Poke'Grammar

[Pieman50]

tl;dr

Go preach your Ruby religion SMWHR LS.

And have a nice day!

I figured you would've said that.

In that case, you have no business calling me out if you have no recollection of what I've said.

Have a nice day!

 

[infersaime]

I don't see a problem RBY most people know it's Red Nlue Yellow, RBY why would you write that for Ruby? So I don't see a problem.

 

[Pieman50]

I don't see a problem RBY most people know it's Red Nlue Yellow, RBY why would you write that for Ruby? So I don't see a problem.

My point is that RBY doesn't make sense to be called Red, Blue & Yellow. It looks more like RedBlueYellow.

If you seperate it with '/' marks, you get a better understanding that it isn't RedBlueYellow, but rather Red/Blue/Yellow. The words wouldn't be bunched up, or clogged.

 

[infersaime]

My point is that RBY doesn't make sense to be called Red, Blue & Yellow. It looks more like RedBlueYellow.

If you seperate it with '/' marks, you get a better understanding that it isn't RedBlueYellow, but rather Red/Blue/Yellow. The words wouldn't be bunched up, or clogged.

Well it's the internet some people might do it but most of them will not.

 

[Gonzo]

I figured you would've said that.

In that case, you have no business calling me out if you have no recollection of what I've said.

Have a nice day!

I just see your efforts with your RBY theory pointless and I'm trying to say that in a straight-forward way. Actually, I've read your post and as far as I know, a discussion should be amusing for both/all sides, not amusing for one and annoying for the other. Also, it's very unlikely that a large group of people is wrong while a single person is right. I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm saying it's impossible in this particular case.

diz iz internetz n u have 2 deel wiv itz language n dat sum ppl just dgaf bout spelling n stuffz

 

[Oryx]

Masculin pronouns? When did I ever refer to you as a male or female? A little off-putting, but we're both human beings. I think it would be sexist to treat you differently.

In your post replying to Sydian you said "the only part of fairness in his warning", his referring to me warning you. Yes, it is off-putting when you refer to someone as the wrong gender, I agree. It's not sexist to refer to a person as their correct gender, especially when it's blatantly obvious. Stop trying to cover up your mistake and just apologize, geez.

Good. The reason I started this is because other people thought it was an acronym, and you practically just gave me a high-five. Not only was I wrong, but they were wrong too. I used a pointer, they used what they thought was fact.

RBY is a set of initials to mean Ruby. Since we're on topic about pokemon, then that is ALL it means in this thread.

No. RBY is a set of initials ("initials" meaning the initial letter in a word) to mean Red, Blue, and Yellow. RBY is not a set of initials meaning Ruby. It's not. Show me when TPCi referred to Ruby as RBY. If they did, I'll concede it could possibly be an abbreviation of it. Please, if you're going to nitpick at technical things that literally no one has agreed with you on in the fanbase, at least use proper terms.

You're trying to make good examples from this. Here's one:

There are humans with 3-letter initials, much like RBY. So if they can have initials, then what prevents RBY from being considered an initial?

Yes. The initials JFK mean John Fitzgerald Kennedy. The initials RBY mean Red Blue Yellow. Your point?

Yes, that is because the FBI has nothing to do with pokemon. When you think about it, neither does RBY, because that's the initial for a gem that gemologists use. A rare enough gem as is, so I don't know why this thread is derailing. There are two people in my family that are gemologists. I'm not saying that means I know what i'm talking about, but I at least know how the whole thing works.

Yes, that is because gemologists have nothing to do with Pokemon. ;)

The FBI is a valid example because what you're claiming is that by the objective rules of grammar, your abbreviation is right and the millions of other people in the fandom are wrong. I'm showing you that there are many, many examples of an acronym being used in this way outside of Pokemon, therefore there's no reason to say it's wrong unless you can come up with the grammatical rule. Your rule right now is "I SAY SO". That's not a rule. Find it.

Ok, it was never my intent to force anyone into using correct grammar. I only ever mentioned or implied that it upset me, or made me a bit mad. If people want to use it, that's fine, but I would much rather be more comfortable understanding that R/S/E is Ruby, Sapphire, & Emerald instead of RSE which is either some company name, or RubySapphireEmerald.

You insulted people that use that abbreviation. Does that mean that your goal was just to insult them, not to try to make them change their ways? What's the point of this thread then if you don't want to make people change?

R/S/E does not mean Ruby, Sapphire, & Emerald. It means Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald. Different things.

CDOM, COTS, DFWED, or DLP can mean anything it wants to mean. The main point is that RBY is an 'initial' for Ruby, because it's also classified as a gem, LONG before pokemon even existed.

Red, Yellow, and Blue were colors before the gem was discovered, so have fun with that. Especially considering they're the primary colors, you can't claim the gem was discovered before people thought to make an abbreviation out of the primary colors. You'll need some proof for that.

I linked you to those sites to show that those acronyms are used to mean "X, Y, and Z", and abbreviated XYZ. Therefore proof that at least you have the entire American government against your idea that it's wrong according to an arbitrary rule you made up.

So now, because I have a logical understanding, or maybe an 'iffy' understanding of what RBY actually implies, you're going to take from my first post, and imply that i'm calling the American Government a bunch of 4th graders?

...Not quite, you're claiming they didn't pass the fourth grade. You said

due to the HEAVY amounts of this incorrect grammatical format used, I would be implying that everyone doing this has seriously never passed the 4th grade.

If the government agrees that using an abbreviation in this way is correct, then you're saying that they didn't pass the fourth grade. Simple logic.

Let's be fair, even if this thread didn't exist, they're still 4th graders. They know nothing about how to run a country or an economy. Now, I'm not saying I should run the country, but I'm definitely saying they are incompetent. But nontheless, I never implied that they were fourth graders, because I only tried to make an understanding of the word 'RBY'. You added to it, and made it sound like I implied something totally different.

What you've been doing is claiming that your way is objectively right, while everyone else's way is objectively wrong. And that's just not true. You haven't produced one scrap of evidence that implies that there's anything remotely wrong with the abbreviation RBY, considering it came before Ruby so it didn't clash with anything and had been out for years, getting that abbreviation cemented into the fandom so deep that it's pointless to change it. Besides...Ruby is 4 letters. If you're going to shorten it, why would you shorten it to 3 letters? No Pokemon game is shortened in that way. That makes no sense.

I guess I must re-iterate that this is a debate, and not an argument. Although you will probably give me wrongful infractions for implying that I've been angry, when I really just want to understand a bit more. This has been an interesting debate nontheless, but like I said, no 'names' have been mentioned. I'm not targeting anyone, throwing grenades in their face, or anything of that sort. This is a debate, let's keep it at that until we're done, or until you decide to ignore me. Whichever you prefer.

I'm not "implying" you've been angry. You have been. Maybe it was given away by you saying "I am obviously mad"? Lol. Everyone has noticed it, which is why you got such angry replies in return.

This post has been without most of the obvious condescending tone though, so thank you for that. If you have a problem with the way I handle my section, once again, take it up with higher staff. If not, stop claiming that I'm "wrongfully infracting" you. Those are your options.

My point is that RBY doesn't make sense to be called Red, Blue & Yellow. It looks more like RedBlueYellow.

If you seperate it with '/' marks, you get a better understanding that it isn't RedBlueYellow, but rather Red/Blue/Yellow. The words wouldn't be bunched up, or clogged.

Since when have any abbreviations required a separation to imply that they're separate words? Once again.

Show proof. Find the grammatical rule that backs you up.

If it's fourth grade knowledge, it shouldn't be difficult for you to find. You keep claiming you're right, but are completely ignoring all the instances that I'm showing you because they prove you wrong, while claiming you're right with nothing to back you up.

 

[Pieman50]

In your post replying to Sydian you said "the only part of fairness in his warning", his referring to me warning you. Yes, it is off-putting when you refer to someone as the wrong gender, I agree.




No. RBY is a set of initials ("initials" meaning the initial letter in a word) to mean Red, Blue, and Yellow. RBY is not a set of initials meaning Ruby. It's not. Show me when TPCi referred to Ruby as RBY. If they did, I'll concede it could possibly be an abbreviation of it. Please, if you're going to nitpick at technical things that literally no one has agreed with you on in the fanbase, at least use proper terms.



Yes. The initials JFK mean John Fitzgerald Kennedy. The initials RBY mean Red Blue Yellow. Your point?



Yes, that is because gemologists have nothing to do with Pokemon. ;)

The FBI is a valid example because what you're claiming is that by the objective rules of grammar, your abbreviation is right and the millions of other people in the fandom are wrong. I'm showing you that there are many, many examples of an acronym being used in this way outside of Pokemon, therefore there's no reason to say it's wrong unless you can come up with the grammatical rule. Your rule right now is "I SAY SO". That's not a rule. Find it.



You insulted people that use that abbreviation. Does that mean that your goal was just to insult them, not to try to make them change their ways? What's the point of this thread then if you don't want to make people change?

R/S/E does not mean Ruby, Sapphire, & Emerald. It means Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald. Different things.



Red, Yellow, and Blue were colors before the gem was discovered, so have fun with that. Especially considering they're the primary colors, you can't claim the gem was discovered before people through to make an abbreviation out of the primary colors. You'll need some proof for that.

I linked you to those sites to show that those acronyms are used to mean "X, Y, and Z", and abbreviated XYZ. Therefore proof that at least you have the entire American government against your idea that it's wrong according to an arbitrary rule you made up.



...Not quite, you're claiming they didn't pass the fourth grade. You said



If the government agrees that using an abbreviation in this way is correct, then you're saying that they didn't pass the fourth grade. Simple logic.



What you've been doing is claiming that your way is objectively right, while everyone else's way is objectively wrong. And that's just not true. You haven't produced one scrap of evidence that implies that there's anything remotely wrong with the abbreviation RBY, considering it came before Ruby so it didn't clash with anything and had been out for years, getting that abbreviation cemented into the fandom so deep that it's pointless to change it. Besides...Ruby is 4 letters. If you're going to shorten it, why would you shorten it to 3 letters? No Pokemon game is shortened in that way. That makes no sense.




I'm not "implying" you've been angry. You have been. Maybe it was given away by you saying "I am obviously mad"? Lol. Everyone has noticed it, which is why you got such angry replies in return.

This post has been without most of the obvious condescending tone though, so thank you for that. If you have a problem with the way I handle my section, once again, take it up with higher staff. If not, stop claiming that I'm "wrongfully infracting" you. Those are your options.



Since when have any abbreviations required a separation to imply that they're separate words? Once again.

Show proof. Find the grammatical rule that backs you up.

If it's fourth grade knowledge, it shouldn't be difficult for you to find. You keep claiming you're right, but are completely ignoring all the instances that I'm showing you because they prove you wrong, while claiming you're right with nothing to back you up.

Now I see where I went wrong with the gender thing. Thanks for clarifying.

Ok, what draws the line between a correct initial or an incorrect initial?

I could say RUB, or RBY, or any variation, and it still implies ruby, even if the initial is incorrect in it's own self. The catalyst is the point of the statement you're using it in, for example:

If I say RBY out of nowhere, it obviously means nothing, but if I use it as a play on words, then it implies something. The implication given to the person listening is what's correct, not the initial or the abbreviation or whatever you want to call it.

*It's surprising to see how much this thread has derailed from my understanding of simple word seperation to reduce confusion, all the way to a large debate over grammar.


I never once intentionally insulted anyone in this thread. There have been a few remarks, but no names have been mentioned. As I have stated previously, I'm not pointing out anyone who's done it or not.

*To be clear, the only insulting remark I made was the comparison to 4th grade education. It's made as an implication or an exaggeration and not a literal fact.


Precisely. R/S/E is Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald. It's a lot less confusing when each word is seperated with the '/' mark, otherwise it sounds silly.

There is no pokemon game called RubySapphireEmerald. However, with the '/' marks, you can tell that there IS a pokemon game by the name of Ruby, Sapphire & Emerald because the words aren't so tight-fit.

Let me add something new to the thread, I'm not trying to change the word, I'm trying to lessen the confusion that this fanbase has been so subtle about. Maybe I'm the first person to notice it, maybe I'm not.


The point was that pokemon games came long after Ruby was a discovered gem. I'm fully aware colors came first. I don't need proof for that because gems were natural occurences found in rocks underground or in natural stone deposits. If miners existed before pokemon, then there's a good chance that the Ruby gem came first.

It's not so much of an arbitrary rule that I made. Like mentioned above, which I should've mentioned in my original post, I wanted to lessen confusion, not start a 'war' or an entire new word straight from my head. It's much easier to seperate the words when they're seperate games.

I never said the government was wrong with abbreviation, but I suppose it was implied. My main point was that they're corrupted and stupid in general, because they don't know how to run a country. Why do you think our economy is so bad? We owe massive debt to many different countries.


My way is objectively right? In my mind, yes. Because that's how a human mind works if they think something is right. I never enforced anyone to use the word, so I never even meant to seem objective, just lessen confusion, like mentioned above.

For the record, I never actually wanted to say RBY is Ruby. From a general standpoint, I suppose it is, but in pokemon games, it's more of a RedBlueYellow.


I'm trying to remain calm, keep a peaceful debate going on here, and in your first reply, you seemed assertive. You were almost demanding in your first reply as if you wanted me to tell you why I thought what I thought. To tell you the truth, my attitude spiked a bit, but I never let it get out of control. The other users in this forum however haven't been too reasonable to the general idea. Instead of asking me politely, they flame me by insulting my intelligence, or just being all-around disrespectful.

*I'm not saying I haven't been disrespectful, but at least I have a bit of self-control


Thank you for being understanding. I know you have different opinions, so I try to get on-par with them and find a solution to my own problems.

From the "wrongful infractions" business, there were actually a few given to me. One of which was from someone else, but essentially saying that my posts were meaningless even though I wanted to bring up a debate and see what everyone else thought of my idea without being too 'objective'. Like I said, that's a wrongful infraction. The infraction he had given me was essentially implying that every post I made was stupid. My life was stupid. My business on these forums are uneeded. To be fair, the rest of them are somewhat reasonable.

*In case you get the wrong idea, when I say 'he', I am referring to the other moderator that had given me an infraction.


Ok, I messed up here. I never meant to imply that abbreviations require seperation. Like mentioned (again) I said that I wanted to lessen confusion. In this case, seperating 3 different words when they are all different games is less confusing. I don't think I need proof for that, unless there is someone in the forum with OCD.


All of the instances you have provided ARE correct. I never denied them. The reason I find more things is because there ARE more things to use.

There is no line between initials and abbreviatons. They can both be added to words which sound different, but mean the same thing. That is my general point.

Actually.. my general point was just to get the opinion of everyone, and then I got sucked into this large grammatical debate over things I never thought I would have had to explain. Oh well.


Interestingly nontheless, this has been quite the nice conversation we have going on here. I would have to assume that you're gettin tired of it, so maybe I'll simmer down a bit, but I still would like some people to embrace the post I've made, and actually think it through before flaming me. I don't think there's been a single person like that yet.

So.. to summarize everything I've said here:


I don't really care for the Government.

I think that initials and abbreviations mean the same, but sound differently when used with the same word.

I don't want to enforce my opinion as if it's objective. I would rather everyone embrace it, and talk it over before coming to an immediate conclusion.

RBY = RedBlueYellow. Even if the initials are in 'correct' format, they are still 3 seperate games without the correct sentence structure.

R/B/Y = Red/Blue/Yellow. Yes, I know it's not spaced, but the '/' mark defines the point where the word is seperated from the other. It's not meant to change the entire word, just make the sentence a little less confusing.



I hope you have a better understanding of what point I'm trying to make. I know I can't change your mind, but I just want you to know what's been upsetting me. It seems that some people in this thread have totally misunderstood the point i'm trying to make. =/

 

[Oryx]

Now I see where I went wrong with the gender thing. Thanks for clarifying.

Ok, what draws the line between a correct initial or an incorrect initial?

The point I was making by bolding initial is that an initial is called such because it is the first letter of a word. Therefore, RBY isn't an initial of Ruby. It's an abbreviation. RBY is a set of initials for Red, Blue, and Yellow.

[quote[I could say RUB, or RBY, or any variation, and it still implies ruby, even if the initial is incorrect in it's own self. The catalyst is the point of the statement you're using it in, for example:

If I say RBY out of nowhere, it obviously means nothing, but if I use it as a play on words, then it implies something. The implication given to the person listening is what's correct, not the initial or the abbreviation or whatever you want to call it.[/quote]

For the record, if you said RUB out of nowhere I would have no idea what you were talking about.

*It's surprising to see how much this thread has derailed from my understanding of simple word seperation to reduce confusion, all the way to a large debate over grammar.

In reply to this and every other time in this post that you claim you weren't making an objective point: In your first post, you talk about people "screwing up", implying that they're wrong. You also call it an "incorrect grammatical format", and claim it "CANNOT be bunched up". All of these claim an objective reality of grammar rules. And there are objective grammar rules. The sentence "I runned to they stores" is grammatically incorrect, objectively. You were clearly claiming that there are objective grammar rules that people are breaking, not that either way is correct and you just like your way better.
Point A

I never once intentionally insulted anyone in this thread. There have been a few remarks, but no names have been mentioned. As I have stated previously, I'm not pointing out anyone who's done it or not.

Not naming a name (no matter how painfully obvious it is) doesn't mean you're not insulting anyone. If I say "People who don't go to college are morons that only deserve fast food jobs", I'm insulting both people who go to college and people that work in fast food, without naming any one person that it applies to. In this case, you insulted everyone that used the acronym in the way you claim is incorrect.

*To be clear, the only insulting remark I made was the comparison to 4th grade education. It's made as an implication or an exaggeration and not a literal fact.

It was rude.

Precisely. R/S/E is Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald. It's a lot less confusing when each word is seperated with the '/' mark, otherwise it sounds silly.

You missed the point here. You said "R/S/E" is Ruby, Sapphire, and Emerald. That's wrong. RSE is Ruby, Sapphire, and Emerald. R/S/E is Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald.

There is no pokemon game called RubySapphireEmerald. However, with the '/' marks, you can tell that there IS a pokemon game by the name of Ruby, Sapphire & Emerald because the words aren't so tight-fit.

Abbreviations in general don't abbreviate one word in that way. On occasion they do but it's much more common that it's a phrase and each word is the first letter of a word, the way RBY is. If it was one word it would be Rby, like Pt is Platinum because the t is part of the word.

Let me add something new to the thread, I'm not trying to change the word, I'm trying to lessen the confusion that this fanbase has been so subtle about. Maybe I'm the first person to notice it, maybe I'm not.

I have literally never met another person who has been confused by what RBY means, or RSE, or GSC, or any of the games. In fact, I've seen people type out RBYGSCFRLGHGSS and never seen anyone be confused as to what that meant. If you're not the first, the amount of people that are involved enough in the Pokemon fandom to join a forum about it and that are also confused by the acronyms is insanely low.

The point was that pokemon games came long after Ruby was a discovered gem. I'm fully aware colors came first. I don't need proof for that because gems were natural occurences found in rocks underground or in natural stone deposits. If miners existed before pokemon, then there's a good chance that the Ruby gem came first.

Yes, but the acronym RBY for Red, Blue,and Yellow as primary colors came before the gem ruby was discovered, is my point. Not the games.

It's not so much of an arbitrary rule that I made. Like mentioned above, which I should've mentioned in my original post, I wanted to lessen confusion, not start a 'war' or an entire new word straight from my head. It's much easier to seperate the words when they're seperate games.

Refer to point A, which I marked out above.

-snipping unrelated government stuff-

My way is objectively right? In my mind, yes. Because that's how a human mind works if they think something is right. I never enforced anyone to use the word, so I never even meant to seem objective, just lessen confusion, like mentioned above.

Okay, do you know the meaning of objective? Objective means outside your own mind. Something that is right to you, but is not necessarily right outside of your own mind, is not objective. It's subjective. Which is why saying other people are incorrect is wrong. That's like me saying "purple is the best color objectively...inside my mind. You like blue? That's wrong." If you meant subjective, then you wouldn't have used objective terminology such as "incorrect" in your opening post.

For the record, I never actually wanted to say RBY is Ruby. From a general standpoint, I suppose it is, but in pokemon games, it's more of a RedBlueYellow.

...You've spent this entire thread telling people how it makes more sense for RBY to be Ruby than what it's been for over 15 years now.

I'm trying to remain calm, keep a peaceful debate going on here, and in your first reply, you seemed assertive. You were almost demanding in your first reply as if you wanted me to tell you why I thought what I thought. To tell you the truth, my attitude spiked a bit, but I never let it get out of control. The other users in this forum however haven't been too reasonable to the general idea. Instead of asking me politely, they flame me by insulting my intelligence, or just being all-around disrespectful.

*I'm not saying I haven't been disrespectful, but at least I have a bit of self-control

You were aggressive and antagonistic in your opening post. Don't try to push your attitude off on me please, take responsibility. An opening post isn't a reaction to what someone else posted. I've been watching this thread closely and have deleted a post that's out of line already. Considering you called pretty much everyone replying here uneducated, do you really blame them for being angry at you?

Thank you for being understanding. I know you have different opinions, so I try to get on-par with them and find a solution to my own problems.

From the "wrongful infractions" business, there were actually a few given to me. One of which was from someone else, but essentially saying that my posts were meaningless even though I wanted to bring up a debate and see what everyone else thought of my idea without being too 'objective'. Like I said, that's a wrongful infraction. The infraction he had given me was essentially implying that every post I made was stupid. My life was stupid. My business on these forums are uneeded. To be fair, the rest of them are somewhat reasonable.

If you have a problem with an infraction, either bring it up to the staff member that gave it or talk to a higher staff member about it. They'll review it. Also, there's no "your life is stupid" infraction. You're reading way too much into it lol, the point of infractions are to let people know that that kind of posting isn't acceptable on the forums, not to tell people their lives are stupid. People tend to take infractions very seriously when they're not even that big a deal.

*In case you get the wrong idea, when I say 'he', I am referring to the other moderator that had given me an infraction.


Ok, I messed up here. I never meant to imply that abbreviations require seperation. Like mentioned (again) I said that I wanted to lessen confusion. In this case, seperating 3 different words when they are all different games is less confusing. I don't think I need proof for that, unless there is someone in the forum with OCD.

Can you find someone else who's even had a problem with confusion though? Considering I've never met anyone like that and no one here has either, the burden is on you to find people that have.

All of the instances you have provided ARE correct. I never denied them. The reason I find more things is because there ARE more things to use.

There is no line between initials and abbreviatons. They can both be added to words which sound different, but mean the same thing. That is my general point.

Actually.. my general point was just to get the opinion of everyone, and then I got sucked into this large grammatical debate over things I never thought I would have had to explain. Oh well.


Interestingly nontheless, this has been quite the nice conversation we have going on here. I would have to assume that you're gettin tired of it, so maybe I'll simmer down a bit, but I still would like some people to embrace the post I've made, and actually think it through before flaming me. I don't think there's been a single person like that yet.

If you're looking for an intelligent debate, I would recommend editing your opening post a bit to take out the parts that made it offensive to so many, and gear it more towards "this is my subjective opinion, do you see what I'm saying" instead of "you're wrong and dumb, I'm the only right person in the fanbase" like it reads now. I can see an interesting discussion on how the abbreviations developed in the fandom, but this thread wasn't set up as one.

RBY = RedBlueYellow. Even if the initials are in 'correct' format, they are still 3 seperate games without the correct sentence structure.

R/B/Y = Red/Blue/Yellow. Yes, I know it's not spaced, but the '/' mark defines the point where the word is seperated from the other. It's not meant to change the entire word, just make the sentence a little less confusing.



I hope you have a better understanding of what point I'm trying to make. I know I can't change your mind, but I just want you to know what's been upsetting me. It seems that some people in this thread have totally misunderstood the point i'm trying to make. =/

I still feel like you're completely ignoring every point I've made where I've shown you abbreviations that mean "X, Y, and Z" and are abbreviated as XYZ. Why does RBY = RedBlueYellow when it meaning Red, Blue, and Yellow makes so much more sense and is also correct?

 

[Serene Grace]

Whoa whoa whoa, reading through this thread has been quite interesting and quite funny to be honest. I'll go ahead and pipe in with my own opinions:

What you're saying is actually quite sensible. Writing R/B/Y is much more 'sensible' than RBY because the slashes show that you're talking about three things, which is what Red, Blue and Yellow are as opposed to Ruby. You're correct in that sense, somebody could easily get RBY misunderstood for Ruby, when the original speaker might have had Red, Blue and Yellow in mind.

However, keep in mind that this is a Pokemon Community (and I'm not just talking about the forum, I'm talking about everyone who talks about Pokemon on the internet) and there are just certain features of descriptive language that is used. Using RBY, as opposed to R/B/Y is the norm. And while you may thing the latter is less confusing, the fact that so many people use the first format means that it is more accepted and not at all confusing to most. If somebody was new to the community and wasn't sure, they would eventually find out one way or another (by asking, the contextual factors of the text, etc.)

Also dude - this is the internet. Some people like to be as perfect as they can with grammar online, which is actually very good in practice. However, always keep in mind that certain contextual factors may affect the way language is used. Not everything in the English Language is to the book (that's what makes it so beautiful in my eyes).

Also, the tone in which you type is quite aggressive for somebody who want to 'teach us'. Great teachers, more often than not, use inclusive and helpful messages to get their message across. Just another tip.

 

[Pieman50]

The point I was making by bolding initial is that an initial is called such because it is the first letter of a word. Therefore, RBY isn't an initial of Ruby. It's an abbreviation. RBY is a set of initials for Red, Blue, and Yellow.

[quote[I could say RUB, or RBY, or any variation, and it still implies ruby, even if the initial is incorrect in it's own self. The catalyst is the point of the statement you're using it in, for example:

If I say RBY out of nowhere, it obviously means nothing, but if I use it as a play on words, then it implies something. The implication given to the person listening is what's correct, not the initial or the abbreviation or whatever you want to call it.

For the record, if you said RUB out of nowhere I would have no idea what you were talking about.



In reply to this and every other time in this post that you claim you weren't making an objective point: In your first post, you talk about people "screwing up", implying that they're wrong. You also call it an "incorrect grammatical format", and claim it "CANNOT be bunched up". All of these claim an objective reality of grammar rules. And there are objective grammar rules. The sentence "I runned to they stores" is grammatically incorrect, objectively. You were clearly claiming that there are objective grammar rules that people are breaking, not that either way is correct and you just like your way better.
Point A



Not naming a name (no matter how painfully obvious it is) doesn't mean you're not insulting anyone. If I say "People who don't go to college are morons that only deserve fast food jobs", I'm insulting both people who go to college and people that work in fast food, without naming any one person that it applies to. In this case, you insulted everyone that used the acronym in the way you claim is incorrect.



It was rude.




You missed the point here. You said "R/S/E" is Ruby, Sapphire, and Emerald. That's wrong. RSE is Ruby, Sapphire, and Emerald. R/S/E is Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald.



Abbreviations in general don't abbreviate one word in that way. On occasion they do but it's much more common that it's a phrase and each word is the first letter of a word, the way RBY is. If it was one word it would be Rby, like Pt is Platinum because the t is part of the word.



I have literally never met another person who has been confused by what RBY means, or RSE, or GSC, or any of the games. In fact, I've seen people type out RBYGSCFRLGHGSS and never seen anyone be confused as to what that meant. If you're not the first, the amount of people that are involved enough in the Pokemon fandom to join a forum about it and that are also confused by the acronyms is insanely low.



Yes, but the acronym RBY for Red, Blue,and Yellow as primary colors came before the gem ruby was discovered, is my point. Not the games.



Refer to point A, which I marked out above.



Okay, do you know the meaning of objective? Objective means outside your own mind. Something that is right to you, but is not necessarily right outside of your own mind, is not objective. It's subjective. Which is why saying other people are incorrect is wrong. That's like me saying "purple is the best color objectively...inside my mind. You like blue? That's wrong." If you meant subjective, then you wouldn't have used objective terminology such as "incorrect" in your opening post.



...You've spent this entire thread telling people how it makes more sense for RBY to be Ruby than what it's been for over 15 years now.



You were aggressive and antagonistic in your opening post. Don't try to push your attitude off on me please, take responsibility. An opening post isn't a reaction to what someone else posted. I've been watching this thread closely and have deleted a post that's out of line already. Considering you called pretty much everyone replying here uneducated, do you really blame them for being angry at you?



If you have a problem with an infraction, either bring it up to the staff member that gave it or talk to a higher staff member about it. They'll review it. Also, there's no "your life is stupid" infraction. You're reading way too much into it lol, the point of infractions are to let people know that that kind of posting isn't acceptable on the forums, not to tell people their lives are stupid. People tend to take infractions very seriously when they're not even that big a deal.



Can you find someone else who's even had a problem with confusion though? Considering I've never met anyone like that and no one here has either, the burden is on you to find people that have.




If you're looking for an intelligent debate, I would recommend editing your opening post a bit to take out the parts that made it offensive to so many, and gear it more towards "this is my subjective opinion, do you see what I'm saying" instead of "you're wrong and dumb, I'm the only right person in the fanbase" like it reads now. I can see an interesting discussion on how the abbreviations developed in the fandom, but this thread wasn't set up as one.



I still feel like you're completely ignoring every point I've made where I've shown you abbreviations that mean "X, Y, and Z" and are abbreviated as XYZ. Why does RBY = RedBlueYellow when it meaning Red, Blue, and Yellow makes so much more sense and is also correct?[/QUOTE]


1. Let me re-iterate, I wasn't objective. I know what the word means, and I never tried to enforce it. If I wanted to enforce it, I could've came out by saying:

"I'll report this site to the grammar police!"

Which is obviously a practical joke. Nontheless, I had an objective, to reduce the confusion I've had in these forums. That was my only objective, and I used it to tell the community what I thought, which in turn backfired on me for no particular reason. I never once said that everyone had to abide by my standards, nor was it implied.


2. Yes, I know it may 'imply' that i'm insulting everyone, even if I don't name anyone. Here's what you need to understand though, If I don't name anyone, then i'm not pointing them out to everyone like a bully and embarassing them. When you think about it, I may have been 'rude', but I held back and remain anonymous.


3. As I have admitted, that was probably my only 'intentional' remark. I admit this, no need to rub it in.


4. Ruby, Sapphire & Emerald literally have the same exact subtle context that Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald does. I don't need a copy&paste to prove this one either:

Ruby, Sapphire & Emerald are all spaced apart, much like Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald, because the '/' mark seperates the words from one another.

Now.. the comma and the & symbol both do the same thing, just in a different format. They seperate the words from one another. This proves my point that they're both technically the same, and it didn't matter what format I used it in.

For the sole purpose of this thread, I would rather use the Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald because I mentioned R/S/E a few times before.


5. I always thought Pt was the Periodic Table Element for Platinum. In that case, it's an abbreviation. I was referring to D/P/P as in initials, not Periodic Elements.


6. I don't want to change the acronym. I'm glad there are other people like me, so I dn't feel like such a weirdo, but still...

All I've ever done when mentioning initials for pokemon was seperate the initials with '/' marks, so it didn't sound so clumped together like DiamondPearlPlatinum.


7. I know that.. I said it in my previous posts. I said I was aware that colours came first, but in terms of games, Ruby gems from the real world would've came first before Pokemon.


8. I'm not subjective. In the example you gave me, which I reviewed, I realized something.

Back when I was 10 years old, I thought anyone who didn't like Ice Cream was 'crazy'. Now I realize that some people are lactose intolerant, so they can't have that privilege.

If someone hates my favorite color I don't care. Like I mentioned in my previous posts, I don't care if anyone disagrees with me, I'm just saying that it 'could' be less confusing.


9. Yes, but I just now stumbled onto this forum. Back when Ruby game out, I didn't give a flying *censored* about the initial/abbreviation for Ruby.


10. I've been taking responsibility this entire time. I'm sorry if my attitude is sarcastic to you, but I haven't denied a single thing I've said. I only ever made a mistake, and corrected myself.




11. I never meant the "your life is stupid" was an actual infraction, but when I try to open up a forum of debate to learn more of some simple word, just to get infracted for "spam" or "meaningless posts" then that is a subtle implication of absolute cruelty. Duly note that I'm making an example from the infraction I was given, not taking it out on you.





12. I carry the burden of being confused a lot. I have a very short term memory, and I usually can't take the responsibility of being reminded of something, but when it comes to grammar, I fixate on what's right and what isn't.


We all have a different opinion of it, but I never understand why people bunch up the words instead of seperating them with the proper format.




13. I'll probably edit some parts of the original post out, but doing so would only make me more cowardly to the people that have already viewed this thread.




14. I understand the point you're trying to make. Vaguely. I can understand that RBY is an abbreviation of RedBlueYellow, but the word itself within the abbreviation is confusing. I don't want to say RedBlueYellow, I want to say Red/Blue/Yellow.


So you see, I do understand your point, I just don't understand that very specific concept of it.






As for anything else, I think our little debate might be derailing into an argument. As much as I would like to maintain this as a peaceful debate, the way you've expressed yourself, and the way I've expressed myself are giving off implications of a bit of a slow descent into an argument. Eventually, I'm gonna say something you think is extremely stupid, and then it'll branch off.



On a side note, I really like reading the different observations and opinions that you've given me. As much as that sounds 'sarcastic' it isn't. I think that if maybe we both calmed down about a silly subject, we could continue this debate like a normal conversation should. :)

 

[Captain Fabio]

I think this derailed into an argument long ago.

Why don't we all just refer to them by the generations? I/II/III/VI/V? This thread is rather interesting to read over, because I didn't think it really mattered to anyone over Poke'Grammar.

@Pieman50 - Either you are 'trolling' or you have come across the wrong way. Saying:

I hope I've educated this community a bit more.

Started this thread off in a bad way, maybe next time don't attempt to lecturer the members of PC and more set it up for discussion? Because, to me, that came across as you being arrogant.

Anyway, I don't think you meant for this to turn out this way...

/two cents​

​

 

[Pieman50]

I think this derailed into an argument long ago.

Why don't we all just refer to them by the generations? I/II/III/VI/V? This thread is rather interesting to read over, because I didn't think it really mattered to anyone over Poke'Grammar.

@Pieman50 - Either you are 'trolling' or you have come across the wrong way. Saying:



Started this thread off in a bad way, maybe next time don't attempt to lecturer the members of PC and more set it up for discussion? Because, to me, that came across as you being arrogant.

Anyway, I don't think you meant for this to turn out this way...

/two cents​

You only thought it was arrogant because of the way you let it 'play out' in your mind. This thread has not yet derailed into an argument, but I'm tired of people making conclusions based on the way they thought I said it.

 

[Captain Fabio]

I am not starting a fight here, Pieman50. I am simply giving my opinion and view on the matter. The problem is, a lot of the people here do think you have come across as arrogant and, maybe it wasn't your intention, but if other people have let it 'play out' in our mind that way, then maybe you have come across like that.

The problem is, even though this is a Pokemon forum, you are getting so worked up over something that, most people, really aren't bothered by. Most people don't want to be corrected on something so small that it makes no difference, because we all understand which games they are on about my saying RBY or R/B/Y or RedBlueYellow or Red Blue Yellow or Generation One or The one with Ash.

This is just a summary post really, just clearing up any lingering questions you might have had about my post.
I am going to bail out now so you don't get the wrong idea and think I am arguing with you.

Back on topic, I don't mind what people call the games, they can refer to them how they like in my opinion.​

​

 

[giradialkia]

You only thought it was arrogant because of the way you let it 'play out' in your mind. This thread has not yet derailed into an argument, but I'm tired of people making conclusions based on the way they thought I said it.

Well, I'm just saying...

So.. in my first few days in these forums, I've been noticing a lot of people screwing up their grammar. Now i'm not saying any names, but it's been happening a lot.

That comes off as quite condescending. As does saying "the way you let it play out in your mind". It seems to didn't intend to come off as rude, but if most people thing you're coming off as arrogant, then more often than not you're coming off as arrogant. That's just a general fact of life.

To at least comment on the topic a little bit- I don't think it matters whether people use slashes while abbreviating the names of the games in a generation. Everyone recognises what letters stand for what game, so it's never really been an issue in the slightest.

Ok, so essentially.. due to the HEAVY amounts of this incorrect grammatical format used, I would be implying that everyone doing this has seriously never passed the 4th grade. Like I said, I won't name anyone, but that's seriously what I've learned in the past couple of days.

Again, this comes off as a little condescending. Also, see the bolded text:
To my knowledge, Nintendo has never referred to the games in their abbreviated forms. Therefore there's no strictly "correct" way to do so. When people see the letters "RBY", "GSC" and so on, others here simply know that they mean "Red, Blue, Yellow", "Gold, Silver, Crystal" and so on. I guess nobody can stop you from saying they're wrong, but you can definitely expect most people not to care what you think about this particular case of grammar use.

Case and point, everyone needs to learn that SOME grammar cannot be bunched up in the way you guys are using it. Especially not with acronyms.

To be honest I've kinda lost interest in typing this, hahaha, so I'mma just conclude and say you shouldn't get so hung up on grammar use on the internet. This forum is huge, FULL of members, and... you're really not going to get anywhere by telling people they're using incorrect grammar when simply trying to abbreviate.

I hope I've educated this community a bit more. I've reviewed the thread I made, and as far as I'm aware, since I didn't name anyone, I am not breaking any rules, as I'm just trying to encourage help with everyone. Thank you for your time.

"I'm tired of people making conclusions based on the way they thought I said it." :/

 

[bobandbill]

Alrighty.

You only thought it was arrogant because of the way you let it 'play out' in your mind. This thread has not yet derailed into an argument, but I'm tired of people making conclusions based on the way they thought I said it.

Then maybe, if there have been both reports about your attitude, and people saying in the thread that you're coming off as arrogant, that your use of language gives off that vibe. Even if you didn't mean to do so, it doesn't change what was said and suggesting that people who don't use slashes don't know 4th grade grammar and so forth (see above posts) comes off as rude. But well, this quote speaks for itself:

I would be implying that everyone doing this has seriously never passed the 4th grade.

And to boot, you really come off as arrogant when you post things like this:

11. I never meant the "your life is stupid" was an actual infraction, but when I try to open up a forum of debate to learn more of some simple word, just to get infracted for "spam" or "meaningless posts" then that is a subtle implication of absolute cruelty. Duly note that I'm making an example from the infraction I was given, not taking it out on you.

From the "wrongful infractions" business, there were actually a few given to me. One of which was from someone else, but essentially saying that my posts were meaningless even though I wanted to bring up a debate and see what everyone else thought of my idea without being too 'objective'. Like I said, that's a wrongful infraction. The infraction he had given me was essentially implying that every post I made was stupid. My life was stupid. My business on these forums are uneeded. To be fair, the rest of them are somewhat reasonable.

I assume you are referring to the warning I gave you when you posted this in a thread which was about saying what one likes about the HGSS games (ie making your post off-topic). I am fairly confident you are alluding to me because you tried the same thing in your PM reply, but seeing you want to mention it publically I think it's only clear and fair to clarify it once again what was said here.

My infraction message to you, with the part I said (the rest is automated by the forum) bolded

Spoiler:

Pieman50, you've received a warning for one of your posts here at the PokéCommunity Forums.

Reason: SPAM (meaningless or off-topic posts)

The staff member who issued the warning has included the following message:

The thread was for discussing things in HGSS rather than going on a rant on how people should use an abbreviation with a slash in it to refer to one set of games, making your post off-topic and arguably rude as well (there is no canon abbreviation and variations of say FR/LG is not uncommon to see on any Pokemon forum. What matters is really if it's clear what game is being talked about, so HGSS does that. Stating people don't know grammar for not using a slash like yourself in an abbreviation is unnecessary). Please stay on topic in future.

You can view the post this warning was given for by clicking here. The post is also quoted below:

When will people ever learn correct grammar.

Not so much as borderline grammar, but in a sense, when you say HGSS, you mean that it's all one word.

In actuality, they're two seperate words conjoined with one another, so in order to correctly use it without confusion, you use the '/' mark. Perhaps no one has ever heard of it in these forums, so let me use it here:

R/B/Y
G/S/C
R/S/E
FR/LG
D/P/P
HG/SS
B/W


Since they're all seperate games, it's also more appropriate this way.

(If you get an error message when trying to view the link, it means the moderators have probably deleted the message already.)

Warnings are different from infractions; they don't actually add any points or count towards your record for getting suspended. We're giving you this warning so you can have a chance to see what you've done wrong and improve before you receive infraction points. If you have any questions about warnings or infractions (or the difference between them), take a look at this thread and feel free to post any questions there. Further information about the infraction system can be found by clicking here (you can also ask any questions you have about the system in that thread.)

It's important that you read and understand the rules for posting here at PokéCommunity. A complete set of rules can be found in this thread, be sure to read and review them until you're clear on their meaning. If you have any questions, you're more than welcome to ask them in the Community Questions & Feedback forum.

Now, you have said in your PM reply and here that I have 'meaningless post'. I never said it was meaningless - if you see me using that phrase in that infraction PM message quoted above then please point it out. All I did say was that your post was off-topic for the thread it was in and taken to be rude (again, see posts above on the latter). So to then claim publically that it was a 'subtle implication of absolute cruelty' to get a mere warning on a Pokemon forum for breaking said rules, and in doing so putting words in my mouth after I told you to kindly not do that in PM when you first made the claim, is rather rude.

So next time you want to post a sob story or whatnot I suggest not relying on having to make it up, because you got two warnings, one for posting off-topic and one for censor bypass. To claim that they were for stating your posts were meaningless or somehow implying your posts were stupid when I clearly did not say it is lying, and people don't often take too kindly to that.

Saying those warnings were a way for us to say 'your life is stupid' is just laughable; how does it say that, and furthermore why would we say that?



As for the topic at hand. Let's look at what good old Wikipedia says on acronyms as you mentioned them in your first post:

Acronyms and initialisms are abbreviations formed from the initial components in a phrase or a word. These components may be individual letters (as in CEO) or parts of words (as in Benelux and Ameslan). There is no universal agreement on the precise definition of the various terms (see nomenclature) nor on written usage (see orthographic styling). While popular in recent English, such abbreviations have a (rather scant) historical use in English and a more common historical use in certain other languages. As a type of word formation process, acronyms and initialisms are viewed as a subtype of blending.

(...)

The term acronym is the name for a word from the first letters of each word in a series of words (such as sonar, created from sound navigation and ranging).[1] Attestations for "Akronym" in German are known from 1921, and for "acronym" in English from 1940.[2] While the word abbreviation refers to any shortened form of a word or a phrase

In a nutshell - can be parts of a word or individual letters, and there's no agreement on their various definitions or how they should be written ('written usage'); just there are various ways and definitions (as the rest of the page lists). So in other words, there's no one right way necessarily, and so I'd argue the main thing in acronym usage is understandablity - does one know what you are talking about in using it/does it make sense?

Nothing there saying one has to separate different things with slashes. For instance, sonar could be, using your method, son/r (sound navigation (and) ranging, two different things), but it's not how it is done here, and the norm tends to be without slashes.

This doesn't make slashes wrong, but again - with Pokemon games, the norm has often been to forego the slashes. I imagine a reason for this is in the treatment of the pairs/trios of game as one (let's face it, SS is very similar to HG for instance), and so when someone says 'do you like HGSS' they mean the set of games, and thus are treating those as one entity rather than two separate, as they're just the same game with a couple of minor changes (namely what legendary you get first and a few available Pokemon).

RBY has also been used long before Ruby came out as a shortening of Red, Blue and Yellow, so RBY as the abbreviation for Ruby seems quite odd and certainly is something I haven't seen anyone else use (nor for that case anything like that for other games, e.g. SPPHRE or PLTNM for Sapphire and Platinum). Those would be less clear too due to the fact the norm has already been established and it's not immediantely clear if you're saying sapphire or sphere for instance.

And there's Toujours' post:

Since when have any abbreviations required a separation to imply that they're separate words? Once again.

Show proof. Find the grammatical rule that backs you up.

If it's fourth grade knowledge, it shouldn't be difficult for you to find. You keep claiming you're right, but are completely ignoring all the instances that I'm showing you because they prove you wrong, while claiming you're right with nothing to back you up.

If you want people to follow your way rather than the way the vast majority of the fandom has been using for over a decade, there should be a rather strong reason for it, and there hasn't been much besides 'I think it should be this way'. If that is all there is to your argument, then... that's nice, but I think people will generally keep using the norm.

Don't see myself saying anything else in here - what it boils down to is what people prefer to use, and the norm has already been established over a decade ago and unless there's a good reason why people can't say 'HGSS' or 'DPPt' in treating the two/three games as a set and hence one object, then I don't see any reason why they are wrong given the lack of evidence shown that they are wrong and confusing.

 

[Pieman50]

Well, I'm just saying...

That comes off as quite condescending. As does saying "the way you let it play out in your mind". It seems to didn't intend to come off as rude, but if most people thing you're coming off as arrogant, then more often than not you're coming off as arrogant. That's just a general fact of life.

To at least comment on the topic a little bit- I don't think it matters whether people use slashes while abbreviating the names of the games in a generation. Everyone recognises what letters stand for what game, so it's never really been an issue in the slightest.

Again, this comes off as a little condescending. Also, see the bolded text:
To my knowledge, Nintendo has never referred to the games in their abbreviated forms. Therefore there's no strictly "correct" way to do so. When people see the letters "RBY", "GSC" and so on, others here simply know that they mean "Red, Blue, Yellow", "Gold, Silver, Crystal" and so on. I guess nobody can stop you from saying they're wrong, but you can definitely expect most people not to care what you think about this particular case of grammar use.

To be honest I've kinda lost interest in typing this, hahaha, so I'mma just conclude and say you shouldn't get so hung up on grammar use on the internet. This forum is huge, FULL of members, and... you're really not going to get anywhere by telling people they're using incorrect grammar when simply trying to abbreviate.

"I'm tired of people making conclusions based on the way they thought I said it." :/

I did read your whole post, but I would like to point something out.

For the sake of some people in this thread that overreacted about a small implication, I've edited my original post.

There were only a select few people that actually raged over it, but the rest have sort of done the same without letting the thread derail. This; I can accept. Even if we don't agree on something, at least i'm not being yelled at.

 

[Ducklighter]

I did read your whole post, but I would like to point something out.

For the sake of some people in this thread that overreacted about a small implication, I've edited my original post.

There were only a select few people that actually raged over it, but the rest have sort of done the same without letting the thread derail. This; I can accept. Even if we don't agree on something, at least i'm not being yelled at.

I actually feel a little insulted by that little edit you've added to your post, especially considering everybody's comment have been nothing more than a reasonable reaction to a rather offensive and arrogant post. Not only were the people not flaming but they weren't inciting an argument or 'trolling' you.

I really think you need to consider how you come across with your words if you would like a better reaction because there's a fine line between debate and argument. Your original written was provoking and although you seemed to mention that people were guilty of this and you weren't going to mention any names, it really did seem your intention wasn't to 'educate' the people of the board but more to really aggravate those who do not use your preferred way of writing. Personally, I thought you came across as rather rude and condescending.

Simply putting it, watch how you word a post if you don't want people to take it the wrong way. Generally, if a majority think you come off a certain way, it's for you to change that perception by explaining a bit more.

PS. Sorry for derailing the thread. xD

 

[Oryx]

Okay, here's what I'm going to do.

This thread is going to be closed. It's not a discussion on the acronyms of Pokemon, it's people trying to explain to Pieman why he's being arrogant and rude, and him denying it.

Pieman, you're welcome to make a new thread focusing on promoting discussion about what acronyms you use, whether or not you've ever been confused by a Pokemon acronym, etc. However, you need to seriously watch your tone and language. Since you seem entirely unable to do that on your own, based on you claiming everyone who said you were rude was trolling instead of taking their points into consideration, I very strongly suggest you PM me a draft of your OP before you post it to make sure that you're not being condescending or rude.