Suggestion: "Other Voting Polls" Needs a Name Change

[Nick]

I know it's not a big problem xD It's just to avoid confusion - it can't be harmful to change the name / description to something that's less confusing for users. If we find a name / description that would make more sense, it would only take a few moments to change in the Admin CP and allow for a more user-friendly experience between OC and OVP.

<< That sounded lame.

But you get what I mean hopefully :s It's a simple matter that only good can come out of it.

That's the thing...

Nothing will come out of it. If members aren't reading them now, what in God's name do you think will make them read them after this proposed change occurs?

 

[Yusshin]

I think something would come out of it. Most people, when they see polls, they think an actual poll with multiple-choice answers. Changing it to reflect the acceptance of question-based chitchat might improve the OC's position with having to move to OVP a lot, since people will see flat in the middle of the category a forum that states that question-based, poll-less material is acceptable there.

Most people are just confused with the definition of a poll :s Why not just call it Surveys? That would include question-based topics and polls, since it's all just a big survey of information, and not a long, public opinion about something. Of course, the description would be editted to reflect the meaning of the Survey, and perhaps it could be a sub-forum in Other Chat so when people go there, they see it flat-on and don't read over it when searching for OC or w/e.

 

[Chibi-chan]

I think something would come out of it. Most people, when they see polls, they think an actual poll with multiple-choice answers. Changing it to reflect the acceptance of question-based chitchat might improve the OC's position with having to move to OVP a lot, since people will see flat in the middle of the category a forum that states that question-based, poll-less material is acceptable there.

Most people are just confused with the definition of a poll :s Why not just call it Surveys? That would include question-based topics and polls, since it's all just a big survey of information, and not a long, public opinion about something. Of course, the description would be editted to reflect the meaning of the Survey, and perhaps it could be a sub-forum in Other Chat so when people go there, they see it flat-on and don't read over it when searching for OC or w/e.

The word 'Survey' is already defined in the OVP rules.
I think you're beating a dead horse here.

 

[Yusshin]

The word 'Survey' is already defined in the OVP rules.
I think you're beating a dead horse here.

Convenience is best, though.

A merge would solve it, and all the gray lines xD but I don't know if that's the best solution :s seeings as how it would appear I'm not the best person at suggesting things lately lol

 

[Arcanine]

I say we change it to "Mixed Voting Polls". A little blast from the past? XD

 

[Signomi]

Ahaha, that would be a much snazzier name than Other Voting Polls indeed.

And for what I have to say, there will always be certain people on PC who, even in the face of an incredibly clarified name and description, will still find themselves in the not-so-unique position...of not understanding properly what is supposed to go in that forum, that's just the way a lot of people are. Should you even try to change the name of the forum, what on earth will you be accomplishing? You'd only be thinking of variants of the original, even pulling a thesaurus out of the blue and trying to skim for words that will "make it so much easier for people who have a harder time trying to understand the purpose of that forum and what goes in it" I'm telling you now that it will not work. No matter what name you try pulling out of a hat, it will be absolutely no better than what the name is at the moment; because quite frankly, you can not describe a forum like OVP in its entirety with just the name alone. I can agree that a staff member could simplify the description to suit the ambiance of fellow PC members, but changing the name of the forum would be a complete and utter waste of time.

Needless to say, OVP is a house of polling threads of all kinds, some may just be simplistic and about lighthearted things, there are others that attract users to ponder more about certain aspects of their lives, not necessarily sparking discussion as such, but it gives them a chance to post exactly the sort of things that they experience during their everyday lives; things that we perhaps take for granted and ought to think about. That is the thing about polls such as these. They aren't things that one can simply discuss about, they are ones that make you think more deeply about how other people react to things we're likely to face a lot more during our lives, and how you as a person respond to them yourself.

Other Chat, on the other hand, is your typical debate/newscast forum where most problematic issues in the world are posted and up for discussion. Most topics that go there often have a controversial aura about them that allows people to post their opinions, question others and even exchange certain aspects of logic amiss. When you think about gray areas between OVP and OC, ask yourself this: Why is the Daily Chit-Chat thread situated in Other Chat rather than Other Voting Polls? You know the obvious answer, but allow me to elaborate on it. The DCC is talk-orientated and people have the freedom to bring up topics that you can either talk casually or even argue heatedly about, therefore it would not belong in a forum overrun by polls that typically ask you questions for you to post a single reply to. Which brings me back to the point that threads that are more likely to spark a discussion and even a debate between members are more suited for the forum that welcomes these topics with open arms; Other Chat. It is the same song and dance no matter what way you look at it.

 

[Nick]

Okay, so a lot of people have explained why the forum name itself isn't going to be getting changed (as much as it would be nice to go back to Mixed Voting Polls, considering its something different, and a little more user friendly), so I hope now some people who insisted on it being changed understand why it isn't going to be getting changed.

Now, on to something else...

In all honesty, I suggest you change the name and description to include the idea of light conversation (without polls) being accepted. As it stands now, it appears to only accept topics with polls. The announcement in Other Chat obviously isn't enough / escapes the eyes of some people (probably because their topic doesn't start with a question mark, or they think it's irrelevant) to alert people that OC is the wrong forum, and their topic belongs in OVP.

I brought this up to the attention with the rest of the staff along with my suggested description. I don't know if the forum description is going to change based on a higher staff voting, or whoever replies to the thread that I created for the discussion, but I figured I would let you (and anyone else wondering) that the forum description changing is possible. If everything goes well, you may even see a change with it by tomorrow... but I don't know exactly how a change in a forum description is going to be discussed because it could need either an actual voting on in the headquarters before anything gets done with it, or just a few members of the staff to approve the idea.

*shrug* Keep an eye out for change, I guess?

 

[Melody]

Well, I don't know about everyone else, but when I see the OVP, I think my post always requires a poll - and isn't for questions, brief conversation, etc. The only idea that it would be like that is hidden in the top announcement of the Other Chat; there's no immediate suggestion that OVP would accept non-poll material.

In all honesty, I suggest you change the name and description to include the idea of light conversation (without polls) being accepted. As it stands now, it appears to only accept topics with polls. The announcement in Other Chat obviously isn't enough / escapes the eyes of some people (probably because their topic doesn't start with a question mark, or they think it's irrelevant) to alert people that OC is the wrong forum, and their topic belongs in OVP.

Some names I was thinking of are:

- ChitChat & Polls
- Small Talk & Polls
- Questions & Polls
- Queries & Polls

[Description] Non-Pokemon polls, question-based discussions, and small conversation belong here

I like the last one :] but the title would have to be something to distinguish it immediately from Other Chat. It might be difficult, but for organization purposes (and to not confuse more people .-.), it should / needs to be done.

To be perfectly honest, I strongly oppose changing the name of OVP. I love it's current name.

That's the thing...

Nothing will come out of it. If members aren't reading them now, what in God's name do you think will make them read them after this proposed change occurs?

Sadly this is true, although I do feel that a description change might help just a fraction.

Hey guys, let's just merge OC and OVP! :D

NO! PLEASE, NO! ;o;

Convenience is best, though.

A merge would solve it, and all the gray lines xD but I don't know if that's the best solution :s seeings as how it would appear I'm not the best person at suggesting things lately lol

I strongly disagree, merging would cause conflicting rules because OC allows those stupid surveys and OVP doesn't. (to be honest, I hate those survey threads with a burning purple passion!)

Ahaha, that would be a much snazzier name than Other Voting Polls indeed.

And for what I have to say, there will always be certain people on PC who, even in the face of an incredibly clarified name and description, will still find themselves in the not-so-unique position...of not understanding properly what is supposed to go in that forum, that's just the way a lot of people are. Should you even try to change the name of the forum, what on earth will you be accomplishing? You'd only be thinking of variants of the original, even pulling a thesaurus out of the blue and trying to skim for words that will "make it so much easier for people who have a harder time trying to understand the purpose of that forum and what goes in it" I'm telling you now that it will not work. No matter what name you try pulling out of a hat, it will be absolutely no better than what the name is at the moment; because quite frankly, you can not describe a forum like OVP in its entirety with just the name alone. I can agree that a staff member could simplify the description to suit the ambiance of fellow PC members, but changing the name of the forum would be a complete and utter waste of time.

Needless to say, OVP is a house of polling threads of all kinds, some may just be simplistic and about lighthearted things, there are others that attract users to ponder more about certain aspects of their lives, not necessarily sparking discussion as such, but it gives them a chance to post exactly the sort of things that they experience during their everyday lives; things that we perhaps take for granted and ought to think about. That is the thing about polls such as these. They aren't things that one can simply discuss about, they are ones that make you think more deeply about how other people react to things we're likely to face a lot more during our lives, and how you as a person respond to them yourself.

Other Chat, on the other hand, is your typical debate/newscast forum where most problematic issues in the world are posted and up for discussion. Most topics that go there often have a controversial aura about them that allows people to post their opinions, question others and even exchange certain aspects of logic amiss. When you think about gray areas between OVP and OC, ask yourself this: Why is the Daily Chit-Chat thread situated in Other Chat rather than Other Voting Polls? You know the obvious answer, but allow me to elaborate on it. The DCC is talk-orientated and people have the freedom to bring up topics that you can either talk casually or even argue heatedly about, therefore it would not belong in a forum overrun by polls that typically ask you questions for you to post a single reply to. Which brings me back to the point that threads that are more likely to spark a discussion and even a debate between members are more suited for the forum that welcomes these topics with open arms; Other Chat. It is the same song and dance no matter what way you look at it.

You essentially summed up exactly how I feel about OVP. Changing the name is pointless, and the description is almost the same way.

I think an announcement might clarify some of the purpose of OVP, we should use your post in that too. :P

 

[Melody]

I just want to make a few points that people seem to be missing in this thread:

Making an announcement will not solve OVP/OC's problem.

Now why is this?

Just because you may regularly read announcements, doesn't mean other people would. The situation seems to be pretty tight at the moment, as it doesn't really matter if it got a name change or not, people would still post the wrong things in the wrong place at the wrong time. It's our duty as members to report it. It's as simple as that, really. It's not any different as if any other incorrect material was posted in any other forum it's not supposed to be in.

Just my two cents.

Your counterpoint is somewhat valid, but an announcement is more visible than changing the forum name or description silently is. With that being said, if we were to deploy a combination of the techniques, such as a description change and an announcement proclaiming this, then it would definitely be noticed. Furthermore, the staff could opt to be more invasive by using a notice instead, you know, the ones that appear right below the breadcrumb navigation bar?

 

[Melody]

That pretty little "x" is there for a reason. And the notices aren't impossible to ignore. In fact, I personally don't even notice it much because it blends in so well with the skin, lmao.

What I'm trying to say is not every single person in the world is going to read an announcement. There's going to be that nitwit or two that's going to be completely oblivious to the rules and just do what they want. As I said, just because you do, doesn't mean everyone else does. Don't you see what I mean now?

Unless there was an automatic redirect to the announcement(which is unlikely), no, most people aren't going to willingly read it.

One or two nitwits does not nullify it's effectiveness as a way to get the word out. Nitwits are usually infracted around here anyways, and neither I nor the staff have much tolerance for people who refuse to read announcements, notices or rules.

 

[Melody]

Those one or two nitwits I'm speaking of means a good 1/3 of this community. I'm thinking that's enough to nullify a good announcement.

I mean, think about it:

If Chibi's announcement only had about 272 views, with about what, 15,000 or so active members, then that says something about the amount of people that would take the time to read an announcement, y'know?

First of all, get your numbers right. there are only 19,590 active members on PC in total (that's all who have logged in at least once within the last six months!) and there is no possible way that OC can have 15,000 active members because it's lower ranked in activity when you compare it to the Wifi Center and Other Trivia! (by thread and post counts in the respective forums) Even though there is a possibility that X members do indeed share their time equally between OC and Wifi Center or Other Trivia, the numbers absolutely won't add up to the answer you're proposing!

Therefore, the data you have provided is irrelevant and does not prove your point.

Second of all, if you mean 1/3 of the community, SAY IT PROPERLY!

View count of a single announcement which is only visible in OC isn't enough data to support your theory.

 

[Nick]

You guys can argue about an announcement all you'd like, but I'd just like to note that the only person who would be making an announcement regarding OVP would be myself. At the point in time, I don't see a need to make an announcement in OVP considering OVP isn't the problem. OVP is overlooked when it comes to thread making. All threads that belong in OVP, aside from a handfew, are usually placed in OC beforehand and moved. The only time a thread in OVP is moved to OC is when a discussion comes from it, which is very rarely. So yeah, sorry Pachy, but I will not be making an announcement.

Dunno who this "we" is you're referring to in all this, either. :/

 

[Melody]

First of all, get your vocabulary right, because I just said about. That means that I am not willing to specify 19,000+ members. I am willing to say about 20,000, which therefore makes you look ignorant to say such a thing. :\

It is right. You said 'about' but one or two is not about 1/3 of 20k members!

Did I say that OC had to have 15,000+ members? No. You're not getting my point. My point was that members on PC, as proven by my screenshot, do not take the time to read an announcement in a specific area, especially since this is a concern about OVP threads being being posted in OC. So when you actually think about the whole thing, especially when it concerns OC, yeah, it is relveant.

It is evident by comparing my last quote of that post you are referring to, to the actual post that you have edited that post.

The Wifi center and Other Trivia have nothing to do with this. You're proving essentially nothing, especially since the wifi center is 95% noob.

Again, wifi center and Other trivia are irrelevant to the topic. This is a concern about OVP and OC. Stop drifting off. And again, you're misunderstanding my point. I mean out of all the active members at PC, who actually took their time to read Chibi's announcement? To go in OC and actually read the announcement? Did I say all 16,000 had to be there at once? No, I didn't, so I don't know where you get your points from.

Says the person that brought up two completely irrelevant forums when the main concern is OC and OVP. Though you attempted to support your point, Wifi center and Other Trivia have nothing to do with OC/OVP. They're two completely different forums, and the last time I checked, I think people would be able to distinguish one from another.

It's called an estimation. I apologize that you didn't apparently know. :\

These two forums tie in statistically because I was refuting your estimations. Your estimations were inaccurate and I proved it by doing a little number crunching.

 

[Guy]

Just to give you guys a clear visual here, there is no real need to argue over a simply title change or change in forum description. There is less of a need to argue over making an announcement, considering it isn't your choice in the matter. It seems as Nick's post was overlooked because of this slight bickering. :\ So, to repeat it again. If anyone is to make an announcement in OVP, it would be by Nick (Patchisou Yutohru). It's his choice in the matter, and as it stands he sees no need for it.

Also, it's currently being discussed on a slight change in the forum description for OVP. Not everyone reads the descriptions (we know), but hopefully it'll help in some way or the other. As for the title, well, the suggested names really aren't looking so well and if anything, going back to the original roots sounds best (IMO), but for now OVP is where it stands on the forum. So deal with it people.

 

[Nick]

HOWDY! IMPORTANT UPDATE HERE:

It seems we have a new forum description for OVP. <4 My description. YAAAY.

 

[Timbjerr]

I say we change it to "Mixed Voting Polls". A little blast from the past? XD

Holy crap! I think I've just been hit by a nostalgia truck. :o

In my opinion, there's always been a huge overlap between them...so much so that I never make threads in either of them for fear of having made it in the wrong place. XD

As far as I can tell, OC is for debates and discussion heavy questions while OVP is for surveys and questions that don't require long answers. Perhaps all we need is a change in the forum descriptions, but we all know how few people actually read them (as evidenced by the fact that there are still n00bs making threads for ROMhack technical support or Pokemon game help in CQ&F)

Personally, it doesn't make much of a difference in the long-run other thna being an occasional annoyance to Chibi-Chan and Patchisou Yutohru. XD

[EDIT] Holy crap!!! The irony!! XD