♥♥ing with BP? How many "good" Pokemon have Mold Breaker Taunt/pseudo hazing moves.
Haze Quagsire can be outstalled.