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Haha I wouldn't label Surf or Fly as 'interesting', but rather logical necessities to travelling the various regions of Pokemon. The other ones, like Rock Smash, Strength, and others, add to the environment, but could be removed. Don't know, I think I'd like HMs to stick around. They're not as annoying as having to open your Bag screen every time after a Repel runs out, which is something they fixed recently. I would be in favor of changing the mechanic so that players can teach new moves over HMs.

If TMs were like they were pre-Gen. V, then I'd be more for keeping HMs around since they're reusable. But now they're no different from TMs with the exception that they do stuff in the overworld. Plus, Flash and Rock Smash are now TMs, though they aren't needed often. (Not to mention it's possible to get through dark caves in Gen. III and later without using Flash.) At the very least, it'd be nice if the ones that aren't used often--Cut, Waterfall, and maybe Strength--could be taught over, while Fly and Surf cannot in case the player is in a place they can't get out of without either move. (There haven't been many of those for a while, if memory serves, but Mossdeep in Hoenn is a good example of this.)

I'd definitely be on board of removing HMs all-together. Regular attacks could help doing whatever that you do outside of battle, logically, so if that's the case, why do we need hidden moves? For example, you use Cut to chop small trees down, but same could be done with other similar hits, such as Slash, X-Scissor, and Metal Claw. To break-down rocks, you use Rock Smash, but if they wanted, they could have made attacks like Karate Chop, Mega Punch, Dynamic Punch, and High Jump Kick behave the same, exact way. Of course, this would require a lot of coding, but I'm pretty sure that all of it is possible. I would be sort of sad to see HMs disappear, personally, due to how used to I am to the system, but I'd still adapt; it's for the betterment of Pokémon games in general.

I'm afraid I can find nothing worth keeping as far as HMs go. Though I guess admittedly I'm being butthurt about them because I've spent the last.. uh.. every generation, having to take up a team slot or two for HM slaves. I really want to be able to stop doing that someday in the near future so I can actually carry around just my team members the whole game. It's not fun having to run back into the Pokemon Center all the time just for the sake of swapping out my team members for HM slaves to get past certain areas or to go certain places or whatever. :I

They really need to think of a better way to do this HM thing or consider getting rid of it all together. If nothing else just allow Pokemon to be taught how to do the different HM techniques without taking up an entire move slot. That would be way easier to work with.

Nowadays, I keep HM salves with me at all times. I'd swap them only when battling against somebody online, but aside from that, they're always on my team, haha.

I did sometimes keep an HM Slave with my team in the past, but given 5th and 6th Gen don't need HMs required as much to get around I can pretty much get away without the HM Slave. My HM Slave of choice would be Bibarel, or pretty much any of the early Normal-type rodents.

Bibarel is arguably the best one there is. It learns so many HMs, it's unbelievable.

I loved how HMs were barely necessary in X/Y...I only needed to use HMs like...twice throughout the whole story, haha. I used HM slaves extensively in Gen IV though, I used Bibarel as my primary HM slave. It's...honestly an amazing HM slave. I mean, it gets every HM except the Flying-type ones. I thought it was so good that I used 2 Bibarels to cater for most, if not all my HMs.

Bibarel's by far my fave HM Slave, and I agree it's the best (if you don't count Mew, anyway). It can learn Cut, Surf, Strength, Waterfall, Rock Smash, Dive (Gen. V), Rock Climb (Gen. IV), and Whirlpool (HGSS). I also liked using Binacle in XY. They can learn Cut, Strength, Surf, and Rock Smash; they're not too hard to find; and they can be obtained fairly early on (pre-second gym).

Oh, I've had no idea about Binacle! Should definitely give it a go someday; it's been getting sort of bland to be using Bibarel constantly, to be honest.

I liked how the Unova games and XY hardly had any requirements of HMs, haha. BW only had one explicit use and that was at the beginning of the game, while BW2 had two and they were both after your final badge. But XY did require more uses of Surf, but I didn't mind that personally.

And Binacle? I've always wanted to use Barbaracle in-game, it's like a one-sided Cloyster that doesn't have many options and an arguably better typing. One of these days...

Lmao I use my Helioptile as my Surf slave just because of how absurd it is. But I've definitely appreciated the lack of heavy HM use in X&Y. It makes the little animations that follow kind of fun and special to look at, as opposed to tedious like prior generations.

Didn't BW2 require you to use Cut, too, just so you could get through some route? I remember teaching this move to Samurott just because of it; would've thought it to someone else, but I didn't have much other Pokémon with me at the time that could learn this HM.

Had to get rid of Rock Tomb for Strength on my beloved Krookodile in X just to get Alakazite...never again. I have a Bibarel in my PC box though, so I might make him my HM slave for after game stuff. <3

Guys, today while I was swimming I got this brilliant idea: what if, instead of teaching our pokemon annoying HM moves, we had an item in the key items pocket that would do what that HM did.

For instance: A flashlight instead of flash, a knife instead of cut, a surfboard instead surf, steroids instead of strength (Hah, just kidding), or rock climbing kit for rock climb. What do you guys think? I think it'd take a lot of annoyance out of the game, but I'm not sure, maybe it would take away some of the nostalgia and charm of the game. Thoughts, opinions, suggestions? Quote me and tell me.

SuperEspeon said:

Guys, today while I was swimming I got this brilliant idea: what if, instead of teaching our pokemon annoying HM moves, we had an item in the key items pocket that would do what that HM did.

For instance: A flashlight instead of flash, a knife instead of cut, a surfboard instead surf, steroids instead of strength (Hah, just kidding), or rock climbing kit for rock climb. What do you guys think? I think it'd take a lot of annoyance out of the game, but I'm not sure, maybe it would take away some of the nostalgia and charm of the game. Thoughts, opinions, suggestions? Quote me and tell me.

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See, this is an idea I would love to see happen but is a prime example of something that is destined to never be. I feel like I've heard it in the past though, replacing HMs with key items, and I'd be lying if I said it didn't appeal to me. I'd love to be able to forgo teaching one of my beloved Pokemon -shudder- Strength. That said, I don't know what my Azumarill would be good for in battle without Waterfall though. So it ends up being one of those "six in one, half a dozen in the other" kind of deals.

Interesting concept nonetheless though!

iirc, in the first gen. games, there was going to be a surfboard item that allowed you to travel on the water, but it was ditched for Surf. I think the idea of using items instead of moves would be so much better, namely for moves that aren't needed too often (e.g., Cut and Strength). I wouldn't need to replace one/two of my team members with an HM Slave or two, nor would I need to worry about teaching one of my main Pokemon a move that can't be forgotten (except via Move Deleter) just to get through an area.

An item for surfing would be pretty cool, yeah. I'd suggest some boat, but I'm not exactly sure how they'd fit into your backpack. Maybe they could implement those rubber kind of ones that you blow to expand (forgot what they were precisely called), and include a fold-able row?

Endless said:

An item for surfing would be pretty cool, yeah. I'd suggest some boat, but I'm not exactly sure how they'd fit into your backpack. Maybe they could implement those rubber kind of ones that you blow to expand (forgot what they were precisely called), and include a fold-able row?

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An inflatable raft?

Yeah that would be neat! But using your Pokemon to surf is like a pretty fundamental part of the game, not to mention the move itself is pretty good in a battle setting. Mainly what I want to see is a way to avoid teaching any of my Pokemon cut lol.

Fairy said:

An inflatable raft?

Yeah that would be neat! But using your Pokemon to surf is like a pretty fundamental part of the game, not to mention the move itself is pretty good in a battle setting. Mainly what I want to see is a way to avoid teaching any of my Pokemon cut lol.

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Oh, yeah, there you go. XD I agree, but if HM system were to ever get removed, though, I feel that this would be good surf replacement. Either that, or maybe they could put in some surfboard-type key item, which would allow you to do the same, exact thing.