Hoping the elite 4 has more than 4

[Lunar]

The problem is it cater to the younger audience aka the Millennials who seems to be the most lazy ones and don't want to work to get what they want. They are obviously spoiled compared to the 90s kids.

We had to work for our Gym Badges damn it

 

[Charlie Brown]

I think there's a difference between it being challenging, and having to work for badges as you say. I think the E4 (or equivalent) can still be challenging with more Pokémon and maybe slightly higher levels but I don't think people should have to mindlessly grind just to face the E4. The difficulty curve should be smooth enough that when you reach the E4 they pose challenges to you but don't require you to spend hours grinding due to them being too difficult.

 

[MegaKuriboh]

I just want them to have good movesets, balanced teams (I shouldn't be able to run through a fire type member with just a rock type), better AI and use of hold items.

 

[Charlie Brown]

^ yes agreed. I loved and hated the fact that for example Bruno in GSC could counter Flying-types with his Hitmonchan's elemental punches and with his Onix, and that Aaron used Drapion in DPPt. Even just well-rounded move sets would be good, to make it more difficult to sweep through the E4.

 

[Rivvon]

BW2 really was the best of both worlds, with normal mode having them use 4 Pokemon and challenge mode gave them 5 (I honestly forgot that the Unova elite 4 had the whole 4 Pokes thing, i thought it was just Kalos' thing). They're not the four toughest trainers in the region for nothing, so why do they only use 4 Pokemon now?

Something that I always tend to forget is that BW were actually the first games where the Gym Leaders never had more than 3 Pokémon. Drayden/Iris in BW only had 3 Pokémon and Marlon in B2W2 had 3 Pokémon in Easy/Normal Mode but 4 in Challenge Mode.

But for me, I feel like I always forget that fact because the Gyms were still challenging for me despite them having only 3 Pokémon. I always associate the "3 Pokémon per Gym Leader" with Kalos because the entire the game was way too easy so it made that detail all the more obvious and prominent.

So for the Elite Four, I have a similar opinion: it would be great if they could go back to having 5 Pokémon each, but if they stick with just 4, I hope their levels, strategies, and general AI is appropriate to still make it a challenge. Having them hold appropriate Items (like how they do in B2W2's Challenge Mode) would be very welcome, even if they only have 4 in their team.

 

[MegaKuriboh]

Something that I always tend to forget is that BW were actually the first games where the Gym Leaders never had more than 3 Pokémon. Drayden/Iris in BW only had 3 Pokémon and Marlon in B2W2 had 3 Pokémon in Easy/Normal Mode but 4 in Challenge Mode.

But for me, I feel like I always forget that fact because the Gyms were still challenging for me despite them having only 3 Pokémon. I always associate the "3 Pokémon per Gym Leader" with Kalos because the entire the game was way too easy so it made that detail all the more obvious and prominent.

So for the Elite Four, I have a similar opinion: it would be great if they could go back to having 5 Pokémon each, but if they stick with just 4, I hope their levels, strategies, and general AI is appropriate to still make it a challenge. Having them hold appropriate Items (like how they do in B2W2's Challenge Mode) would be very welcome, even if they only have 4 in their team.

Yep, I forgot that Black and White started the whole smaller teams trend, mainly because XY were the first games where I went "Wow... do I even deserve this badge? Did I fight a gym leader or just a random NPC??". I remember sweeping through Wulfric, it was very dissapointing. At least in BW the gyms were at least still a bit challenging what with Elesa's Emolga shenanigans and Clay's Excadrill and Iris' Haxorus messing you up if you're not careful. This is why I want a challenge mode, it solves everything. In BW2 yes all the gym leaders use at most 3 Pokemon, but with Challenge mode they start using 4 Pokemon by the THIRD gym which is just fantastic. I really really hope they bring the feature back because it made the game such a better experience. When I go to gyms, I want a challenge, I want to PROVE I'm a Pokemon Master and not just some idiot with a Charizard. Leave the normal mode for the kids who whine and will never work for something in their lives, at least Fire Emblem understands this.

 

[Hikamaru]

I've kinda learned over the generations to not get my hopes up as far as the AI being about as competitive as your average human battler would be. I feel like the consistency would stay the same; we've seen E4 members that constantly use Full Restore once or twice when their Pokemon is low on health and that's something that I feel isn't going to change this generation. Maybe they might have a few hold items, but I don't know if it's going to be anything significant.

I'm not holding my breath for any substantial change in AI, at any rate.

I'm in the same boat as you, since I feel in-game AI has never usually been smart for 20 years now, and the only real smart ones are Gym Leaders/Elite Four/Champion (obviously) and some trainer classes, notably Ace Trainers and Veterans.

As much as people want significant challenge, I feel it's not going to happen.

 

[Guest123123]

When I first saw the title of the thread I understood it wrong and thought it meant "I'm hoping there's more than four members of the Elite Four" XD

E4s having four Pokemon wasn't just an XY thing; it started with BW. If SM have an Elite Four I'm not sure I'd count on them having 5 again. It seems like a permanent change like being able to battle them in any order, with ORAS being an exception because RSE existed before those changes were made (along with Pokemarts being separate from Pokemon Centers).

 

[blue]

It's strange to think that the Unova Elite Four members actually had four Pokemon too. When comparing them to the Kalos E4, it's no contest, the Unova E4 members are waaay tougher imo. Even playing now, I find them to be a real challenge from time to time. The Kalos league on the other hand, they are all really easy to take on. To me this just proves that maybe it's not a matter of how many Pokemon they have or that level they're at, but rather what Pokemon they use with their items and the strategy they use. I hope they can improve on this for Sun and Moon.

 

[Hikamaru]

It's strange to think that the Unova Elite Four members actually had four Pokemon too. When comparing them to the Kalos E4, it's no contest, the Unova E4 members are waaay tougher imo. Even playing now, I find them to be a real challenge from time to time. The Kalos league on the other hand, they are all really easy to take on. To me this just proves that maybe it's not a matter of how many Pokemon they have or that level they're at, but rather what Pokemon they use with their items and the strategy they use. I hope they can improve on this for Sun and Moon.

I do agree with your point. While both the Unova and Kalos Elite Four had only four Pokemon on each member (with the Champion being the only one with a full team) I felt Unova was tougher due to moveset selection, and the held items in B2/W2 Challenge Mode. I kinda doubt it happening for Sun & Moon due to being newcomer-friendly, and Game Freak likely not wanting so many stressed children solely because they couldn't overcome a tough opponent.

It's... odd, though. Compared to the player, who (usually) has a full team of six, most E4 members really don't have six Pokemon to battle with. It's really something that's on my mind quite a bit; what if things changed and from this point forward, Alola's version of the E4 has six really strong Pokemon to put them on an even playing field with the player? Wouldn't that make things tougher?

As Blue said, it comes down to the movesets and any strategies they use. It would be appealing for those who want a challenge, but with how much these games seem to be kid-friendly (like the battle interface showing type effectiveness on your Pokemon's moves) I feel we're likely not getting a strong Elite Four again, in a similar vein to Kalos.

 

[Xerecies]

I think the Elite Four will have five Pokemon each. That is if there even is an "Elite Four". It'd have to be if we're able to travel back to Kanto, which to me would indicate they'd have five Pokemon on their roster.