[Discussion] Redesigning the example maps

[Maruno]

As everyone knows, Essentials comes with a pre-made collection of maps, which contain examples of many of the things you can do in Essentials. However, they're pretty old now, and need updating.

That's where you come in!

This thread is all about redesigning these maps. It's your chance to do some map-making and planning, so that we can come up with a decent set of maps that includes as much as possible while looking good.

Some questions for you to consider/discuss:

• What features should be included?
• How should the maps be laid out? As a "hub" map with links to other maps that each demonstrate one or two features, or as a small game itself starting in the player's house then getting the starter, etc.
• What about the graphics? Tilesets, sprites, etc.
• Can you design any puzzles (boulder pushing, boulders 'n' holes, ice sliding, etc.) that could be included? This also includes an example Gym, doors requiring a Key Item to open, maybe a fetch quest, etc.
• Can you make some concept maps, preferably complete with a description of what goes in them?

Have fun!

 

[Ho-oh 112]

If I get some time I'll start making a few for the kit.

Some questions for you to consider/discuss:

• What features should be included?
• How should the maps be laid out? As a "hub" map with links to other maps that each demonstrate one or two features, or as a small game itself starting in the player's house then getting the starter, etc.
• What about the graphics? Tilesets, sprites, etc.
• Can you design any [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]puzzles[/COLOR][/COLOR] (boulder pushing, boulders 'n' holes, ice sliding, etc.) that could be included? This also includes an example Gym, doors requiring a Key Item to open, maybe a fetch quest, etc.
• Can you make some concept maps, preferably complete with a description of what goes in them?

Have fun!

3. I can give my DP Tiles with complete tile data

4. yes to most

5. yes

 

[RaulCortez]

Hey!

I think i have a couple of ideas:

- I think some people will definately say 5th gen Pokemon. Most of us have updated our games with the new gen pokemon already, but it would be great if they could be on the starter kit already.

- Also, the 4th gen sprites that come with the kit look irregular, maybe due to resizing?

For that i have a suggestion, why don't replace all the sprites to their 5th gen versions? I think the Ultimate BW pack could help with that, that's the one i'm using in my game.

- Features...Honey trees, maybe? i just love the idea.

- Also, i think the test maps are great as they are, but it could be great to have something like...for example:

An introduction (like prof. Oak's) that works like an encyclopedia with options to places that show you diferent functions. When you click on them, it warps you to the map that has said function. There, NPC's could tell you about the codes you can use, or things you must do to activate the feature.

It could help as a way to unify all the features.

That's all i can think about right now, hope it helps!

 

[Maruno]

If I get some time I'll start making a few for the kit.

3. I can give my DP Tiles with complete tile data

4. yes to most

5. yes

DP graphics? To be honest, I prefer FRLG. I'm actually in the middle of making a bunch of FRLG tilesets, which'll be nice. I know that the FRLG tilesets will be complete, while I don't know about the 4th and 5th Gen ones (because they're all custom drawn). That's what I think.

I look forward to your maps. Just post them in here when you've made them.

Hey!

I think i have a couple of ideas:

- I think some people will definately say 5th gen Pokemon. Most of us have updated our games with the new gen pokemon already, but it would be great if they could be on the starter kit already.

- Also, the 4th gen sprites that come with the kit look irregular, maybe due to resizing?

For that i have a suggestion, why don't replace all the sprites to their 5th gen versions? I think the Ultimate BW pack could help with that, that's the one i'm using in my game.

- Features...Honey trees, maybe? i just love the idea.

- Also, i think the test maps are great as they are, but it could be great to have something like...for example:

An introduction (like prof. Oak's) that works like an encyclopedia with options to places that show you diferent functions. When you click on them, it warps you to the map that has said function. There, NPC's could tell you about the codes you can use, or things you must do to activate the feature.

It could help as a way to unify all the features.

That's all i can think about right now, hope it helps!

The 5th Gen Pokémon thing is a separate issue. The Gen 4 sprites look weird because they've been resized and made smaller - an upcoming update will fix that.

Honey trees aren't in Essentials. Headbutt trees are, though. Again, whether they should be in or not is a separate issue.

So you're basically voting for the hub-like maps, where there's a central map you start on, and there are links there to all the other (separate) maps.

 

[Pokemon 3000]

[...]
For that i have a suggestion, why don't replace all the sprites to their 5th gen versions? I think the Ultimate BW pack could help with that, that's the one i'm using in my game. [...]

I think that's a good idea. In that case i have fit the sprites in the rpg maker format (e.g fileextensions (But they're still animated of course ;)) or the format of the names.) I can make the pack avaible for you.

 

[Ho-oh 112]

"image removed"

Features 3 events, ledge jumping boulder moving and boulder moving into a specific place, remove the .txt for it to work

 

[IceGod64]

• How should the maps be laid out? As a "hub" map with links to other maps that each demonstrate one or two features, or as a small game itself starting in the player's house then getting the starter, etc.

Okay, opinion time: The current default map is really dated. You're well aware, hence this thread existing.

I believe the engine , for demo purposes, should feature a HUB area in the center of the town map with all the demo areas surrounding it. Most of these islands are only one area with a house or something presumably, but other islands may be longer to show off the map connections, and some, as you've suggested already, may be locked until the player does something else, for the sake of example. Warp panels on the floor/ground of the Hub with sings next to them would be preferable to doors I think.

Also, as for tile sets, my suggestion is to go for a DS tileset, likely a simple one, to suit the new look you're working on, as well as HG/SS charsets (Luckily, these are easy to come by pre-assembled for RMXP.) The player character could easily be changed to Ethan and Lyra instead of Red/Leaf.

 

[p.claydon]

i think that they should be like a mini game but thats just my opinion

tileset seams fine as it is people can always update them selves

 

[Amekage]

If I can, erm, "get around" the fact that my trial period for RMXP is over, I'd be more than happy to redesign the maps! Of course, it might be a good idea to have any new tilesets implemented first.

I've always thought that with Essentials, it seemed really off to just randomly pop up in the test map after the intro. Since most people seem really keen on creating the classic adventure (wake up in your room, mom talks to you, find Professor, get starter, etc.), I think there should be some example maps with events that simulate that familiar start. Then there can be various other maps that fully demonstrate the capabilities of Essentials (because really, as it is, it's hard to tell what the kit can actually do).

 

[Maruno]

I've added a poll.

Personally, I started off thinking mini-game, but the argument about having to go through the start of it just to get to the rest of the example maps swayed me towards hub style. Perhaps rather than just having disembodied specialised maps, they could all be connected together as well as having warps between them, to flesh out the Town Map.

Any suggestions of features you think should be in the example maps, particularly ones that currently aren't? Shadow Pokémon and purification, for example. One big area just for various kinds of battle (trainer/wild, single/double, etc. etc.). Grouping together similar features, why not? If so, where?

Again, concept art helps with this (not just screenshots of maps, but also sketches of a Town Map with designated areas, and concept descriptions too). Nothing needs to be perfect at this stage; we just want an idea of what things should look like.

"image removed"

Features 3 events, ledge jumping boulder moving and boulder moving into a specific place, remove the .txt for it to work

Thanks for the contribution, although a screenshot would have been better. I'm not looking for actual maps to include, just concept art and a "theme".

Also, as for tile sets, my suggestion is to go for a DS tileset, likely a simple one, to suit the new look you're working on, as well as HG/SS charsets (Luckily, these are easy to come by pre-assembled for RMXP.) The player character could easily be changed to Ethan and Lyra instead of Red/Leaf.

Does a tileset particularly match up with the GUI? I think not; it's just that you happen to relate one part of the GUI with one map style, in which case this isn't an argument because the GUI is going to be a jumble of whatever works best.

I'll keep it with FRLG tilesets, unless someone has a decent reason why not.

 

[khkramer]

There´s nothing wrong with FRLG tilesets.

 

[Ho-oh 112]

I'm not going to do this, but I suggest updating the FR Tiles so that EVERY SINGLE LAST TILE has the correct properties.

 

[Maruno]

I'm not going to do this, but I suggest updating the FR Tiles so that EVERY SINGLE LAST TILE has the correct properties.

I'll do that when I make new tilesets.

 

[FL]

The Mini-game idea sounds interesting, but I prefer the default one.
I think on putting almost every NPC features for the outdoor test map at the indoor test map. After share it in a two rooms, the first one with about 20% of the content, but the most beginner ones (like the option of give a pokédex, give a specific pokémon, a list with more that 4 choices, makes the debug on, etc...) at the other with the 80% more advanced (like the lottery, connect with internet, etc...).
Group some related stuff in some rooms (shadow pokémon stuff, Triple triad, etc...). Remove the Pokécenter/Safari Zone/Bug Catch Contest doors at the indoor test map and put all in a big teleport list.

Makes the Day-Care man goes one tile forward like in official games when he is with one egg. To do his, in the PokemonDayCare Script you can put "$game_switches[YYY]=true" after "$PokemonGlobal.daycareEgg=1". After the Day-Care old man give you the egg, put a script line (if you put an event command this refresh screen) "$game_switches[YYY]=false" after every "$PokemonGlobal.daycareEggSteps=0" line. Change the "YYY" for one switch number, this switch will be on when the egg is generate and is off when the old man gives you the egg.
Maybe someone can futher upgrade this mini-script and make an option to Day-Care man call you by pokégear every time that the egg was generated.

 

[Minezumi]

Hey!

I think i have a couple of ideas:

- I think some people will definately say 5th gen Pokemon. Most of us have updated our games with the new gen pokemon already, but it would be great if they could be on the starter kit already.

- Also, the 4th gen sprites that come with the kit look irregular, maybe due to resizing?

For that i have a suggestion, why don't replace all the sprites to their 5th gen versions? I think the Ultimate BW pack could help with that, that's the one i'm using in my game.

- Features...Honey trees, maybe? i just love the idea.

- Also, i think the test maps are great as they are, but it could be great to have something like...for example:

An introduction (like prof. Oak's) that works like an encyclopedia with options to places that show you diferent functions. When you click on them, it warps you to the map that has said function. There, NPC's could tell you about the codes you can use, or things you must do to activate the feature.

It could help as a way to unify all the features.

That's all i can think about right now, hope it helps!

Jeez, it's been quite a while since I posted on here. Well, regarding the whole 5th gen thing, I'm against it. I for one hate most of the 5th gen, and think that I speak for a ton of others when I say that the Gen V sprites look awkward in essentials.

 

[IceGod64]

Jeez, it's been quite a while since I posted on here. Well, regarding the whole 5th gen thing, I'm against it. I for one hate most of the 5th gen, and think that I speak for a ton of others when I say that the Gen V sprites look awkward in essentials.

lol, bumping the thread.

Actually, I'm all for bumping this particular thread as it is relevant to the development on essentials. Hopefully the mods will agree.

Since I'm already posting, I'm just going to add that I hadn't actually expressed a vote before. I think the HUB world idea is the best option, as the main idea behind the starter maps should be showing what the stater kit has to offer, as opposed to simply emulating the games in the sense of introducing any story or false pretense there of. At best, a mini-game styled design would be sacraficing straight-forward presentation is favor of adding game play, which is rather unnecessary in the base kit.

 

[Maruno]

I was also wanting to bump this thread, actually. Please don't lock it!

I think a mostly-hub style would be best. That is, you start in a map which has teleports to the various other maps with their features, but all those maps are connected together normally as a mini-region - you could walk from area to area if you wanted, or bounce between them and the hub map.

Given that, what I'm really looking for now is ideas of what areas to have, and where to put features. There should be a variety of environments (city, grassy, cave, ice cave, water, underwater, etc.), and each area should probably be themed around a particular feature (e.g. one area full of battling-related stuff like trainers and tall grass). I want as many features as possible to be available in the example maps, for obvious reasons, and for them to be in logical places rather than scattered around randomly.

Jeez, it's been quite a while since I posted on here. Well, regarding the whole 5th gen thing, I'm against it. I for one hate most of the 5th gen, and think that I speak for a ton of others when I say that the Gen V sprites look awkward in essentials.

It's kinda difficult to add in the 5th Gen Pokémon without using the only available (albeit rubbish-looking) sprites.

 

[Nickalooose]

I think you should possibly use Kurts Region Map kit or rather just a few maps from it:

Intro, Pallet, Route 01, Viridian City, Route 02, Viridian Forest, Diglett's Cave and Pewter City.

Within each map you have a certain tutorial or help event if you wish.

Intro - Player Data.
Pallet - Lab, Home.

• Lab - Receiving/Giving Pokémon and PokéDex.
• Home - Receiving Money and Running Shoes + pbTrainerPC.

Route 01 - Wild Encounters.
Viridian City - PokéCenter and PokéMart.
Route 02 - Trainer Battles and Wild Encounters + pbItemBall.
Viridian Forest - pbItemBall + Wild Encounters + Trainer Battles.

Diglett's Cave - ...Cave... + Wild Encounters + Trainer Battles + pbItemBall.
Pewter City - Gym.


With these maps alone, you could add so many other events and tutorials for examples:


Within the lab, Rival battle, Rival naming, (the use of your [Maruno's] new Rival battle script), Move tutor, Name Rater and Move Deleter + Receive Egg (this is endless).


Pewter City before Route 03, show the usage of blocking when a certain switch is off... Museum the use of, pbReceiveItem(PBItems::AMBER).


Viridian City, add Battle Tower or whatever was put here in one of the games.


Just a few examples of how this can be done, but this is only my opinion and it's not like everyone here doesn't know their way around KANTO, I for one get well confused with the Essentials ones as they are, silly, but true... Maybe this is the only thing I can see which would be perfect for new game makers, but again, this is my opinion, nobody has to live by that.

​

 

[IceGod64]

Once again, I think the base kit should be pretty straight forward. Ideally, it's basically just presenting you with example situation to work off of.

Taking your example about Old Amber, we could have have a test place specifically called "Mountains" or something, and pretty much have the Old Amber or other fossil in a straightforward location that the player can get to right after being given their Pokémon, and have a Fossil-research lab or something nearby that restores it into a Pokémon.

 

[FL]

I was also wanting to bump this thread, actually. Please don't lock it!

I think a mostly-hub style would be best. That is, you start in a map which has teleports to the various other maps with their features, but all those maps are connected together normally as a mini-region - you could walk from area to area if you wanted, or bounce between them and the hub map.

Given that, what I'm really looking for now is ideas of what areas to have, and where to put features. There should be a variety of environments (city, grassy, cave, ice cave, water, underwater, etc.), and each area should probably be themed around a particular feature (e.g. one area full of battling-related stuff like trainers and tall grass). I want as many features as possible to be available in the example maps, for obvious reasons, and for them to be in logical places rather than scattered around randomly.

This question is hard to help. Maybe put basic features in more basics environments its all that I can think now, and the few that combine (fossil with montains/cave, berry with grassy/forest).

The Nickalooose idea is also interesting, but I prefer all the city/rotes united (except maybe a basic and a advanced city) and more environments (like dive area).