How do YOU break stall?

[Dark Azelf]

As most of you have probably noticed, as of late stall teams are coming back big time. As you climb the ladder higher and higher stall teams get more and more common and more and more annoying walling and dealing with you slowly and painfully with Toxic Spikes, Spike, SR and possible sandstorm damage. Wonder why you keep losing to this, do you have a plan to stop it and do you even consider this in team building ?

Now you may think that obi stall teams are the most common these days, however you would be wrong. Stall has gotten more difficult to break, especially with the addition of Latias, the Rotoms and people using new sets such as Sp.Def Payback Forry, Sp.Def Rest talk Roar Gyarados, Trick to stop last poke sweeps etc and many more annoying things and are no longer just your standard SkarmBliss teams and can and have alot more versatility these days. See for example Ikitsunes stall team which consists of Protect SR Swampert/Rest talk roar Gyara/Rotom(I think its defensive but with trick and no choice item to trick choice items back lol)/Wish Blissey/Forry w/both spikes/P-Song Celebi

In addition people are now using a lot of teams which are classified as psuedo/semi stall teams, these teams are often the same as full out stall however they have a bulky sweeper which fits in with the stall theme to benefit from the residual damage (see CM + Roar Latias and CroCune or something like sub and charge beam Rotom) and often have a scarfer to keep threats in check incase they do get overwhelmed and to absorb trick scarfs etc. These teams are often more successful than full stall because of the fact that even if a threat beats their counter and break through they still have a scarfer to force you out and thus rack up more damage from the various spikes.

For example on an old team of mine i used a simple CB Tar + Offensive Suicune + Toxic Spikes (Roserade) combo to beat stall. This was pretty effective, Tyranitar could Pursuit all the pokes with decent sp.def who annoy cune(namely Blissey and to some extent Zapdos, Celebi and Latias) and then Suicune rampages through their team, Roserade also sucked up T-Spikes which hinder Suicune. The Toxic Spikes also stoped Wish Blissey staying in on CB Tars Pursuit's as Toxic damage builds up as it Protects. CB Tar also can Pursuit Tentacruel too if it has wise ideas about coming in and absorbing T-Spikes lol.

More recently in this team me and Bedlam packed our team FULL of things stall hates, Trick, Pursuit, Toxic Spikes, Explosion, Lures etc.

Stathakis of smogon uses Hyper Offense as a way to beat it, packing his team with lots of things that are walled by the same thing and odds are if he keeps pounding away he will eventually break through.

I expect alot of people saying "Mixape beetz stal omgz!11l" or "Mixmence beetz stall!!11!one". Alone these pokemon DO NOT BREAK STALL, all good stall teams are able to deal with these especially new mixmence rofl :x. You have to have a plan to beat a well constructed stall team, no pokemon alone beats stall which is why synergy is so darn important.

There are many other ways and combo's to beat stall. So my question to you is how do YOU break stall ? What is your strategy and plan against it ?

 

[Chaostorm]

Taunt ? because Stall teams doesnt use attack moves alot ...

 

[Dark Azelf]

Taunt ? because Stall teams doesnt use attack moves alot ...

....

How is Taunt going to break an entire stall team ? ._.

 

[Chaostorm]

not ENTIRELY , at least it cripples them a bit , Im not sure what is their real counter , my guess is Boah , but I dont think it would acheive its goal on breaking stalls that much ....

 

[Dark Azelf]

not ENTIRELY , at least it cripples them a bit , Im not sure what is their real counter , my guess is Boah , but I dont think it would acheive its goal on breaking stalls that much ....

Alone these pokemon DO NOT BREAK STALL, all good stall teams are able to deal with these especially new mixmence rofl :x. You have to have a plan to beat a well constructed stall team, no pokemon alone beats stall which is why synergy is so darn important.

^

I should of listened to anti when he said this thread would end up like this. >>

 

[Chaostorm]

its hard to know whats their real counter , even Taunt cant handle the entire stall team like what you said =/ , I saw yours and Beldam RMT , T-Spikes is another good move to scare them not to start stalling , but half of the metagame is immuned to it .....

 

[Radiation]

I've been having soooo much trouble with semi-stall lately. Choice users is usually how I manage to break it. Of course this does require some prediction but some stronger choice pokemon like CBTar usually only have to hit neutral to take even the bulkiest pokemon down. Not to mention it isn't too hard to switch bulky choice users like Tyranitar in against stall teams so as long as you keep pounding away you're gonna start racking up kills. Bulkier choice scarfers can at least prevent those annoying sub sets from setting up too much although this is more of a check. Personally, I've been using a Guts CBChamp lately which I'm particularily fond of. As long as you can remove fighting counters with payback/ice punch CC will destroy everything else.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

Stall teams FLT.
I usually use Fire Punch Jirachi on Forry or Magnezone. Many Magnezone users write me off as a nub who just trapped myself until they get Fire Pawched to the face.
I use Rapid Spin to get rid of Toxic Spikes and such.
Stall gives me trouble too, most well-played stall teams give me a run for my money but not-so-well played teams get stomped upon.

 

[Calum.]

My preferred style of play is bulky offence and so in turn Stall teams are a bother.

TaunTurn Gliscor is one of my favourites, especially used in conjunction with CBTar. Not only does it prevent set up from the likes of Forretress, but it prevents recovery and status, this can practically give Tyranitar a free switch in as most of the specially based attacks, Bliss Ice Beam, Rotom etc do nothing to TTar. I love TaunTurning to CBTar when Rotom is out and Pursuiting it hard. Even if the opponent switches I still get a favourable match up.

What I also like is when people bring Blissey in against CroCune as after 6 CMs I am doing >37% and all I have to wait for is a crit to sweep their entire team.

With TormentTran being more popular semistall has been much more common and even more annoying.

 

[Valarauca]

Pure offensive killed stall once, and it will do it again. It logically has no reason to go away except people don't want to use it.

I have no proof of this All I know is those that don't learn from the past are doomed to repeat it, and the metagame is a endless fad of what will defeat the lastest check of a check of a check of a counter, and nobody sits back and builds a team based on the pure knowledge of everything hence forth, and what everything is capable of. Once this happens things like 'new salamence' will never happen again.

 

[Dark Azelf]

Pure offensive killed stall once, and it will do it again

People very rarely use pure or hyper offense these days, you have Scizor and the lean towards bulky offense to thank for that lol

My preferred style of play is bulky offence and so in turn Stall teams are a bother.

TaunTurn Gliscor is one of my favourites, especially used in conjunction with CBTar. Not only does it prevent set up from the likes of Forretress, but it prevents recovery and status, this can practically give Tyranitar a free switch in as most of the specially based attacks, Bliss Ice Beam, Rotom etc do nothing to TTar. I love TaunTurning to CBTar when Rotom is out and Pursuiting it hard. Even if the opponent switches I still get a favourable match up.

What I also like is when people bring Blissey in against CroCune as after 6 CMs I am doing >37% and all I have to wait for is a crit to sweep their entire team.

With TormentTran being more popular semistall has been much more common and even more annoying.

Yeah, Taunt + U-Turn Gliscor is such a pain in the ass lol

I always try to keep my bulky water alive no matter what the cost if i see they have that thing. Taunt + Toxic Gliscor needs to die too. ~.~

 

[Skip Shot]

The hyper-offensive team that I constructed a while ago works very well against stall. What really made it work so well was the synergy between all of the members of the team. The team was a combination of all-out and bulky offense (Gliscor and Snorlax), but the bulky members of the team either scouted or hit like a train. Gliscor and Snorlax set up my two key sweepers for sweeping almost every time. The combination of Physically based Mixape and a hybrid of old and new Mixmence ripped teams apart once Yanmega crippled the lead (and some others as well).

 

[Malicious Metang]

The hyper-offensive team that I constructed a while ago works very well against stall. What really made it work so well was the synergy between all of the members of the team. The team was a combination of all-out and bulky offense (Gliscor and Snorlax), but the bulky members of the team either scouted or hit like a train. Gliscor and Snorlax set up my two key sweepers for sweeping almost every time. The combination of Physically based Mixape and a hybrid of old and new Mixmence ripped teams apart once Yanmega crippled the lead (and some others as well).

I'm not seeing that team beat any well constructed Stall team. Your usage of a Choice Scarf Gengar pretty much gives every member of a stall team at least one turn to set up entry hazards, replenish health, or even utilize Roar. Choice Scarf is a terrible option to use against stall unless it is coupled with Trick. Let's also not forget that Snorlax gives things like Skarmory a free switch-in to begin setting up entry hazards.

With me, I like to prevent stall members from fulfilling their job by simply pounding them into submission. By preventing them from setting up, they will be unable to harm you. They will be forced to stay on the defensive while also potentially having to go on the offensive, and let's be frank, your guns are a lot bigger than their's are. It's pretty easy to stop most stall leads, as something such as Roserade can Sleep them, draw in their Rapid Spinner or Blissey, sleep it, and then you can act accordingly. The best thing about stall teams is how predictable they are. Just switch safely and smartly, and you'll be able to force them out, slowly weakening their defenses.

 

[Skip Shot]

I'm not seeing that team beat any well constructed Stall team. Your usage of a Choice Scarf Gengar pretty much gives every member of a stall team at least one turn to set up entry hazards, replenish health, or even utilize Roar. Choice Scarf is a terrible option to use against stall unless it is coupled with Trick. Let's also not forget that Snorlax gives things like Skarmory a free switch-in to begin setting up entry hazards.

Choice Scarf Gengar is only used if needed on something like Gyara etc. Really, if there is a stall team, I rely on everybody besides Gengar to take out stall. I also have recovery on two key members of the team, and Infernape and Salamence combined can take out stall.

Also, if Skarmory has switched into SR, Snorlax cripples it completely with Selfdestruct, leaving Infernape to wipe it out the next turn with Mach Punch.

 

[Dark Azelf]

Any Salamence with Outrage doesnt beat stall. Ive said this time and time again, the fact that you HAVE to Outrage Blissey gives stall a chance to Spike up your side of the field with Forry, Skarm and even scarfers like Tar, Jirachi to come in get a snack, grab a coffee and then dispatach of your stall 'breaker'.

The ape is a MUCH better stall breaker because it actually causes switching and you can gain the upper hand with U-Turn......which you dont actually have upon second inspection lol and this gives things like Tenta a chance to come in...

350 Atk vs 208 Def & 334 HP (200 Base Power): 180 - 213 (53.89% - 63.77%)

STAB Selfdestruct (cuts the targets def in half) Vs Max/Max Skarm. It doesnt do THAT much and Skarm has Roost, so yeah.

 

[Valarauca]

A bit off topic but will we soon see the return of a classic D A team, 5 walls and a sweeper?

 

[Dark Azelf]

A bit off topic but will we soon see the return of a classic D A team, 5 walls and a sweeper?

Rofl, yeah i might post one soon. XD I love p-stall atm so i have like 80 of them. XP

Except that i wont use weavile as the sweeper. X]

 

[Malicious Metang]

Choice Scarf Gengar is only used if needed on something like Gyara etc. Really, if there is a stall team, I rely on everybody besides Gengar to take out stall. I also have recovery on two key members of the team, and Infernape and Salamence combined can take out stall.

Also, if Skarmory has switched into SR, Snorlax cripples it completely with Selfdestruct, leaving Infernape to wipe it out the next turn with Mach Punch.

Playing 5-6 vs a stall team is terrible, not only because it lets you deal less damage, but because that means there is less Pokemon to wear down. Gengar is completely dead-weight against stall, as are most Choice Scarf users.

And about Selfdestruct, not only did D_A prove what you said wrong, but Infernape using Mach Punch on a Skarmory is idiotic. I honestly can't understand what you are trying to say. Why not Fire Blast / Close Combat?

 

[Sebastien Loeb]

To stop the stall, use simply a moves: Trick.

 

[Calum.]

To stop the stall, use simply a moves: Trick.

Most decent stall teams run a scarfer of their own like Tyranitar or Jirachi and sometimes even Rotom

TrickScarfers are actually quite good on stall teams as they usually prove a more reliable way at stopping last pokemon sweeps than Perish Song

Though Trick is very useful at crippling Blissey and friends