Capital Punishment?

[Stalin Malone]

All of you with your black and white ideas for capital punishment don't factor in social class. Capital punishment does nothing to help the middle/upper classes but is invaluable in helping the poor find discipline.

 

[Virtual Chatot]

Wasn't it also Jesus who was willing none should perish? I believe He meant that physically (unnaturally) and spiritually.

You have to remember that God is not just a god of love and peace, he is also a god of Judgment.
The Physical death that everyone is going to have to endure is the result of humanity's mistake of rebelling against God.
The only people who are not going to endure the first death are the Christians who will be raptured before the seven year reign of the AntiChrist.

Taken from Biblegateway.com John 3:16 ( Original Greek Translation )
for God did so love the world, that His Son -- the only begotten -- He gave, that every one who is believing in him may not perish, but may have life age-during.

Christ dying on the cross didn't keep people from dying the first Physical death, it merely prevents people from the second death, which is hell.

The Physical Torture of Death will be a prick on the finger compared to the Eternal death.

All of you with your black and white ideas for capital punishment don't factor in social class. Capital punishment does nothing to help the middle/upper classes but is invaluable in helping the poor find discipline.

Excuse me...What? The discipline of Death affects all social classes.

 

[Jaimes]

As far as forgiveness goes, adultery does not compare with murder :/

You're confusing Biblical doctrine with the viewpoints of society. Obviously the western modern world doesn't see adultery as punishable by death.
In Biblical proportions sexual sin is probably the worse than murder, since it is one of the few sins that is committed inside the body (1 Cor 6:18), the temple of the Holy Spirit. ¬_¬

I'd also like to point out the Bible, being a 1500 year old book where proper Crime & Punishment systems had not been devloped, explicitly supports the death penalty, for a range of things. Many trivial (Sabbath breaking, horoscopes, false witness, been a rape victim, disobedience to parents, swearing, not worshipping your God etc). Therefore I can hardly see how Biblical text can be used as a reason against capital punishment.

Of course, Jesus would theoretically forgive all sins... a decent court room wouldn't.

I'd also like to point out that approximately 75% of the world population don't believe in your God. Just because you do and quote pages as factual, doesn't mean it's right. ¬_¬

Excuse me...What? The discipline of Death affects all social classes.

A disproportionate number of US people convicted under capital punishment are black.

 

[Virtual Chatot]

I'd also like to point out that approximately 75% of the world population don't believe in your God. Just because you do and quote pages as factual, doesn't mean it's right. ¬_¬[/qoute]
I'm entitled to my opinion, and I'm also entitled to spread my opinions around as factual. I truly believe them to right, so how are your opinions weighed so much more?

I would like to see the resource where you came up with that percentage.

A disproportionate number of US people convicted under capital punishment are black.

...and there is a disproportionate number of white people convicted in capital punishment.
You really can't make a point out of that statement when it comes to race.

 

[Jaimes]

I'm entitled to my opinion, and I'm also entitled to spread my opinions around as factual. I truly believe them to right, so how are your opinions weighed so much more?

I would like to see the resource where you came up with that percentage.

Being in a massively religious country, it's acceptable for you to proclaim a belief as fact, as long as other people agree with you. Outside your scope, not everyone will agree with your belief and many will think it is just plain ludicrous... and frankly telling people otherwise is massively annoying and highly patronising.

I also dislike having to link to Wikipedia.. the most easily accessible link for sources to prove a simple point, especially when someone reckons otherwise. 1.5-2.1 billion Christians, not including denominations which are opposed of each others belief (e.g RCC and evangelical), out of a world population of 6.6billion, is 69% to 77% of non-believers (and increasing).

...and there is a disproportionate number of white people convicted in capital punishment.
You really can't make a point out of that statement when it comes to race.

By 'proportion' I was comparing the number convicted with those that represent the race in the countries population.. I thought that was somewhat obvious. And there's a source as well.. It is rather evident that discrimination occurs in handing out death penalties, making it a hardly fair system. ¬_¬

 

[MissMegano]

Again, please try not to argue about religion. I know it's hard, as this involves so much of it, but try to avoid disputes.

I'm liking your ideas. I'm seeing how opinions really differ from person to person. Opinions come from the individual more than anything. I'm leaning more and more towards the idea of letting the prisoner choose between the death sentence and life in prison.

 

[doesn't matter]

What she said^ No one really cares about your religious beliefs, or lack thereof. It sounds preachy and only serves to encourage the sort of arguments I generally detest i.e. religious arguments.

Mind you Jaimes (and a whole heap of other people who reside in this forum), reading the entire bible literally and/or with fundamental views is a dumb thing to do and only makes you look foolish, whether or not you are a practitioner of the faith.

Anything else regarding the matter can be discussed via PM. Note that this is not an invitation to argue about religion. Now just talk about the death penalty, please?

 

[El Gofre]

I totally agree with capital punishment. If you deny other people human rights you do not deserve them yourself. The case should be unanimous though, or at least a small sentense to give time for new evidence to be brought forwards.

 

[Mooshykris]

I believe in capital punishment. I believe it is needed. I would go into further detail on why I believe in it, but that would require discussing religion, which I wont.


Mooshykris

 

[Nomaiya]

I'm inclined to say that I agree with capital punishment for people who have intentionally taken the lives of others, but the more I think about it, I think that capital punishment might be an 'easy way out' for criminals. What better way to make them pay for their wrong-doings than by forcing them to live in a prison with the knowledge of what they have done for the rest of their lives? However, I feel that prisons need to be more like prisons. I don't know if this is the same in other countries, but in the UK, prisoners get television, playstations, xboxes, and money. How the hell is that a punishment? But I'm getting off-topic now, so I'll shut up about that ^^

So, basically, I think that capital punishment is a no, but that murderers should be forced instead to live in squalid prisons for the rest of their lives, with a 'life sentence' actually meaning life, not just eight or nine years.

 

[Zanacross]

Prison is meant to be punishment but its obviously not working in England so I feel we need more methods. Capital punishment is a way that will stop them for ever which is needed. I'm not against. "Eye for an Eye" as the bible says. Let the victum or victums family choose the punishment

 

[El Gofre]

Prison is meant to be punishment but its obviously not working in England so I feel we need more methods. Capital punishment is a way that will stop them for ever which is needed. I'm not against. "Eye for an Eye" as the bible says.

It's not that it doesnt work, its that our justice system is hypocritical and spends more time on petty fines and ends up letting the thousands of knife-thugs out there free. But yeah, we need it badly. Im not sure putting killing and the bible together is all too logical though :)

 

[Jesus Freak Josh]

Im not sure putting killing and the bible together is all too logical though :)

It works, the problem is that it's human nature to only pick out the stuff that suits us and ignore the rest. So where it said "Eye for eye" the government took it. Where Jesus said "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone" the world ignored it. But anyway... :P

However, I feel that prisons need to be more like prisons. I don't know if this is the same in other countries, but in the UK, prisoners get television, playstations, xboxes, and money. How the hell is that a punishment? But I'm getting off-topic now, so I'll shut up about that ^^

Well I could see the Playstation being punishment... :P I think it's so they don't go nuts. I mean, even with all that, they still have bad living conditions, they still aren't allowed to do anything else...

 

[Zanacross]

Prisons cost to much. Houseing criminals for 1 year costs about £56,000.
This comes from tax payers money. Now if a crook is in prison for 10+ years thats £560,000 Why waste it when if thier crime is serious enough to lock them up for 10 years, why not find another punishment?

This is a punishment for tax payers. I don't want to spend my money on them scum. Why should I? I would rather it go to my and your healthcare.
How about we bring lynching back? A mod with sticks and stones handing them.

 

[Jesus Freak Josh]

Okay, Zenacross. I'm sure the African-Americans will agree heartedly with you.

 

[Zanacross]

I know. Wouldnt help a thing really. But CP in england would be better then wasteing money

 

[Stalin Malone]

None of you 'get' the fact that the poor are at a lower state of mind due to malnutritution and thus should be treated like animals.

 

[txteclipse]

You don't get the fact that people are responsible for their own actions. No matter what, you always have the final say in what you do. It's just that simple. There are few, few exceptions of people being mentally insane and committing heinous crimes.

I'm going to call that a trolling, in any case. I very much hope that that is not your true take on things.

As for us not discussing this religiously, it dulls the conversation. This thread becomes "do you believe the death penalty should be used? Yes/No."

I think religion plays a crucial part in discussions like this. Religion, or lack thereof, plays a major part in many people's moral code. To dissallow religious discussion is to prohibit people from providing reasons for their viewpoint.

Amachi says: Do you not understand that I said to discuss this via PM?

 

[Stalin Malone]

Without capital punishment to enforce the law how are the poor going to bring themselves up by their bootstraps?

 

[El Gofre]

None of you 'get' the fact that the poor are at a lower state of mind due to malnutritution and thus should be treated like animals.

Wow, i dont even know how to describe that other than arrogant and ignorant. I suppose you have a detailed knowledge of maltrition? Because, for lack of a better example, I dont see too many anorexics running round like 'animals'.