6th Gen Primal Reversion Discussion & Speculation Thread

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

Ah, I had forgotten about Kyurem's alternate formes. You're right, there's precedent of it happening then.

I still consider it a problem however, especially if you take into account that these alternate formes would overshadow Groudon and Kyogre (both of whom are already very powerful) as opposed to overshadowing regular Kyurem (who actually needed a boost compared to other legendary mascots).

Kyurem actually has only 10 bst points less than Groudon and Kyogre. It's horrible typing was it's weakest point.

 

[Iceshadow3317]

If I am not mistaking, didn't one of the earlier trailers show Primal Kyogre and Groudon changing from normal in a battle much like Megas?

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

If I am not mistaking, didn't one of the earlier trailers show Primal Kyogre and Groudon changing from normal in a battle much like Megas?

Yes, that's why I think they're temporary only forms.

 

[Leaf Magics]

Kyurem actually has only 10 bst points less than Groudon and Kyogre. It's horrible typing was it's weakest point.

It still needed a boost to be closer to the other mascots (it was like 3 tiers below them). Groudon and Kyogre don't.

If I am not mistaking, didn't one of the earlier trailers show Primal Kyogre and Groudon changing from normal in a battle much like Megas?

I think one showed the start of a transformation sequence, then cut to out-of-game graphics.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

It still needed a boost to be closer to the other mascots (it was like 3 tiers below them). Groudon and Kyogre don't.



I think one showed the start of a transformation sequence, then cut to out-of-game graphics.

I doubt Gf cares about a Mascot's tier. Beside's Black Kyurem is like one or two tiers below the mascots...

Yeah, they did.

 

[Iceshadow3317]

I would also like to point out that Mega Sceptile also seems to be getting a signature move to support the idea of primals being like megas. This seems to be proven in a trailer for the upcoming Mega Evo Part 2 in the anime where it shoots off its tail.

 

[Leaf Magics]

I doubt Gf cares about a Mascot's tier. Beside's Black Kyurem is like one or two tiers below the mascots...

Yeah, they did.

Even if ignoring non-Game Freak tiers (which I'll do from now on), they realized it was weaker than the others. In fact, I would even say that Kyurem was originally designed to be weaker. Otherwise, I don't think they would have given it two new formes with 40 extra base total plus some new attacks with no in-battle drawback, given that it was already a box legendary, and already just as ban-worthy as Pokémon like Mewtwo or Arceus, according to Game Freak themselves.

They could have made Kyurem's formes' stats be redistributions of the original Kyurem's, like they did with Giratina, who was already on par with its fellow mascots. But they didn't, because they knew that it was weaker than its counterparts, and knew that it needed higher stats to be closer to them. Of course, Kyurem's alternate formes ended up having higher stats than its counterparts, but they also got a restriction of one per game, and require giving up one of the legendary dragons for as long as one wants to use the alternate Kyurem forme.

Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre's restriction could be a one-per-battle limit shared with Mega Evolution, if their transformation happens in battle (which is what I think will happen). The alternative could be a reduction in their other stats, which would probably mean a redistribution like Giratina's in a transformation outside of battle.

I would also like to point out that Mega Sceptile also seems to be getting a signature move to support the idea of primals being like megas. This seems to be proven in a trailer for the upcoming Mega Evo Part 2 in the anime where it shoots off its tail.

Maybe all starters will get signature moves from now on, like the Kalos ones did.

 

[Altairis]

I would also like to point out that Mega Sceptile also seems to be getting a signature move to support the idea of primals being like megas. This seems to be proven in a trailer for the upcoming Mega Evo Part 2 in the anime where it shoots off its tail.

I don't know how much this information means, because several non-Legendary Pokemon already have signature moves, or have had them in the past before distributed to other Pokemon.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

Even if ignoring non-Game Freak tiers (which I'll do from now on), they realized it was weaker than the others. In fact, I would even say that Kyurem was originally designed to be weaker. Otherwise, I don't think they would have given it two new formes with 40 extra base total plus some new attacks with no in-battle drawback, given that it was already a box legendary, and already just as ban-worthy as Pokémon like Mewtwo or Arceus, according to Game Freak themselves.

They could have made Kyurem's formes' stats be redistributions of the original Kyurem's, like they did with Giratina, who was already on par with its fellow mascots. But they didn't, because they knew that it was weaker than its counterparts, and knew that it needed higher stats to be closer to them. Of course, Kyurem's alternate formes ended up having higher stats than its counterparts, but they also got a restriction of one per game, and require giving up one of the legendary dragons for as long as one wants to use the alternate Kyurem forme.

Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre's restriction could be a one-per-battle limit shared with Mega Evolution, if their transformation happens in battle (which is what I think will happen). The alternative could be a reduction in their other stats, which would probably mean a redistribution like Giratina's in a transformation outside of battle.



Maybe all starters will get signature moves from now on, like the Kalos ones did.

The Hoenn starters themselves were actually the first to get signature moves, Leaf Blade for Sceptile, Blaze Kick for Blaziken, and Muddy Water for Swampert. Followed by the Kanto starters who were given the elemental hyper beams in the Kanto remakes. Sadly those Gen III signature moves were no longer signature moves come Gen IV. Also Unova's had semi-signature moves, but sadly GF didn't make them signature moves, even though they could. Leaving Tepig's line with the only signature move out of the Unova mons.

Anyways I honestly see the Primals being in battle only like Megas too. Now the biggest question is if that's the path they're going to take, will we be able to use both a Mega and a Primal? or will the one mon slot be shared by both.

 

[Leaf Magics]

The Hoenn starters themselves were actually the first to get signature moves, Leaf Blade for Sceptile, Blaze Kick for Blaziken, and Muddy Water for Swampert. Followed by the Kanto starters who were given the elemental hyper beams in the Kanto remakes. Sadly those Gen III signature moves were no longer signature moves come Gen IV. Also Unova's had semi-signature moves, but sadly GF didn't make them signature moves, even though they could. Leaving Tepig's line with the only signature move out of the Unova mons.

That's actually news to me; I never knew any of those were signature moves back then. By the time I started actually paying attention to those things it was Gen IV.

OK, rephrasing: Maybe all starters will get signature moves (that are actually intended to be signature moves and stay like that) from now on, like the Kalos ones did and have kept so far.

Anyways I honestly see the Primals being in battle only like Megas too. Now the biggest question is if that's the path they're going to take, will we be able to use both a Mega and a Primal? or will the one mon slot be shared by both.

I think it will be a one-per-battle limit shared with Mega Evolution, like I said before.

Although I honestly would love to be able to use Primal Kyogre along with Mega Mewtwo Y (Mega Mewtwo Y is my favorite Mega and I like how Primal Kyogre looks), but if the boosts are comparable, it would make sense that they share the limit with Mega Evolution.

 

[L0RD G3NGAR]

I doubt they will reveal primal Rayquaza, as they obviously dont want us to know Sky pillar is there. Maybe we have to find it ourselves then take it to somewhere >.<
Or Maybe it will be an Event. But I doubt we will be shown it before November 21st. Maybe the December CoroCoro

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

That's actually news to me; I never knew any of those were signature moves back then. By the time I started actually paying attention to those things it was Gen IV.

OK, rephrasing: Maybe all starters will get signature moves (that are actually intended to be signature moves and stay like that) from now on, like the Kalos ones did and have kept so far.



I think it will be a one-per-battle limit shared with Mega Evolution, like I said before.

Although I honestly would love to be able to use Primal Kyogre along with Mega Mewtwo Y (Mega Mewtwo Y is my favorite Mega and I like how Primal Kyogre looks), but if the boosts are comparable, it would make sense that they share the limit with Mega Evolution.

I have a feeling the Kalos starters will lose their signature moves come Gen VI like how the Hoenn starters did :(.

On topic. Yeah, I can't see them allowing us to use two very strong Pokemon in one battle.

Now, if Rayquaza get's a signature move I wonder how it'll look like. Groudon's is half cooled down lava, Kyogre's looks like a powerful jet of water arrows. Since their signature move shows off their Primal's typings well, and if Rayquaza like Kyogre keeps the same typing as it's normal form, perhaps Rayquaza will get a meteor attack that involves slicing winds. Whatever it ends up looking like I see it coming from above, in contrast to how Groudon's move comes from below, and Kyogre's comes towards you from in front. Well behind could work too. Or maybe it'll start from above and end with something hitting the opponent from behind.

Btw, has anyone else noticed how the legendary Pokemon with Megas have signature moves? Latios has his Luster Purge, and Latias has her Mist Ball, the Mewtwos have Psystrike, and Diancie has it's Diamond Storm...

 

[Leaf Magics]

Now, if Rayquaza get's a signature move I wonder how it'll look like. Groudon's is half cooled down lava, Kyogre's looks like a powerful jet of water arrows. Since their signature move shows off their Primal's typings well, and if Rayquaza like Kyogre keeps the same typing as it's normal form, perhaps Rayquaza will get a meteor attack that involves slicing winds. Whatever it ends up looking like I see it coming from above, in contrast to how Groudon's move comes from below, and Kyogre's comes towards you from in front. Well behind could work too. Or maybe it'll start from above and end with something hitting the opponent from behind.

I think something to do with meteors or ozone would fit it nicely. Ozone Buster from the TCG would look great on it. It or whatever attack it gets could be like a physical Draco Meteor, or a flying- or dragon-type equivalent of Water Spout and Eruption. It could also just be an equivalent of the new moves, assuming those two are equivalent among themselves.

Btw, has anyone else noticed how the legendary Pokemon with Megas have signature moves? Latios has his Luster Purge, and Latias has her Mist Ball, the Mewtwos have Psystrike, and Diancie has it's Diamond Storm...

Well, many legendary Pokémon have signature moves already, so as more legendary Pokémon get Mega Evolutions, they will start overlapping.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

I think something to do with meteors or ozone would fit it nicely. Ozone Buster from the TCG would look great on it. It or whatever attack it gets could be like a physical Draco Meteor, or a flying- or dragon-type equivalent of Water Spout and Eruption. It could also just be an equivalent of the new moves, assuming those two are equivalent among themselves.



Well, many legendary Pokémon have signature moves already, so as more legendary Pokémon get Mega Evolutions, they will start overlapping.

I hope it ends up being a Flying type move as Rayquaza lacks good flying type moves. Maybe Primal Rayquaza will get Aerleiate too.
Primal Groudon can get Solid Rock, and Primal Kyogre can get Water Absorb. That is if they don't gain brand new signature abilities.

 

[Centipede Chan]

I have an idea for the names of the new moves for Kyogre and Groudon:

Groudon - Primal Burn
Kyogre - Ancient Wave

Yes? No?

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

I have an idea for the names of the new moves for Kyogre and Groudon:

Groudon - Primal Burn
Kyogre - Ancient Wave

Yes? No?

Maybe they'll be - SuperVolcano and MegaTsunami respectably. Rayquaza could get something like Quasar (as it has a relation to stars, plus it's in it's name) or perhaps something like Super Outbreak to match it's role as the sky deity of the Pokemon world (plus it's more likely to be a flying type move).

 

[Bobbylicious]

This has probably already been mentioned, but I think there's an obvious Primal pokemon choice.

*Looks at Dialga*

Regardless, it's a pretty cool thing, from what I've seen.

People really need to dissociate primal dialga from primal kyogre and groudon... The games are entirely different in canon

In PMD dialga becomes "primal" because iirc he's overcome with rage... Where in ORAS kyogre and groudon become primal because they revert back to their original formes before they created land and sea or whatever, making them more powerful because they haven't used that power ton create stuff yet.

There's a huge difference between the two and they're not even similar in the slightest.... People, please stop comparing the two it's a major annoyance of mine......

 

[AFeralFurry]

People really need to dissociate primal dialga from primal kyogre and groudon... The games are entirely different in canon

In PMD dialga becomes "primal" because iirc he's overcome with rage... Where in ORAS kyogre and groudon become primal because they revert back to their original formes before they created land and sea or whatever, making them more powerful because they haven't used that power ton create stuff yet.

There's a huge difference between the two and they're not even similar in the slightest.... People, please stop comparing the two it's a major annoyance of mine......

*Shrug*

My bad. I suppose I made an error, I thank you in correcting it./Sincerity mode.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

People really need to dissociate primal dialga from primal kyogre and groudon... The games are entirely different in canon

In PMD dialga becomes "primal" because iirc he's overcome with rage... Where in ORAS kyogre and groudon become primal because they revert back to their original formes before they created land and sea or whatever, making them more powerful because they haven't used that power ton create stuff yet.

There's a huge difference between the two and they're not even similar in the slightest.... People, please stop comparing the two it's a major annoyance of mine......

They aren't even called the same thing in Japanese (and in other languages) to begin with, so yeah, they aren't the same thing.

It would be interesting if Dialga (Palkia, and Giratina) got a Primal form though. But those should probably be saved for DPP remakes.

 

[Mark Kamill]

Wait, new moves? Wouldn't that mean complete and utter lockout for using Groudon/Kyogre in XY, considering how I can't see a move just popping up mid-battle? Or they really are going to patch everything into XY, just unable to obtain em unless through trade. As for the DPt legends, I'm assuming they're not going to be primal, but universal. Or better, Temporal/Spacial/Anti.