So some of my friends were out last Thursday. They went to a part of the city which is well-known for having a huge number of gay bars, clubs, etc. All of these friends of mine were just straight people who wanted to go have a bit of fun and see what it was like and, for the most part, it was all good for them and they had a great time, no harm done! However - one particular bar turned them away on the grounds that they weren't gay enough. It... kinda took me by surprise that they'd do this but apparently it's not all that uncommon a thing with similar places. What do you guys think of this? Is it ok for the bar to have such levels of exclusivity or is it discrimination against people of a particular sexual preference? Discuss!
Too straight for the gay bar.
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Well the part of town that you're on about has had a whole history about letting straight people into the gay village. When it started getting popular more and more straight people started turning up, kinda ruining the whole point of the place. To meet other gay people, be it for going home with them or just to be around like minded people. They couldn't really do anything about it until at one point someone tried opening a regular bar/cafe/club/idk what and the community flipped over it and the place eventually moved away. Since then I think the community has been trying to find a balance of what they can and can't do since then.
Anyway though, I don't agree with the whole policy, and I know that most clubs and bars round there won't do it since it's not actually allowed and it's classed as discrimination. But from what I've seen it's a more extreme version of when regular clubs will tell their bouncers to try and keep the club to a certain guy:girl ratio. Again I don't agree with that 100% either, but I don't think it's as bad as keeping a straight:gay ratio going. I know a gay person would freak out and probably get the authorities involved if they were discriminated against by someone who is only suppose to keep the piece and avoid and keep you safe.
Anyway though, I don't agree with the whole policy, and I know that most clubs and bars round there won't do it since it's not actually allowed and it's classed as discrimination. But from what I've seen it's a more extreme version of when regular clubs will tell their bouncers to try and keep the club to a certain guy:girl ratio. Again I don't agree with that 100% either, but I don't think it's as bad as keeping a straight:gay ratio going. I know a gay person would freak out and probably get the authorities involved if they were discriminated against by someone who is only suppose to keep the piece and avoid and keep you safe.
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I think it's discrimination. If a gay person walked into a regular bar and they went "sorry, you're too gay" it would cause a firestorm. I just don't think it's right to do in any place tbh.
Lucid
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This happened to me twice in New Orleans at separate bars, but I was the only girl with three guy friends. Places of business have the right to turn anyone away, so you have to respect what they want. People go to bars to meet others with shared interest, so I can see why if someone was just loitering, but most of the time they don't really care as long as you're buying drinks.
Oryx
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I think the people arguing "what if it's turned around???" aren't really getting the whole picture. LGBT people are a marginalized minority, there is a power structure in the world that makes it different if it was switched around. Someone keeping straight people out of a gay bar is very, very different from someone keeping gay people out of a "straight bar". You can tell because the people talking about straight bars equate them with regular bars, because the power is so skewed towards heterosexuals that places that are supposed to be "neutral" are actually "straight".
I don't see the problem with keeping straight people out of gay bars. In society, it's difficult enough for gay people to find another person that's both gay and attracted to them. Everywhere is "straight". What's so wrong with having one place that's just for them?
I don't see the problem with keeping straight people out of gay bars. In society, it's difficult enough for gay people to find another person that's both gay and attracted to them. Everywhere is "straight". What's so wrong with having one place that's just for them?
droomph
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I think there's an important example to be mentioned here.
In the US, you can't discriminate when you hire someone, unless it ruins the point of the job (eg an old man to play a role of a young woman in a movie). Same here. If the point of the gay bar is to meet fellow gay people, then discrimination of straight people is appropriate. However, if the bar is just to get the services then discrimination is wrong n
In the US, you can't discriminate when you hire someone, unless it ruins the point of the job (eg an old man to play a role of a young woman in a movie). Same here. If the point of the gay bar is to meet fellow gay people, then discrimination of straight people is appropriate. However, if the bar is just to get the services then discrimination is wrong n
Candanosa
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I have had many experiences with the gay community in recent years. From attending to Pride meetings at colleges to socializing with gay friends, it all have been fun. One thing I learned is that even those who don't look gay can be. During one of the Pride meetings I met a gay guy who was probably twice my size and did not looked gay all. Or at least he did not looked like the feminine version of gay men that we all have in our minds. After the meeting, I ended up walking him home because he was afraid of the dark.
My point is that although he could have probably destroyed me by the way he appeared to be. This giant was noting but a gentle, gay man. There is no "gay meter" or any way to say how gay someone is, therefore, one can not be judged by such means. It is discriminatory for them to do that and also discourages straight people looking to be involved in the gay community of doing so, further hindering the acceptance of gays in society.
My point is that although he could have probably destroyed me by the way he appeared to be. This giant was noting but a gentle, gay man. There is no "gay meter" or any way to say how gay someone is, therefore, one can not be judged by such means. It is discriminatory for them to do that and also discourages straight people looking to be involved in the gay community of doing so, further hindering the acceptance of gays in society.
Lucid
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It's not really discrimination because they aren't doing it for hateful reasons, they're just sticking to a demographic, not because they despise straight people.
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While I agree with the idea that minorities and women are entitled to their own exclusive space if they choose to have it since the default of most of society in the western world is straight-white-male, I think there is (or should be) a distinction between the person who wants to see something different and exotic and the person who who feels more comfortable in an LGBT community. Like, maybe someone who is curious, still feeling out their sexuality, and not entirely LGBT, but not exactly straight either.
kinataki
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i think that it was a discrimination but it wasn't a bad kind of discrimination at all, like karma kind of a discrimination. why do straight guys go to gay club, like you said; for having fun or -i am sure that it is this way- for making fun of gay people.
if you thought that gays were funny monkeys, i think you deserved that one coming.
and on the other hand, i don't really think that it was the biggest discrimination of all time.
keeping a gay guy out of a straight bar is so so so much diffrent than keeping a straight guy out of a gay bar. use your logic and figure out why.
and on the other other hand, it is kinda weird because not letting someone in because they don't look "too gay" is like discrimination to gay people, it stereotypes, and it is the opposite thing that the most gays try to change.
if you thought that gays were funny monkeys, i think you deserved that one coming.
and on the other hand, i don't really think that it was the biggest discrimination of all time.
keeping a gay guy out of a straight bar is so so so much diffrent than keeping a straight guy out of a gay bar. use your logic and figure out why.
and on the other other hand, it is kinda weird because not letting someone in because they don't look "too gay" is like discrimination to gay people, it stereotypes, and it is the opposite thing that the most gays try to change.
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I kind of agree with you there Touj but there is a huge difference between having a gay only space and a woman only space be it that you can usually tell when a person is a man or a woman (unless you're bringing in trans people, but that's a whole other story). The only way you can tell if a person is gay is to actually be that person, there isn't a set way to tell if you are a gay or straight. The problem with these clubs is that they are judging the people thy let in by how they act and look and weighing it up against gay stereotypes to see if they think you are "gay enough".
Being gay myself I know quite a few people who define as LGBT+ and I know quite a few who are like myself, and don't really fit in with the gay stereotype. This means that we can easily be mistaken as straight and can be turned away from the clubs, and I know one or two people who have had that happen to them.
Gay bars exist so gays can have their own environment for once. We live in a hetero-dominated world and in any non-gay-exclusive place you run the risk of asking out a heterosexual person and getting a beating for your effort. It is just plain ignorant to say it's discrimination to keep heterosexual people out of gay bars - use your heads/listen to Toujours. Gay bars exist so gay people can feel safe - the second you let hetero people in you make their existence pointless.
EDIT: I realise that's all worded awfully but I was in a rush!
EDIT: I realise that's all worded awfully but I was in a rush!
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If most of society wasn't so hateful and exclusive then there'd be no need for 'gay-only' or 'women-only' or 'minority-only' spaces.
What's with this arguement about how if it was a gay person then it would've caused a huge scene?
Yeah, maybe it would have, and it would've been ridiculous. So are you saying that you could justify throwing a fit and screaming your head off about it because somebody else might have?
No, because it's completely absurd. So please, don't typify all homosexual people as having the mentality of a five year old.
Personally, i'm going to both support gay bars, and condone this "discrimination".
I myself am heterosexual, but I have insight enough to know that finding others of the same sexual orientation as yourself can be rather difficult for gays and lesbians. Hell, if it were me who was making the decisions i'd have gay bars advertise it.
Because honestly, am I the only one who's really getting tired of everybody running around calling as many people as they can racist, sexist, and discriminating?
Grow up people. Build a ******* bridge, and get over it.
[/rant]
Edit:
LOL, Somebody commented on this post saying that the world is racist, sexist, and discriminating.
Okay there buddy, i'll take your word on that.
[/lmao]
Yeah, maybe it would have, and it would've been ridiculous. So are you saying that you could justify throwing a fit and screaming your head off about it because somebody else might have?
No, because it's completely absurd. So please, don't typify all homosexual people as having the mentality of a five year old.
Personally, i'm going to both support gay bars, and condone this "discrimination".
I myself am heterosexual, but I have insight enough to know that finding others of the same sexual orientation as yourself can be rather difficult for gays and lesbians. Hell, if it were me who was making the decisions i'd have gay bars advertise it.
Because honestly, am I the only one who's really getting tired of everybody running around calling as many people as they can racist, sexist, and discriminating?
Grow up people. Build a ******* bridge, and get over it.
[/rant]
Edit:
LOL, Somebody commented on this post saying that the world is racist, sexist, and discriminating.
Okay there buddy, i'll take your word on that.
[/lmao]
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I agree with Toujours 100%. It's a gay bar. If there were any gay bars in my area, the last thing I'd want inside are straight people. Why would a straight person go to a gay bar anyway? I can only think of 3 reasons why a straight person would want to go to a gay bar:
1) They want to make fun of the gays inside, which is really wrong;
2) They want to get hit on, which is also quite wrong (Since they mislead the gays);
3) They want to accompany a gay friend, which is okay I guess.
So, my final opinion would be: Straight people shouldn't be allowed into gay bars, unless they come there with gay friends.
1) They want to make fun of the gays inside, which is really wrong;
2) They want to get hit on, which is also quite wrong (Since they mislead the gays);
3) They want to accompany a gay friend, which is okay I guess.
So, my final opinion would be: Straight people shouldn't be allowed into gay bars, unless they come there with gay friends.
IceSage
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One of my favorite bars is a "gay bar" and they accept anyone no matter what their orientation is. Also, how in the world do they know your sexual orientation? Are they pre-judging you by your mannerisms? Cis-males can be gay as well, they don't know.
Perhaps it's different in my state and where I live... But usually "gay bars" are places that encourage ANYONE to join, and exhibit the utmost tolerance and openess no matter what sexuality you are.
Perhaps it's different in my state and where I live... But usually "gay bars" are places that encourage ANYONE to join, and exhibit the utmost tolerance and openess no matter what sexuality you are.
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Son, no one is ever too straight for the gay bar.
Just saiyan.
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Wow, seriously... I love this place. I never expected to have a controversial sexuality topic in a Pokemon Community. But I 100% agree with the bar for having not let the straight people in. I myself am bisexual, so I can go either way. Hahaha.
I agree because these people were going to all the other gay bars. Which means that there were many gay bars that they could have gone to without discrimination. It is fair to have a gay exclusive bar when there are other gay bars around that they could go to. Think of it like this Forum. There are certain places we can go to in order to post certain topics. Straight just isn't a topic for that particular gay bar. The mod would have to move that person to the appropriate bar... er forum.
As for straight guys going to gay bars... most straight guys I know wouldn't be caught dead in a gay bar. They're too homophobic. Which is okay, because they're the type of ignorant guy that you just don't want at a gay bar. The real reason straight guys go to these bars is to hit on the girls. As bad as that sounds, that's what my friends would do.
I agree because these people were going to all the other gay bars. Which means that there were many gay bars that they could have gone to without discrimination. It is fair to have a gay exclusive bar when there are other gay bars around that they could go to. Think of it like this Forum. There are certain places we can go to in order to post certain topics. Straight just isn't a topic for that particular gay bar. The mod would have to move that person to the appropriate bar... er forum.
As for straight guys going to gay bars... most straight guys I know wouldn't be caught dead in a gay bar. They're too homophobic. Which is okay, because they're the type of ignorant guy that you just don't want at a gay bar. The real reason straight guys go to these bars is to hit on the girls. As bad as that sounds, that's what my friends would do.