6th Gen Beginning a new Pokémon Alpha Sapphire playthrough with a fresh team

Sweet Serenity · Jul 28, 2023

I am planning on doing another Pokémon Alpha Sapphire playthrough one day very soon. I am currently doing Pokémon SoulSilver and that is going well but slowly because I'm a lot busier at the moment. When I finish that playthrough, I'm likely to start on the Pokémon Alpha Sapphire one. However, I do want to do this playthrough when I get more time so I can fully enjoy it. Nonetheless, I have my team planned for my playthrough, and I would like your opinions on it. Normally, for all my several years of playing Pokémon, I have always used my main favorites for my playthroughs, which mostly consisted of Starmie, Serperior, Gengar, Haxorus, Gardevoir, Electivire, Machamp, and Lucario. I also always used a secondary team of other favorites, but I will only be playing with a single team now. However, I want to replay my older games using different Pokémon and build my team based on different formulas, which would result in me using Pokémon that aren't exactly my favorites. Hopefully, in the process, I can develop new favorites! For this playthrough, I will be playing my Pokémon Alpha Sapphire game and will be using a different team. For my last playthrough, my primary team consisted of Blaziken, Feraligatr, Electivire, Haxorus, Gengar, and Gardevoir. Now, I am going for something completely different. My team will consist of the following:

Spoiler:

This is also not a competitive team, but rather strictly a playthrough team for the Gen 3 remakes. What are your thoughts on this playthrough team? Should I consider Wigglytuff or Clefable?

Devalue · Jul 29, 2023

Are you hacking any of these Pokemon in? Asks because of several items and moves being locked to postgame otherwise. A list:

1. Cannot get Thunder Punch on Blaziken until the post-game Move Tutors. Maybe Brave Bird or Earthquake instead? Alternatively, sacrifice coverage for sweep potential with Power-Up Punch?

2. Stuck the Wise Glasses and Assault Vest in the Battle Resort (postgame). Could grab a Life Orb off a wild Absol with DexNav. Waits for postgame on that too, otherwise.

3. Lists Sucker Punch as a transfer-only move for Shiftry. Mentions that in case of it throwing a wrench in your plans. Goes with Feint Attack, Foul Play (egg move), or a special move otherwise.

4. Flash Cannon TM: Mirage Island. Technically possible before the Elite Four, but somewhat luck dependent.

5. Metagrossite: Must beat Steven twice for it.

On the team itself:

Ariel: Is that much Speed necessary? Sees no EVs for any ORAS trainers*. Ranks 15th on Speed without Mega Evolution. What exactly is going to outspeed it? Points to Juniper as a comparison. Assume neutral natures and no EVs for any enemy trainers. Leads to a speed tie between Juniper and base 112 Speed Pokemon. Almost makes it as fast as uninvested Serperior (base 113 Speed).

Clefable versus Wigglytuff:

Expects Clefable to be stronger too. Takes hits better and deals more damage. Considers Wigglytuff's Ghost immunity nice, given two Psychic types on the team. Handles some of the dumb stuff Ghosts do (Curse, Will-o-Wisp) better with Clefable, however.

On the flip side...when are you ever going to use Wigglytuff? Might get a few Competitive boosts here and there. How often do you fight Mightyena? Packs Intimidate. Happens to be a good matchup for Wigglytuff too. Could be nice, in a weird way, to have an underdog on your team.

One note on Pinkydoll: Might be better with split EVs between Defense and Special Defense. Tested against an even offense Abomasnow.

Full HP
Rock Tomb: 15.7-18.5%
Shock Wave: 14.4-17.1%

126/126 defenses split
Rock Tomb: 14.4-17.1%
Shock Wave: 13.5-16.1%

(Should have done 128/128 instead of 126/126, but shh.) Gains fewer hitpoints (4?) from Leftovers with the Defense split, though.

Notices no glaring team weaknesses. Covered lots of types, offensively-speaking. Should be more than capable of doing well. One thought: Chose Psyshock for all three Special Attackers. Understands wanting something for the Blisseys of the world. What if you want a special-based Psychic move, though? Given Bullet Punch on Metagross, maybe go with Psychic there? Learns it by level-up as a bonus.

*Found conflicting information on natures. Lists just IVs on one and IVs + natures on the other. Suggests really terrible natures on that other source, if true, like Timid Aggron. Also claims only 16 IVs Steven's Pokemon. Doubts the source with natures, personally. Does not delve into Battle Maison trainer either, who may have EVs.

Corveone · Jul 29, 2023

Well, at least from an in-game perspective it definitely does look like a competitive team.

I mean, optimal natures, competitive EV spreads, a Mega Metagross when not even regular Metagross is supposed to be obtainable before post-game, Speed Boost on Blaziken before mega-evolving, access to items like Assault Vest and Life Orb, and egg moves/moves that require trading from another game. There is some heavy stuff to obliterate the game there.

A Jolly Aerodactyl should be already outspeeding everything that isn't Electrode or Ninjask, even if it had 0 Speed EVs. Agree with Devalue, 252 Speed EVs probably won't make any difference for an in-game build.

Magic Guard + Life Orb Clefable sounds better than Competitive Wigglytuff relying on opponents using stat debuffs to work. Wiggly's Ghost immunity shouldn't be so necessary, even with two Psychic types you still have good counters against the few Ghosts Hoenn has: Shiftry for the Duskull/Banette lines, Clefable for Sableye, Blaziken for Froslass.

Actually not sure how good as a Ghost counter that Shiftry would do with Sucker Punch being its Dark move, considering Phoebe, the only relevant Ghost trainer I recall in the game, has access to Will-O-Wisp, Confuse Ray, and similar stuff, she probably won't go for a direct attack.

But overall, the team should be doing more than good. I highly doubt any trainer in the story mode can actually put much of a fight against a team like that.

Sweet Serenity · Sep 6, 2023

Well, I began my playthrough recently, so I guess it wouldn't hurt to finally reply to this thread. First, to Deva:

Devalue said:
Are you hacking any of these Pokemon in? Asks because of several items and moves being locked to postgame otherwise.

As always, I will be beginning my adventure with some Pokémon transferred over using Pokémon Bank. As for the items, I probably should have mentioned this, but I don't plan on beginning my adventure with these items or moves. The items, certain moves, and EV spreads are going to be the end result of my playthrough, not the beginning.

A list:

3. Lists Sucker Punch as a transfer-only move for Shiftry. Mentions that in case of it throwing a wrench in your plans. Goes with Feint Attack, Foul Play (egg move), or a special move otherwise.

Thanks for letting me know. It kind of did ruin the moveset I had planned for it. However, I began my playthrough already and I would work something out. A bred a Seedot with Beat Up for now, but I'll see what I can do later on during my playthrough.

4. Flash Cannon TM: Mirage Island. Technically possible before the Elite Four, but somewhat luck dependent.

There are definitely ways around this.

On the team itself:

Ariel: Is that much Speed necessary? Sees no EVs for any ORAS trainers*. Ranks 15th on Speed without Mega Evolution. What exactly is going to outspeed it? Points to Juniper as a comparison. Assume neutral natures and no EVs for any enemy trainers. Leads to a speed tie between Juniper and base 112 Speed Pokemon. Almost makes it as fast as uninvested Serperior (base 113 Speed).

I want to ensure that I am able to outspeed everything. I probably should have mentioned this as well, but an essential aspect of my playthrough involves the battle facilities too. I need to grind for BP to get much of the items I listed here. I'm not exactly 100% sure how it works in Pokémon Alpha Sapphire, but in Pokémon Sword and Shield, I know the Battle Tower was programmed to hard-counter your team and the Pokémon have perfect IVs, max EVs in the right stats, and helpful Natures. In case Alpha Sapphire's battle facilities are similar, I want to be prepared.

Clefable versus Wigglytuff:

Expects Clefable to be stronger too. Takes hits better and deals more damage. Considers Wigglytuff's Ghost immunity nice, given two Psychic types on the team. Handles some of the dumb stuff Ghosts do (Curse, Will-o-Wisp) better with Clefable, however.

Good point. I will definitely consider this.

On the flip side...when are you ever going to use Wigglytuff? Might get a few Competitive boosts here and there. How often do you fight Mightyena? Packs Intimidate. Happens to be a good matchup for Wigglytuff too. Could be nice, in a weird way, to have an underdog on your team.

If I do select her over Clefable, I am going to keep her on the team for the whole playthrough. Of course, she is going to begin as an Igglybuff. Team Aqua do use Mightyena with Intimidate a lot, which is another great point. This is making it even harder for me to choose. Lol However, right now, I began with Cleffa and I am substituting her with Igglybuff here and there to see what works better. Competitive actually seems to activate a lot because opposing Pokémon seem to use moves such as Growl very often. I'm not sure how this would be later on in the playthrough, however.

One note on Pinkydoll: Might be better with split EVs between Defense and Special Defense. Tested against an even offense Abomasnow.

Full HP
Rock Tomb: 15.7-18.5%
Shock Wave: 14.4-17.1%

126/126 defenses split
Rock Tomb: 14.4-17.1%
Shock Wave: 13.5-16.1%

(Should have done 128/128 instead of 126/126, but shh.) Gains fewer hitpoints (4?) from Leftovers with the Defense split, though.

It's not really too much of a difference though.

Notices no glaring team weaknesses. Covered lots of types, offensively-speaking. Should be more than capable of doing well. One thought: Chose Psyshock for all three Special Attackers. Understands wanting something for the Blisseys of the world. What if you want a special-based Psychic move, though? Given Bullet Punch on Metagross, maybe go with Psychic there? Learns it by level-up as a bonus.

Thanks for you assessment! Yes, that is a good idea. I also messed up Metagross' stats on here. I wanted to make a better physical attacker with 4 Attack EVs and a Quiet Nature.

And now to Corveone:

Corveone said:
Well, at least from an in-game perspective it definitely does look like a competitive team.

I mean, optimal natures, competitive EV spreads, a Mega Metagross when not even regular Metagross is supposed to be obtainable before post-game, Speed Boost on Blaziken before mega-evolving, access to items like Assault Vest and Life Orb, and egg moves/moves that require trading from another game. There is some heavy stuff to obliterate the game there.

That's just the way I play Pokémon. I've always been an EV trainer for a long time and I like to optimize my playthrough to my liking. I enjoy getting good moves and Abilities in whatever way I can, even if I have to transfer, trade, or breed for them. As for the items, as I told Devalue, those are for postgame.

Magic Guard + Life Orb Clefable sounds better than Competitive Wigglytuff relying on opponents using stat debuffs to work. Wiggly's Ghost immunity shouldn't be so necessary, even with two Psychic types you still have good counters against the few Ghosts Hoenn has: Shiftry for the Duskull/Banette lines, Clefable for Sableye, Blaziken for Froslass.

Great point. I will consider this.

Actually not sure how good as a Ghost counter that Shiftry would do with Sucker Punch being its Dark move, considering Phoebe, the only relevant Ghost trainer I recall in the game, has access to Will-O-Wisp, Confuse Ray, and similar stuff, she probably won't go for a direct attack.

I can't even get Sucker Punch on Shiftry anyway. In order to do that, I have to transfer a Shiftry from Generation IV. However, because I wanted to begin my adventure with a Seedot and Seedot can't learn Sucker Punch, it just makes the process more complicated and I don't have time for that these days. Thus, I just settled for Beat Up for the time being, but hopefully I can consider something different later. My aim is go for Knock Off later on in the game.

But overall, the team should be doing more than good. I highly doubt any trainer in the story mode can actually put much of a fight against a team like that.

Thanks a lot for your feedback!

Devalue · Sep 6, 2023

Sweet Serenity said:
I want to ensure that I am able to outspeed everything. I probably should have mentioned this as well, but an essential aspect of my playthrough involves the battle facilities too. I need to grind for BP to get much of the items I listed here. I'm not exactly 100% sure how it works in Pokémon Alpha Sapphire, but in Pokémon Sword and Shield, I know the Battle Tower was programmed to hard-counter your team and the Pokémon have perfect IVs, max EVs in the right stats, and helpful Natures. In case Alpha Sapphire's battle facilities are similar, I want to be prepared.

Does not know how it works precisely in ORAS either. Found a list of Battle Maison (Super Course) Pokemon on Bulbapedia [Link], however. Tricked out all the Pokemon, unsurprisingly. Confirms perfect IVs for Battle #41+ trainers (and some met in 31-40) and good natures. Generally maxed out two stats in EVs (but with some using 170 x3). Cannot confirm or deny the hard-counter.

Delved into the Speed numbers, out of curiosity. Spoilered it, in case you do not want too much information.

Spoiler:

6th Gen Beginning a new Pokémon Alpha Sapphire playthrough with a fresh team

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Sweet Serenity

Advocate of Truth

Devalue

Corveone

Sweet Serenity

Advocate of Truth

Devalue