Getting into the 7th Gen meta

[Nah]

I had pretty much stepped out of the ORAS meta about a month before Sun/Moon released, and did not immediately dive into the Sun/Moon meta when the games dropped like many people did, as I wanted to play through Sun and Moon's main story first.

Now that I have, I want to get into the 7th gen metagame, and wanted to get an idea of what things are like now. It's only 2 weeks old, yes, but there is probably some shape to it at this point, even if it's just a little bit. Who're the rising stars in the new meta? Who's fallen from grace? Who's still good, and who's still shit? Anything that looked promising pre-release turn out to not be that good in practice? What about Z-Moves?

Basically how's the meta like now compared to how it was last generation. Not that anyone has to go super in depth, I just want a basic idea so I don't go in 100% blind. Also mainly talking about Smogon OU here.

 

[GloomyFrost13]

Dunno about tiers or anything because they're stupid, but I don't think we'll see many Z-moves. It's kind of a waste of an item slot for something that's only usable once a battle.

 

[PlatinumDude]

Dunno about tiers or anything because they're stupid, but I don't think we'll see many Z-moves. It's kind of a waste of an item slot for something that's only usable once a battle.

Z-Conversion Porygon-Z is legit because Z-Conversion boosts all its stats one stage and changes its type to match the move on the first slot:
-Thunderbolt
-Ice Beam
-Shadow Ball
-Conversion
Nature: Timid
EVs: 44 Def/232 SAtk/232 Spe
Item: Normalium Z
Ability: Adaptability

Thunderbolt is the preferred option in the first slot to benefit or mooch off of Tapu Koko's Electric Surge, but Shadow Ball is an alternative for Ghost's great neutral coverage. Z-Hyper Beam Volcarona is also legit for luring in potential checks/counters as it Quiver Dances, then firing off a one-time neutral nuke on them.

Speaking of the Tapus, all four of them are very good in OU due to the terrains they auto-summon. Lele is the most popular out of the four because Psychic Surge, which summons Psychic Terrain, blocks priority on grounded Pokemon, meaning frail, grounded Pokemon are free to wreak havoc without being nailed by things like Sucker Punch and Extreme Speed.

 

[ShanWow]

Not sure about their viability but Hail teams received significant buffs for Gen 7. The addition of Slush Rush and Aurora Veil make them far more threatening than they used to be. I'm sure you've heard but the Ultra Beasts are running rampant at the moment, mainly Pheromosa but I've seen Celesteela, Xurkitree, and Kartana all around. The Tapus have been very strong which has made Mega Scizor common as it can wall all of them and can threaten with Steel STAB. Toxapex is a stupidly strong wall with insane base Def. and Sp.Def with moves like Toxic Spikes, Haze, and Recover. If it got Rapid Spin it would completely take over Tentacruel's niche.

I imagine some of the Megas from last Gen will be more useful due to Speed changes taking effect at the beginning of the turn e.g. Mega Absol, Mega Houndoom, etc. Talonflame is basically completely gone as expected and other sets that rely on priority (Belly Drum Azumarill, Bisharp,etc.) have fallen out of favour due to prevalence of Tapu Lele. Gengar lost Levitate, giving it a Ground weakness so it no longer can switch into Choice-locked Earthquake. It's still fast and still hits hard with a great movepool so it should still be UU at worst, might retain OU status.

Hard to say for sure but Gen 7 shouldn't have added too many more OU Pokemon due to the extremely low average Speed tier. There are a handful of powerful Wallbreakers but most of them will likely be relegated to the lower tiers because they're so slow. On the other hand, Trick Room teams have more threats now though it has always been a niche playstyle.

It's hard to say what from last Gen will still be OU due to people still messing around with various new sets. From what I've heard/ seen Mega Gardevoir + Tapu Lele is very strong. Psychic Terrain stops Gardevoir from being OHKOed by Bullet Punch and lets it annihilate anything that isn't a Steel Type with boosted Psychic and Pixelate Hyper Voice. I've been doing research and experimenting with different sets and I'd love to hear what other people have had success with.

 

[skyburial]

Just gonna leave this here and let your imagination run wild.

https://www.reddit.com/r/pokemon/comments/5dl49o/smogon_announces_unbans_for_sunmoon_ou/

 

[lloebet]

They added a lot of abilities and moves with intention of being used if DB so I'm curious to see if that meta gets a surge of new people.

As for potential OU... I think Minior has some star potential once people find out some tricky ways to use its unique set up as well as it's decent move set.

Araquanid maybe. Also Tapu lele and Celesteela.

From what I saw through my play through we should probably be expecting fighting types, water types, and rock types to make a bit of a come back.

 

[Polar Spectrum]

Who's fallen from grace?

Now now, I know we're all very sad about the beloved Talonflame's descent from on high in the metagame; so please - no crying everybody.

 

[skyburial]

I can't imagine with the number of things that it's useful in, that Tapu Koko is anything to be sneezed at in OU. It OHKO's Xerneas with Gigavolt Havoc, in my experience.

 

[Polar Spectrum]

I can't imagine with the number of things that it's useful in, that Tapu Koko is anything to be sneezed at in OU. It OHKO's Xerneas with Gigavolt Havoc, in my experience.

OHKO'ing Xerneas is nothing to sneeze at; I'll have to refamiliarize myself with swagon's tiering info though - I haven't checked since Sun and Moon came out, and like it or not I'll have to know which legends / beasts are actually legal and which aren't.

Right now I'm just very sad I got a JOLLY Tapu Lele after learning how good it was; and seeing how much I like its adorable design. I may buy Moon just for another playthrough, and soft reset for a good Lele. Top lele.

Also; I almost started a whole thread about this - but Bewear. Bewear y'all... It takes a Dragon Ascent from Mega Rayquaza.... And it hits like a goddam truck. Are we cool with this? Do we understand? What that thing is?

 

[PlatinumDude]

OHKO'ing Xerneas is nothing to sneeze at; I'll have to refamiliarize myself with swagon's tiering info though - I haven't checked since Sun and Moon came out, and like it or not I'll have to know which legends / beasts are actually legal and which aren't.

Right now I'm just very sad I got a JOLLY Tapu Lele after learning how good it was; and seeing how much I like its adorable design. I may buy Moon just for another playthrough, and soft reset for a good Lele. Top lele.

Also; I almost started a whole thread about this - but Bewear. Bewear y'all... It takes a Dragon Ascent from Mega Rayquaza.... And it hits like a goddam truck. Are we cool with this? Do we understand? What that thing is?

Why Jolly Lele? Lele can't learn Zen Headbutt and Play Rough and has a better special move pool than a physical one. Tapu Bulu may be the physical Tapu you're looking for.

 

[Polar Spectrum]

Why Jolly Lele? Lele can't learn Zen Headbutt and Play Rough and has a better special move pool than a physical one. Tapu Bulu may be the physical Tapu you're looking for.

lol it's been like, 3 years since we last talked and you still haven't changed muh dood. Good to see you again, but... yo, please read the rest of my post. I'm on cartridge. I got a jolly one.

Spoiler:

 

[Nah]

omg Toxapex is like hnnnnnnng

Also; I almost started a whole thread about this - but Bewear. Bewear y'all... It takes a Dragon Ascent from Mega Rayquaza.... And it hits like a goddam truck. Are we cool with this? Do we understand? What that thing is?

It sounds like a good physical tank yeah.

But unfortunately it also has base 60 SpDef and the ability that makes it tank physical attacks so well gives it a Fire weakness.

light the bear up yo

 

[ShanWow]

Pelipper getting Drizzle gives Rain teams another lead, most people would say it's completely taken over Politoed's niche. Alolan Marowak is surprisingly strong with excellent bulk and decent damage, it's slow and gets rekt by Knock Off so probably UU though. Ash-Greninja is a fantastic late game Sweeper once it activates Battle Bond. People keep trying to run Alolan Raichu with Tapu Koko, I personally don't think it's very strong.

 

[Polar Spectrum]

Oh yeah; that reminds me - Nah, Torkoal and Pelliper have places I hear. Because Drizzle and Drought.

And another thing to note; the speed of most things coming out of Alola is... very sub-par. I've heard a fair amount of Slowlola jokes. But it's backed up, a lot of the new mons are slower and heavier. Trick room teams could become more common. That's speculation though.

 

[lloebet]

Pelipper getting Drizzle gives Rain teams another lead, most people would say it's completely taken over Politoed's niche.

As someone who used to main SS teams in monotype I would have 0 reason to choose Pelipper over Politoed.



Why did it have to be Pelipper out of all the water pokemon...

Edit: The only thing Pelipper has going for it is being a defogger but all things considered that still isn't worth it.

 

[5qwerty]

As someone who used to main SS teams in monotype I would have 0 reason to choose Pelipper over Politoed.



Why did it have to be Pelipper out of all the water pokemon...

Edit: The only thing Pelipper has going for it is being a defogger but all things considered that still isn't worth it.

Pelipper gets Roost (reliable recovery) and U-Turn, which no other weather starters have access to. U-Turn lets it safely switch out on an opponent's switch instead of having to predict by doubling.

 

[lloebet]

I've never met a person who chose to swap over putting an eject button on their politoed. It gets you a free swap to begin the SS assault and all things considered Pelipper wouldn't be able to hit first due to his awful speed making the U-turn obsolete if you could have just used an eject button.

And 9 times out of 10 politoed will be able to take the hit.

 

[ShanWow]

As someone who used to main SS teams in monotype I would have 0 reason to choose Pelipper over Politoed.



Why did it have to be Pelipper out of all the water pokemon...

Edit: The only thing Pelipper has going for it is being a defogger but all things considered that still isn't worth it.

Good for you? We're talking about viable use in OU, not Monotype. Pelipper gets U-Turn that allows it to act as a pivot, 100% accurate Hurricane, and Roost which is more reliable than Politoed's Rest. Better movepool, better abuser of Rain, I see 0 reason to choose Politoed over Pelipper.

 

[lloebet]

Don't know anyone who would spend the time using rest on a drizzle setter either.


Edit: (This is getting a bit off topic from what OP wanted so I'm going to cut it.)

 

[ShanWow]

Don't know anyone who would spend the time using rest on a drizzle setter either.

You want Rest as Politoed has no other form of recovery and you don't want your only Rain Setter to die as a Swift Swim team lives and dies on the Rain setters' survival. No idea why you would run Eject Button over Damp Rock. U-Turn does the same thing as Eject Button except you deal damage before switching out, and it isn't one time use.