Let's Super Mario Maker!

Uploaded my first course.

Invisible Block Nightmare
Course ID: 0609-0000-0051-78BD
 
Try a level i made based off of a stage from a rom hack

Mega Mario Ultra: Woodman
F1BE-0000-0051-6481
 
Here is a few levels for you all to try out. Enjoy!

Level #1: The Path of Challenge
4281-0000-0057-7F05

Level #2: The Path of Reflection
2A71-0000-0058-3B91
 
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That's a hell of a terribly designed level. Lots of effort went into it, sure, but it's trying to be Kaizo Mario without realizing what makes Kaizo Mario great.

Kaizo Mario doesn't overly rely on complete memorization, and it has the decency to give the player breathers and time to figure out what to do. That level doesn't, it's just non-stop precision platforming that does not respect the player's time.

I hate the misconception that hard = good design. No, it's the total opposite. If your level is overly precise, you're doing it wrong. Making a good challenging level is hella hard and there's nothing wrong with making an easy one provided it's fun to play.
 
first off, i had to delete Treacherous Trap Land due to lack of plays. Also, here's a new level

MMX: Storm Eagle
CC51-0000-005B-1C87
 
Spinosaurus said:
That's a hell of a terribly designed level. Lots of effort went into it, sure, but it's trying to be Kaizo Mario without realizing what makes Kaizo Mario great.

Kaizo Mario doesn't overly rely on complete memorization, and it has the decency to give the player breathers and time to figure out what to do. That level doesn't, it's just non-stop precision platforming that does not respect the player's time.

I hate the misconception that hard = good design. No, it's the total opposite. If your level is overly precise, you're doing it wrong. Making a good challenging level is hella hard and there's nothing wrong with making an easy one provided it's fun to play.
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I respect your opinion and I can see where you're coming from, but imo it would be harsh to call it a "hell of a terribly designed level" . at least it's better than a lot of levels I've seen so far.

kaizo definitely doesn't give players breathers, at least not always. didn't you see the 5 rows of bullet bills that launch in front of you 1 second after the start of first stage? (that's just 1 example). otherwise I'm probably not seeing what you're exactly getting at.

kaizo is far from fair and I wouldn't call it great either, which I would say the same about the level I posted.

and the word "fun" is subjective. some people like to try insane courses like these to feel like they're being challenged, feel big when beating it, or maybe they're just masochists. you're right, it won't be fun for most because it's insanely tough, but I wouldn't assume that to be true for every person playing mario maker.
 
Aeroblast said:
I respect your opinion and I can see where you're coming from, but imo it would be harsh to call it a "hell of a terribly designed level" . at least it's better than a lot of levels I've seen so far.

kaizo definitely doesn't give players breathers, at least not always. didn't you see the 5 rows of bullet bills that launch in front of you 1 second after the start of first stage? (that's just 1 example). otherwise I'm probably not seeing what you're exactly getting at.

kaizo is far from fair and I wouldn't call it great either, which I would say the same about the level I posted.

and the word "fun" is subjective. some people like to try insane courses like these to feel like they're being challenged, feel big when beating it, or maybe they're just masochists. you're right, it won't be fun for most because it's insanely tough, but I wouldn't assume that to be true for every person playing mario maker.
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The way I see it, whether a level is terribly designed is relative to what it tries to do.

For instance, I while back, a certain LP channel played Eryi's Action, and in the comments people shat on the game for being badly designed because it was a game of trial and error- in that you're killed unexpectedly and then you adapt to it on prior runs. Think "I Wanna Be The Guy". This bothered me, because I don't much see how a game that on no uncertain terms, straight off tells you what type of game it is can be bad solely on the merit that it's trial and error. Oftentimes the solutions to the workarounds are either reactive or puzzles and can require some pretty simple-yet seemingly complex thought and awareness, and I think it works well on that basis.

Relating this back to Super Mario Maker, that same LP channel recently started playing the "trolly" levels of a friend of theirs, spending a large deal of time on the "hardest" of his stages. The creator even admitted that, legitimately, he couldn't beat the stage (and at the time of the video's post, it had a...I think a .25% completion rate), and while this may seem unfair, he does a fairly good job of using level design to let you know where you need to go. Leaps of Faith are never truly blind as there are visual cues to guide you. There's a bit of puzzle solving here, too, and while the stage doesn't force you to die to complete it, it does use repetition to make the player realize that they're being shown what to do in mostly hopeless situations. The stage even gives you a fair bit of time to think in situations that may seem immediately urgent. I'd say it's less Eryi/IWTBTG and more Kaizo.

My point being, if you create something, be it a level or a game, to fill a specific role, whether it's well designed should be relative to based around that role. I'm not saying that there can't be some sort of standard for generally good level design, because there is, but I'm not gonna shit on a IWTBTG-styled level for killing me unfairly or putting a hidden jump block in an inconvenient position because it comes with the territory, but if the same type of level was made with the intent to make a completely fair, almost traditional Mario level, then based on that merit I'd say it's pretty badly designed.
 
machomuu said:
The way I see it, whether a level is terribly designed is relative to what it tries to do.

For instance, I while back, a certain LP channel played Eryi's Action, and in the comments people shat on the game for being badly designed because it was a game of trial and error- in that you're killed unexpectedly and then you adapt to it on prior runs. Think "I Wanna Be The Guy". This bothered me, because I don't much see how a game that on no uncertain terms, straight off tells you what type of game it is can be bad solely on the merit that it's trial and error. Oftentimes the solutions to the workarounds are either reactive or puzzles and can require some pretty simple-yet seemingly complex thought and awareness, and I think it works well on that basis.

Relating this back to Super Mario Maker, that same LP channel recently started playing the "trolly" levels of a friend of theirs, spending a large deal of time on the "hardest" of his stages. The creator even admitted that, legitimately, he couldn't beat the stage (and at the time of the video's post, it had a...I think a .25% completion rate), and while this may seem unfair, he does a fairly good job of using level design to let you know where you need to go. Leaps of Faith are never truly blind as there are visual cues to guide you. There's a bit of puzzle solving here, too, and while the stage doesn't force you to die to complete it, it does use repetition to make the player realize that they're being shown what to do in mostly hopeless situations. The stage even gives you a fair bit of time to think in situations that may seem immediately urgent. I'd say it's less Eryi/IWTBTG and more Kaizo.

My point being, if you create something, be it a level or a game, to fill a specific role, whether it's well designed should be relative to based around that role. I'm not saying that there can't be some sort of standard for generally good level design, because there is, but I'm not gonna muk on a IWTBTG-styled level for killing me unfairly or putting a hidden jump block in an inconvenient position because it comes with the territory, but if the same type of level was made with the intent to make a completely fair, almost traditional Mario level, then based on that merit I'd say it's pretty badly designed.
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think you summed it up better than I did tbh.

the guy who come up with that level has been making tough levels like that for years (fyi he's the creator of item abuse series) and said himself that he wants to make tougher levels than those of traditional difficulty. he's certainly achieved what he wants in that regard.

btw someone actually beat that course, apparently took him over 12 hours. an even harder course is definitely coming soon.
 
I'm so glad to find a Super Mario Maker topic here! ^^ Loving the game so far, but I must admit that it's a bit disheartening putting so much time in to creating levels that don't seem to get played very much. Can't help but think the system is a little bit flawed! I like to think my levels are pretty fun, so I hope you enjoy playing!

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Piranha Pipes 7677-0000-0018-D134
This was my first course so it's very basic!

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Koopa Troopa Trouble B463-0000-0026-3722
Again, fairly simple, but has a bit more going on than Piranha Pipes!

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Lakitu's Lair 67B3-0000-002F-68FA
I tried making harder courses at this point, but there might be some easier routes hiding in there.

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Bowser's Sunken Treasure 01EE-0000-0043-B233
A fairly simple underwater course, not the hardest course but I think it's quite fun!

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Airship Armada E44D-0000-0062-389E
Think this one is my favourite so far, but I've always loved the SMB3 airship levels so I may be biased!

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Trick or Treat 5C97-0000-006C-9FAB
My most recent course, a good old Ghost House. I tried to make this one as confusing as I remember the old Ghost Houses being, but it's hard to judge when you already know the right route!
 
A true challenge awaits you in my next level

House of Tricks?
941B-0000-0072-CE31
 
I thought I'd share a few of my favorites that I made and hopefully you can enjoy them.

Trippin on Flowers

(594D-0000-002C-5F7F)

My own take on the "touch fuzzy get dizzy level" from Yoshi's Island instead of avoiding fuzzies you're avoiding flowers.

Bowsers Castle of Doom and Gloom

(1B5F-0000-0033-102D)

Just wanted to make a castle level that has a bit of challenge and forced SMB3 styled Bowser fight.

Boos Choice House

(2D94-0000-0049-13D4)

A small ghost house level where you must make the right choices.

Castle of Magikoopa

(411F-0000-0055-2812)

A SMW styled castle level with a bit of challenge and a forced boss fight with 2 giant Magikoopas

Wiggler's Lovely Garden

(0F52-0000-007F-AE46)

A level with flowers and Wigglers.

These are my top 5 favorite I made but still feel free to check out the other five on my ingame profile.
 
My version of a Mega Man 4 stage

MM4: Cossack Fortress Stage 3
81DD-0000-0096-7AA3
 
Presenting, a remake of a Super Mario Land 2 level

ML2: Tree Zone Special
DA3C-0000-00AB-F32B
 
I'm only going to be posting one for now because I need some feedback. Particularly in regards to the fairness of the level

Reverse Ideology
9621-0000-00AC-F958

The idea's pretty self explanatory but 15 people've played with 63 attempts among them and no one's been able to beat it. That's not really my intent, though. It's got a little bit of problem solving, but nothing where you're supposed to die to figure out. It is pretty difficult, I'll say, but the idea is to call on the player's instincts so they'll know what to do with little thought, almost on the fly, and...well...not sure it turned out that way.

I'm not too surprised, though, considering all of my other levels are parkour-based. This is my first Mario-esque level.
 
ML2: Macro Zone 4
B512-0000-00B3-E2F2

a remake of the last level of Macro Zone from Mario Land 2! Includes boss
 
DKC: Platform Perils
583A-0000-00B9-5FCC

Tried to make it as close to the original as I can.

had to edit the level
 
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