Is Lillie a disappointment?

[CodeHelmet]

When starting this topic of discussion, I refer you to a video that was just uploaded on the subject and honestly, much of what is said in the video I agree 100% on. Author of video is a well known Poketuber in PRB12(aka PokemonRangerBoy12). Video link: Lillie is a disappointment(so far) Do you agree with his position and do you like his end goal for Lillie or is he completely off his rocker and doesn't know what he's talking about?

 

[Rajas20]

When starting this topic of discussion, I refer you to a video that was just uploaded on the subject and honestly, much of what is said in the video I agree 100% on. Author of video is a well known Poketuber in PRB12(aka PokemonRangerBoy12). Video link: Lillie is a disappointment(so far) Do you agree with his position and do you like his end goal for Lillie or is he completely off his rocker and doesn't know what he's talking about?

Interestingly enough, I watched this vid earlier and I do agree with most of it. She can be developed way more but I attest that to the writers trying to develop everyone at once which is hectic. I'm actually of the belief that she would have a big arc sometime soon and it will cause her to change for the better. I never played the game btw so I can't really compare her to the game counter part.

Side note, I was going to suggest that you make a couple discussions that I think would be pretty interesting.

 

[Alexander18]

Lillie is a disappointment. For both games and anime. To me, she doesn't have a purpose in either. Ash has enough friends with him that are actual trainers. Anime is getting worse with female companions starting with unova in my opinion.

 

[Hikamaru]

I don't mind Lillie as a character, but after watching PRB12's video I can understand that she does have some flaws as well. It's because of how one-dimensional she is in comparison to Lana (who I think now seems to be the most focused female classmate) and Mallow (who unfortunately gets shafted), and that's shown because the other characters of the SM group have some depth to their design, but Lillie's only quirk is wearing white clothes and having a white-coloured Pokemon as her partner.

I would like to see more development that will hopefully overcome her touching Pokemon phobia, but at the rate it's going I may end up losing interest in her since it looks like Lana is getting better development right now with obtaining her Z-Ring and mastering Hydro Vortex.

Lillie has potential, it's just the the anime staff need to make it work.

 

[CodeHelmet]

We have no clue what the writers have in store for her, much less how they intend to approach the Aether arc but any thoughts as to Lillie pursuing a research/professor career? Considering her inquisitive nature and gnack for problem solving, it might be the ideal career path for her. Besides has Lillie ever really demonstrated a passion for anything other than going to and from school?

As for the writers trying to develop or progress the characters all at once might be a consequence of having this many characters in the first place. The most we've had in any generation is 4. The fact we have 6 means one or more characters will be ignored or shafted(in the case of Mallow) and the only reason, that I can tell, that Lillie comes across as being a disappointment is because the writers are saving her "development" for later on in the series(largely for the Aether arc).

 

[Rajas20]

We have no clue what the writers have in store for her, much less how they intend to approach the Aether arc but any thoughts as to Lillie pursuing a research/professor career? Considering her inquisitive nature and gnack for problem solving, it might be the ideal career path for her. Besides has Lillie ever really demonstrated a passion for anything other than going to and from school?

As for the writers trying to develop or progress the characters all at once might be a consequence of having this many characters in the first place. The most we've had in any generation is 4. The fact we have 6 means one or more characters will be ignored or shafted(in the case of Mallow) and the only reason, that I can tell, that Lillie comes across as being a disappointment is because the writers are saving her "development" for later on in the series(largely for the Aether arc).

My thoughts exactly, she would have a major development arc later on. I'm pretty happy with her for now though.

 

[CodeHelmet]

My thoughts exactly, she would have a major development arc later on. I'm pretty happy with her for now though.

Eh I'm a bit disappointed and it's largely because I can be a bit impatient and how important Lillie was to the games(and as PRB12 pointed out, she wasn't the playable Female lead but a separate NPC like N). And yet when I start to complain, I need only look back at XY and the pace at which they did Serena. Took her 40 Episodes to even adopt a goal, another 8 Episodes before she got a glimpse into what she will be doing(much less capturing her first Pokemon) and didn't start fulfilling it until Episode 60(wherein she fails miserably and has that transformative moment). Question is when will Lillie get her transformative moment where she moves from a timid and scared girl to a confident and much stronger individual(and with a new look to go with it like in the games). In other words, when will Lillie get her Serena moment?

 

[Rajas20]

Eh I'm a bit disappointed and it's largely because I can be a bit impatient and how important Lillie was to the games(and as PRB12 pointed out, she wasn't the playable Female lead but a separate NPC like N). And yet when I start to complain, I need only look back at XY and the pace at which they did Serena. Took her 40 Episodes to even adopt a goal, another 8 Episodes before she got a glimpse into what she will be doing(much less capturing her first Pokemon) and didn't start fulfilling it until Episode 60(wherein she fails miserably and has that transformative moment). Question is when will Lillie get her transformative moment where she moves from a timid and scared girl to a confident and much stronger individual(and with a new look to go with it like in the games). In other words, when will Lillie get her Serena moment?

As he said, she will be harshly judged because she had a major part in the game versus those who were just the playable characters. I honestly believe there will be small help in Kanto from Brock and then it'll move on. Gladion and the type null is also waiting in the wings as well. She may get a bigger role there than we believe also.

 

[Frozocrone]

Disagree about her design and Snowy. It's meant to resemble pure white, a brand new trainer whose very impressionable and new to the world of Pok?mon (also Nihilego is the reason for her design so far, the anime has failed to hint it yet though).

Agree about her development of her phobia. Not every situation was 'dangerous' but her development has been so one dimensional and her personality is rather bland as her quirks aren't on display as often as the others are - and the others have dealt with multiple situations which makes them more interesting.

Also Sophocles and Mallow are far better than he gives them credit for.

EDIT: his reasoning about harshly judging is off the mark a bit too, everyone should be under the same criteria because game =/= anime.

 

[Rad Dudesman]

Her bookworm trait became redundant once Rotom joined the cast, so the focus had to be shifted to her trying to overcome her fears, and becoming a trainer.

 

[Drayton]

She is bit different compare to game counterpart where she keep nebby and comfort her mom, in the anime. She is smarty-type person who still have fear of touching pokemon but things change when alolan vuplix hatched from an egg when snowy approaches her still giving her goosebumps until the point that snowy fell, she embrace her. Also during certain episode where each other trainer substitute their partner in this case was Ash's pikachu given ownership to Lillie and Snowy to ash; Lillie still try to overcome her fear, but why she still got the feeling of fear, she did touched snowy so it's no biggie for ash pikachu, again she realize to embrace with pikachu she must battle ash and win, soon she embraced pikachu hugging him without fear. the problem with that she still isn't used to holding pokemon though and hopefully the writers change her personality a bit

 

[janejane6178]

One word -yes

 

[Hikamaru]

One word -yes

Agreed, and it's a shame because I love Lillie's design and she's one of my fave characters from the Sun & Moon games, but it looks like in the anime she's now overshadowed by Lana development-wise now that the Water trainer had obtained her own Z-Ring. Mallow is getting shafted badly, while Lillie's development is going very slowly which is not good when you consider how bad pacing in SM has been so far.

Also, with Lillie's "Z-Powered Form" in the games, I do hope it carries over to the anime as a sign of overcoming her fear of touching Pokemon.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

Eh, she probably could have been done better, but I can say this much, at least her fear of Pok?mon was far better handled than May's initial hatred of Pok?mon. At least Lillie has an actual excuse (which may factor into what Aether did to her), while May had zero reason to hate Pok?mon since, well, she's trying to become a Pok?mon trainer, a profession that requires spending time with Pok?mon, and besides which grew up in a Gym Leader environment, and if anything said hatred of Pok?mon just seemed to outright insult the profession, regardless of whether it was gym battling or coordinating.

 

[janejane6178]

Agreed, and it's a shame because I love Lillie's design and she's one of my fave characters from the Sun & Moon games, but it looks like in the anime she's now overshadowed by Lana development-wise now that the Water trainer had obtained her own Z-Ring. Mallow is getting shafted badly, while Lillie's development is going very slowly which is not good when you consider how bad pacing in SM has been so far.

Also, with Lillie's "Z-Powered Form" in the games, I do hope it carries over to the anime as a sign of overcoming her fear of touching Pokemon.

The problem isnt with Lillie. The problem is with the new anime settings. I mean- there are TOO MANY characters and the school concept is aweful.
If it was just Ash, Lillie and some random guy travelling I'm sure that Lillie would have shined brightly, but as for now- she just goes to her rich mansion every day after school and she isnt even CLOSE to development like the other girl companions, maybe cuz she isnt one.

 

[Hikamaru]

The problem isnt with Lillie. The problem is with the new anime settings. I mean- there are TOO MANY characters and the school concept is aweful.
If it was just Ash, Lillie and some random guy travelling I'm sure that Lillie would have shined bright, but as for now- she just goes to her rich mansion every day after school and she isnt even CLOSE to development like the other girl companions, maybe cuz she isnt one.

I agree that SM's bad writing and underdevelopment is because it's a case of "too many characters" syndrome. If BW showed any examples, having too many rivals and Ash catch too many new Pokemon proved to be executed badly, and as a result some of them didn't get any decent development.

Had SM not been a school setting with a large group, Lillie's development could have gone better at this point.

 

[Drayton]

Guessing everyone saying they hate SM because they don't want ash spending time all the day at the school or learning about stuff instead catching pokemons, stop team rocket and becoming a pokemon master guess the arc and story just below rating.

 

[Palamon]

Uh, no? She's not a disappointment? Just because she's scared to touch Pokemon, doesn't make her disappointing? She can touch Snowy now, jesus christ, give her a break. Why does everyone hate her so much?

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

Uh, no? She's not a disappointment? Just because she's scared to touch Pokemon, doesn't make her disappointing? She can touch Snowy now, jesus christ, give her a break. Why does everyone hate her so much?

Fully agreed, and quite frankly, if you know what happened to her in the games and it being implied to also be the case in the anime, she actually has a pretty understandable and sympathetic reason to be skittish around Pok?mon, and besides which she wasn't even in the trainer profession anyways.

And it's funny how people hate on Lillie for being scared to touch Pok?mon yet give May a pass despite her outright hating Pok?mon which in itself actually spat upon the entire point of being a trainer development or not (and completely contradicted not only the fact that she herself was a Pok?mon trainer in training, but also the fact that she came from a Gym Leader family). I mean, seriously, if you're going to hate on Lillie just for being skittish around Pok?mon due to what's implied to be her mom going nuts, you should at least be consistent and call May out on that as well.

Now, could Lillie be developed much better? You bet! But beyond that, she's not a disappointment.

 

[Frozocrone]

Uh, no? She's not a disappointment? Just because she's scared to touch Pokemon, doesn't make her disappointing? She can touch Snowy now, jesus christ, give her a break. Why does everyone hate her so much?

She's not a disappointment in terms of her traits/quirks, it's more how the writers are going about progressing/developing her.