Are we losing our intelligence?

[Yoshikko]

Yes I agree. Intelligence =/= knowledge, those two are very seperate! Intelligence also has to do with how children are treated when they were younger btw. Kids who aren't touched or hugged by their parents when they were small or never looked at in the eyes by them, can get an underdeveloped brain because of that. And drinking and smoking during pregnancy also affects IQ of the baby.

 

[lx_theo]

What does them being forgotten have to do with whether or not people are losing intelligence? That has nothing to do with it imo.

Not the point. The point is that people are forgotten, and whenever the recent crop of stupidity reaches our ears, we proclaim it the greatest degrading factor of humanity.

The issue I propose is perception, not dealing so much with reality.

 

[Karma Police]

Well imo, both yes and no. Yes, there is a part of the world's population, that is definitely getting dumber and dumber, but again, there is the part that can easily be considered intelligent.

First off, intelligence can range from anything, it can mean common sense (which is probably what bladeofdarkness meant in the first post), it can mean basic knowledge of everything, or it can even mean having advanced knowledge in one field like science. What I feel is, that most people are now starting to lack in the common sense and basic knowledge department.

The human race can be said to be getting dumber and dumber generation after generation. Most people nowadays are just dumping their education and trying to get better in social skills. This basically screws up your common sense (what will hurt you/is good for you kind of stuff) and your basic knowledge, which will eventually make you jobless. Everywhere I see people (by people, I mean, 16-18 year olds) asking whether the sun is a star or not, or who Adolf Hitler was (all of this is stuff everybody is taught at a young age. You are supposed to know these things) This also leads to one doing incredibly stupid stuff like mentioned in the first post.

But then, there ARE people who are highly curious about how things work and are always eager to gain more knowledge and expand their points of view. (who are nowadays called nerds) They are the ones who are making sure that the human race as a whole can't really be called "unintelligent".

But intelligence doesn't only mean knowledge. Even if you are able to debate with sensible points you will probably be considered intelligent by people for your knowledge about the different ways of the world.

tl;dr what I mean to say is, intelligence depends on how you look at it. But yes, while the newer generations are getting dumber there are some people who bail us out. Just because of some idiotic people in the world everybody can't be generalized into that category. That's like saying dogs are now a dying species because a few of them weren't born right.

That's kind of an interesting position to take. Obviously we can't test this, and testing intelligence is a dodgy business to begin with, but what makes you think a person from centuries ago would be able to handle a modern education?

To me, part of intelligence, and the part that's forming a large part of my opinion, is measured by intellectual curiosity. I get the impression that was a bigger thing around the time of the scientific revolution up through the 70s and the space program and all that, and that we've kinda collectively slacked in the last couple of decades.

I don't think people in ye olde times were very curious. Maybe education could have sparked something, but I think the pervading worldview back then was more of that Protestant work ethic stuff - just work, don't think 'bout stuff, when you die things'll be okay, trust us, etc.

I doubt that a 15th century guy would even WANT to pursue a 21st century education. Either that person would have to be completely illiterate to be taught about modern science, or have the knowledge of a kindergarten student. Otherwise I'm pretty sure they'd resist. They'd probably have a hard time believing everything they were taught back then was all false or incorrect.

I don't think I entirely agree with the second part. People are still fairly curious about things in this era as well. There are still minor breakthroughs occurring every now and then, but unfortunately they are overshadowed by political problems and they are probably just too small to report. But yes, they do happen frequently, and it's safe to assume that some of these discoveries could lead to something big in the future, imo.

And as for the last part, yes. Although it was not necessarily the fact that they weren't curious enough, it's just the fact that people believed that everything that couldn't be explained was God's doing. Things like Lightning and how the earth was the center of the universe. And I guess people learnt to just accept things that way, life was already pretty hard in those times without thinking about these things that could easily be considered minor at that time. At least, that's what I have read lol. I may be wrong.

 

[ninryu]

The majority of humanity is what you can call "idiots". Humankind is developing through intelligent and talented individuals; and while their efforts improves the human life and knowledge, they cannot make individuals into smarter.
In other words, most people aren't very different from rural horde.

 

[Dawn]

Human beings are designed by nature to do 'bad' or 'dumb' things, often in particular ways. Often times they serve an evolutionary purpose in and of themselves in that if we were trained to avoid negative things we would be unable to grow stronger via dealing with the 'conflict' that ensues.

Thus, in actuality, we are continuously demonstrating a failure to defy nature rather than a drop in intelligence.

 

[Alexander Nicholi]

I think that people from a long time ago were unintelligent and/or stupid, and people nowadays are still dumb, but in a different way. Technology is being forwarded into development to make an endless array of things in life easier, and as the vast majority of corporations, politicians, and "famous folk" in general don't realize, everthing in this realm has consequences/reprocussions of one sort or another. What these "famous folk" don't see is that the reprocussions of making everything easier includes most of the population getting lazier, fatter, and more notably dumber. Three thousand years ago it worked in an opposite but equally undesirable manner: People worked, worked, worked, worked, and worked some more and had to do everything by hand, although people we're equally dumbed out by the medieval religions of the time, as religion is, in my understanding, a way to control the population, simply put.

So, yes and no: The population is dumber, but in a different way from before.

 

[Rogue planet]

It's kind of worrying to see people's views on intelligence in this thread.

Lazy? Fat? Doesn't do a lot of work? Has too many children? Doesn't really know much about the world around them? Is this what makes someone stupid or useless? I don't think most people would choose to be this way, it's a way of life that for some people is forced upon them. There are hundreds of different possible circumstances people matching these criteria could be in.

I know a guy who is pretty fat, lazy and unemployed, and he's one of the smartest people I've ever known. One of my old best friends from school failed terribly in his education, he's worked in fast food or cleaning jobs for the past 4 years, and is a father at 19 yet he still works his ass off in the shittiest jobs imaginable to try and provide for his kid. Is he a retarded idiot that society would be better off without? We need tons of people to do these crappy jobs, where would we be without them? I could describe plenty more people like this.

If you're slim, active, attractive and work often, does that automatically make you a model citizen?

It's so easy to judge people that you don't even know. Instantly dismissing someone who is horrible is fair enough and I do it all of the time, but intelligence is not such an easy thing to judge someone over. You wouldn't judge someone with a disability, why would you judge someone who isn't capable of higher intellectual thought? Take a look at yourself, just briefly, what makes you so great; why are you a better person? I highly doubt anyone here is the next ground-breaking scientist.


And yet again I'll drag history into this. We all remember Albert Einstein, Isaac Newton; but where would society be without all the of "stupid" people, the commoners, who worked the factories, tended to farms and crops, placed the bricks of every building that stands today, and assembled your car that you enjoy driving everyday.

Yes I am a dirty communist deal with it.

 

[Nihilego]

I really think it's surprising how easy it is for people to dismiss others who have many children, drink a lot, let themselves get overweight or whatever, as unintelligent. I'm with Vendak on this one; you can't tell anything about someone you've never met. You can't say that someone who shows certain habits or choices is immediately less intelligent and is dragging the human race down. I'd like to know why it is that such things are considered to show a lack of intelligence - and if you don't show them, are you suddenly perfect? "If you're slim, active, attractive and work often, does that automatically make you a model citizen?" is basically what I'm trying to say here.

However, I've been hearing about some things which makes me doubt the intelligence of some of those people, like how some people die for some of the dumbest reasons that are conceivable.

Such as? Death is usually caused by misfortune, not sheer lack of intelligence. I don't think I know anyone so dumb that they're a danger to themselves anyway. People automatically protect and care for themselves. It's instinct.

Also, I've heard that there are a bunch of crazy people everywhere, which makes me believe that that a lot of these people should belong in an asylum & in a strait-jacket.

Watch how you define "crazy people". if they're in public, they're probably safe. And, as said earlier, this is nothing new at all. Mental illness is an issue for some. It's always been one. It always will be one. I don't get how, because there are "crazy people everywhere" (everywhere being something else you need to look at), we're suddenly less intelligent on the whole.

 

[Archenoth]

Generalizing people, even if society looks down on them, is a very bad thing to do, you cannot judge a person's intelligence by how lazy or lax they are. And you certainly can't judge based off of their stature, be it skinny or stout.

Such as? Death is usually caused by misfortune, not sheer lack of intelligence. I don't think I know anyone so dumb that they're a danger to themselves anyway. People automatically protect and care for themselves. It's instinct.

This is true, but there are still people who have shown a lack of intelligence to the degree of dangering themselves. Have you ever heard of The Darwin Awards? It's pretty much a compilation of people doing dumb things that, uhh, greatly inhibits their ability to live.

 

[Nihilego]

I remember The Darwin Awards from a long time ago and absolutely love it! But I can't help but think they apply to only a very, very small number of people. Regardless of that, if it happens now, it's probably happened previously. No change there; nothing to suggest we're losing intelligence.

 

[TRIFORCE89]

We're a smart species made up of dumb individuals. It's just easier to see that today through the Internet and the media. We see the world now.

 

[Blade_of_darkness]

Such as? Death is usually caused by misfortune, not sheer lack of intelligence. I don't think I know anyone so dumb that they're a danger to themselves anyway. People automatically protect and care for themselves. It's instinct.

That may be so, but it is very possible for someone to die from someone else's dumb mistakes or actions. Most of the deaths that I've seen on 1,000 ways to die involve dumb people dying dumb ways. It may be possible that I could be watching it a little too much, but making fun out of someone else's expense is good entertainment.

However, I would love an explanation why you think that people with mental illness shouldn't be in a mental hospital.

 

[Nihilego]

That may be so, but it is very possible for someone to die from someone else's dumb mistakes or actions. Most of the deaths that I've seen on 1,000 ways to die involve dumb people dying dumb ways. It may be possible that I could be watching it a little too much, but making fun out of someone else's expense is good entertainment.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but 1000 ways to die is only 1000 people, right? It's a very small and carefully picked sample there to look particularly stupid. I don't really think it applies to the whole population.

However, I would love an explanation why you think that people with mental illness shouldn't be in a mental hospital.

When people think of 'mental illness' they tend to think of people running around screaming about voices telling them to kill people from what I've seen, or something along those lines. And that's... just wrong most of the time tbqh. It's just not black and white enough to say that everyone with a mental illness should immediately be hospitalised. There is a massive amount of variation between individuals and saying that they're all dangerous is painting with a very large brush indeed.

 

[Outkin]

I think we're more losing our common sense if anything. I've seen people try taking something out of a hot oven and are surprised when their hand got burnt. But even with things like that are know common knowlage, with something as simple as we live on a round planet called earth...at one point we didn't know this. Theres lots of actually really complex things that all of us know about or how to do, and we brush it off as common knowlage or with a "Duh!".

 

[Livewire]

Intelligence is like a set capacity to learn, is what I always thought. A capacity for learning. What one can learn or a person's knowledge is what can change, not their intelligence, if that makes sense.

 

[Karma Police]

However, I would love an explanation why you think that people with mental illness shouldn't be in a mental hospital.

No. Mental illness can range from anything. I think you used a rather broad term there, I think you meant people who are criminally insane.

Mental Illness can be defined as -

mental illness n.
Any of various disorders characterized chiefly by abnormal behavior or an inability to function socially, including diseases of the mind and personality and certain diseases of the brain. Also called mental disease , mental disorder .

There is a huge difference because there a lot of mental disorders. I can see why one would put a person suffering from a dangerous mental disorder which makes them a criminal in a mental institute, but not somebody who suffers from agoraphobia.

 

[Nihilego]

Intelligence is like a set capacity to learn, is what I always thought. A capacity for learning. What one can learn or a person's knowledge is what can change, not their intelligence, if that makes sense.

This. This is what I always thought too - intelligence is set at one point from a very early age and it's what helps us to gain knowledge, but isn't equal to our level of knowledge. It's like if you take an IQ test, go away, graduate from university with a degree in medicine and then come back and take it again, as far as I know your IQ won't have increased - just your knowledge of a complex subject.

edit; that said, I don't really think IQ is a reliable test of intelligence anyway so lol.

I think we're more losing our common sense if anything. I've seen people try taking something out of a hot oven and are surprised when their hand got burnt.

Fair point, but has that not always happened?

But even with things like that are know common knowlage, with something as simple as we live on a round planet called earth...at one point we didn't know this. Theres lots of actually really complex things that all of us know about or how to do, and we brush it off as common knowlage or with a "Duh!".

So if anything... this shows progression, does it not? We now know more about our world than we used to and if, as you say, we can dismiss complex things with a simple "duh", doesn't that show how much easier it is for us to perform complex tasks? Imo these things support the idea that we're becoming more intelligent.

 

[Mana1]

This. This is what I always thought too - intelligence is set at one point from a very early age and it's what helps us to gain knowledge, but isn't equal to our level of knowledge. It's like if you take an IQ test, go away, graduate from university with a degree in medicine and then come back and take it again, as far as I know your IQ won't have increased - just your knowledge of a complex subject.

edit; that said, I don't really think IQ is a reliable test of intelligence anyway so lol.

I third this opinion, intelligence =/= knowledge.

And IQ tests mostly solve problem solving and mental agility things, which I suppose is a good indicator of intelligence in some respects - but some people take things a lot slower and so can process a lot more, so it is flawed.

I check my IQ every few years, apart from wavering a few points it has stayed the same from the age of 10 til now (20).

I don't think we are losing out intelligence, forming of language is seen as one of the most intelligent thought processes and we're constantly changing our language, however we are losing our thirst for knowledge. Kids seem much more content with googling homework and things rather than learning and retaining the information - whereas they might have done this a few decades a go with books it is much easier and readily available now, and exploited way too much. People rely on the internet to tell them things they don't know, and don't bother learning it as they can always find it again when they next need it (I know I'm guilty of that).

We often think of ourselves as the most intelligent animals, but really I would put forward that we have just utilised our intellect differently. We made some tools and ran with it, now there is so much diversity in intelligence among humans I daresay Cetaceans and Cephalopods are over taking some people :P.