Gay Rights Debate

[~Ozy~]

Ooh, I don't like threads like these. They're always so tense o.o...but I'll try and keep myself civil o_o



Well, that's up to be debated o.o;; Though a lot of people say that people are "born gay," I just don't believe this is true. I think people choose to be gay or straight. I don't think there's some "gay gene" that decides your gender. Then why couldn't there be a "murderer gene" or "geek gene" or "athletic gene." I think it also has a lot to do with culture and the changing times. If people were born gay, then why is it that there are suddenly a huge mass of gay people now, unlike 1000 years ago. Shouldn't there have always been this amount of gay people all throughout history?

But, this is just my opnion ^.^;; please don't lock this or ban me or anything T_T

I must respectfully disagree. I did NOT choose in any sense my bisexuality, nor did some event in my childhood shape me. I've just always thought (always being since I hit puberty, at least) that guys can be as attractive as girls, and that I could date them just as easily.

As for the actual issue of gay marriage, my beliefs are simple. Same as straight folks, let them have the legal benifits of marriage through a civil service, and if they want a chgurch service and can find a church willing to provide it, allow that as well. My personal belief is that if I were to be in a homosexual rerlationship that were tu result in marriage, then I wouldn't want to be involved with an organization that had spurned and persecuted me and those like me for the past 2,000 years. That's just me, though, if a church wants to tell me to get out, fine, if they want to marry gay couples, fine, and if a gay couple wants a church wedding, fine. That's not of concern to me. What is of concern is the denial of rights to a minority, when every other individual, regardless of race, religion, national origin, what have you (sexuality aside) can go and get married overnight to any gorram Vegas stripper they please whereas members of this minority, regardless of the committment or length of their relationship cannot even obtain the legal rights of a marriage. That is injustice, plain and simple.

 

[Kylie-chan]

Yes huh! The bible says a ton of times that a man must marry a wife. It says husbands and wifes many times in the bible. It not once says husband and husband or wife and wife. It also says that a man must not lie with a man as he does with a woman! o.o;;

I'm saying that s/he didn't say anything that supported his/her argument. XD;

 

[Hitokiri]

I'm saying that s/he didn't say anything that supported his/her argument. XD;

Oh, lol, my mistake...

And ~Ozy~, I believe the constitution does say that a marriage is between a man and woman o.o;;

 

[~Ozy~]

I never made that point. I stated that an injustice was taking place. Besides, nowhere in the entire text of the U.S. Constitution does it ever specifically state that a marriage is between a man and a woman. The Constitution sets out the laws for governance of the land and the basic rights afforded to the people (via The Bill of Rights). Later amendments too make no mention of homosexual marriage. In neither Constitution notr BoR is homosexual marriage banned. There is a law stating that the federal government cannot legalize homosexual marriage nationwide and delagates that issue to the states (Defense of Marriage Act, signed by President Clinton), however, that act itself violates the Constitution's Full Faith and Credit Clause by annuling a homosexual marriage made in one state if the couple in question moves to another.

Full Faith and Credit shall be given in each State to the public Acts, Records, and judicial Proceedings of every other State. And the Congress may by general Laws prescribe the Manner in which such Acts, Records and Proceedings shall be proved, and the Effect thereof.

Judging by this snippet of text, DoMA is unconstitutional. Furthermore, just to make sure, I went back and reviewed the complete text of the Constitution, it makes no mention of gay marriage. It runs through the procedures of the Legislative, Judicial, and Executive branches, then adresses the rights, privilages and responsibilities of the States, sets the Constitution as the foremost law of the land, Constitutional Amendments, Ratification, then goes onto the actual Amendments. If you want to review it yourself, here's a link: U.S. Constitution

Please review your facts next time, it would be appreciated.

 

[Linoone]

well, I'm Mexican, and I'm not gay, but I DO think that if gay people want to marry, then let them be, now if it's wrong or right....if there is true love between two men, then it shouldn't be stopped, if there isn't, well, they probably wouldn't marry, many governments say this is wrong, but what's wrong with love?, I mean, as long as they're not publicly having sex they should be allowed to express their feelings, even through marriage

 

[Ryoutarou]

Yes huh! The bible says a ton of times that a man must marry a wife. It says husbands and wifes many times in the bible. It not once says husband and husband or wife and wife. It also says that a man must not lie with a man as he does with a woman! o.o;;

"Man shall not lay with another man..." That's talking about sex, what if a person were to fall in love with another man? Not have sex, but just love a man in the same way a straight man would love a woman? There's nothing about that aspect of it really.

As for "being born gay" I don't believe that at all. A lot of people say that they had no choice in it, and it sometimes may be true, but it has a lot to do with the way you grow up. The people you're around, the type of things that happen where you live, but at the very core, what a person takes in and what they block out does depend on the individual. For instance, take this scenario..."A boy has lived in a small town all his life, the town is openly not supportive of gays. Yet the boy himself doesn't hate gays the way other people do." It does have a lot to do with the way a person is brought up, but it also has a lot to do with what they choose to accept as being right or wrong as opposed to a set of books.

 

[Crucificus]

The government should not be permitted to practice such prejudice as to disallow homosexual marriage. It is doing no harm to anybody.

 

[Guest123_x1]

uhuh

The government should not be permitted to practice such prejudice as to disallow homosexual marriage. It is doing no harm to anybody.

But using the media to shove homosexual beliefs down our throats by making us all think it's "oh so great" is doing harm.

 

[~Ozy~]

But that is an issue entirely irrelevant to the current discussion. Media portrayal of the gay lifestyle (if the version onscreen can remotely be called that) IS harmful, to both sides of the issue, I agree, but it has little to nothing to do with the legal and moral underpinnings of gay marriage.

 

[Crucificus]

There is a difference between allowing gay marriage and the media shoving stuff down our throats. :/

 

[Kura]

But using the media to shove homosexual beliefs down our throats by making us all think it's "oh so great" is doing harm.

That's media for you..
o_o But even if we -didn't- accept homosexuality, the media would be shoving heterosexual beliefs down our throats instead.
So bascially either way would be bad according to media perspective.

But that's they way media works. In truth, it's human nature to want to listen about the troubles around the world so our troubles don't seem as bad~ So that's what media focuses on~

So my point to you is, even if society accepted the opposite (dissaproved of homosexuality) they would instead be shoving heterosexuality down our throats, and therefore causing harm to all the homosexual people in the world~

o_o So.. media is bad either way.. it doesn't count in this discussion, really..

 

[Phantom_Bugsy]

You say people shove homosexuality down our throats...what about the shows that have men and women making out on it like ALL THE TIME? Soap operas, prime time TV, daytime TV, everything.

Regardless, the media is going to throw sexuality of some kind into things that don't need it. Might as well make it even.

And I have a girlfriend, so obviously I support gay marriage. (I know it says I'm male. But I'd prefer to be male. :D). I'm a major advocate of it actually and homophobes make me sick.

Believe for yourself. Not what some crazy contradictory book tells you, IMO.

 

[Lucifer.]

You say people shove homosexuality down our throats...what about the shows that have men and women making out on it like ALL THE TIME? Soap operas, prime time TV, daytime TV, everything.

That's because heterosexual relationships are widely-accepted, whereas homosexual relationships aren't. And to be quite honest probably never will be. If we still have people around the world who can't accept different skin colours then I don't hold out much hope on the issue of sexuality.

Anyway I don't really care either way. While I don't think there's anything "wrong" with gay marriage, I'm not going to sit here and bleat on about how I think they have the right to be wed, etc etc. Because that's not what I think. I'm not really interested in having an opinion on matters which don't (and never will) affect me. It's just pointless.

Gay marriage legalized = yay?
Gay marriage not legalized = yay?

That's basically the way it is from my POV.

 

[Allstories]

That's because heterosexual relationships are widely-accepted, whereas homosexual relationships aren't. And to be quite honest probably never will be. If we still have people around the world who can't accept different skin colours then I don't hold out much hope on the issue of sexuality.

Uhh, just because there are some people who are racist, it doesn't mean that racial equality isn't widely accepted. Even if there are people who don't accept homosexuality, I think it's very likely that society as a whole will; eventually at least. Societal norms have a tendency to differ over time more than you may think.

 

[Taemin]

hmmm... I agree, I have feeling that it'll be accepted someday, and I doubt it'll too far off... Granted it IS already banned in certain places, but something tells me it won't stay that way.... --_-- I'm not against it at all, and I dont really see why some people are.... if you dont like it, don't pay any attention to it....

 

[EmberGryphon]

Whee! One of my favorite topics of debate! (I came in a little late, though. D:)

Okay, first off: in the Bible, it does say that homosexual liasons are sinful. (It also says eating crayfish is sinful, but I'll stop there.) However, running a country based off a religion- especially from the perspective of the US (which is where I'm from), which has no national religious affiliation, a legal differentiation between religious and legal affairs, and has such a broad range of cultures and religions that forcing the entire nation to respect the morals of ONE of them is almost insane. I don't think churches and priests who don't believe in gay marriage should be forced to preform it- and, happily, they can't be forced by the government to do anything, because of the Constitutional seperation of church and state. Civil Unions look like a good idea in the same way that black compartments of trains seemed like a good idea in the '50's- but if Seperate but Equal failed miserably once, I'm reluctant to support the US trying it again. The legal benefits of marriage (as well as the emotional and symbolic benefits that are usually why two people get married) shouldn't be limited to only the majority of citizens. And as long as no church or religion is forced to preform the ceremony, I don't really see the problem. ^^ Aside from some people thinking it's icky.

 

[Loveless_Strawberry]

i think it is all fine but i'm gay so i think it does lol

 

[9mm]

I support Gay rights, as a lesbian, I want the right to marry another woman if I choose

 

[Drummershuff]

Meh, I think its fine. I'm not gay, But everyone is different so I suppose that its fine. Doesn't do anyone else any harm.

 

[Greed]

As you all know I believe gay marriage should be allowed. Whether you like it or not.

People who are religious zealots piss me off. And I mean -a lot-.

They're being hypocritical. Love isn't about being different genders, its about the frigging feelings.

I don't have a girlfriend or anything because technically, I hate relationships with a passion.

Unfortunately, Mexico does have quite an homophobic upbringing. At least where I come from. People are encouraged to get married at a young age, and are also quite cruel to homosexuals.

But meh, I'm gay so I might just be speaking out because I'm biased and all.