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Could you please make a version of your patch that includes just the new features and not Throwback?
Also, what do you mean by "tweaking starters"? Will it still be Lv. 5 Bulbasaur/Charmander/Squirtle?
Well I probably could. I just need to work on this a little more. I could give you a basic idea of what I want to do.
Fire Red: Updated tiles, I am thinking maybe Johto style. I have seen some really good ones
New Starters: Maybe Gen VI
Potential Fairy Type
P/S/S Obviously
Regional Seasons
Updated B/W Repel system
Updated Sprites
Nuzlocke Mode
Gen 6 Capture EXP System
Infinite TMs
Updated learn set, moves, type chart
New Moves
Decapitalization
Updated cries
Etc, Etc, Etc...
I literally just starting hacking a few days ago, I have played with some/most of the programs needed in the past but I am going to take a few months to get all my tools and skills polished before I release anything. But I will send you my rom base with the P/S/S implemented as a base for you.
For those wanting to add the Physical/Special Split, just check out DoesntKnowHowToPlay's patch. It should work for any FireRed hack out there. I believe it's also doable enough to port it to LeafGreen through comparing similar stretches of data.
Now I feel dumb for even bringing up those ideas. Sorry.
...May I ask what did you use to edit the title screen for FireRed's "Catch 'Em All" patch? And is it possible to edit the LeafGreen title screen at this time?
My apologies if I sounded a bit harsh. I didn't get any sleep last night, so I'm a bit more on edge than I have any right to be.
I used a few tools to edit the FireRed title screen. One of them was Adobe Photoshop, which is payware. Other tools I used were unLZ, APE, and NTME. In order to have both Venusaur and Charizard on screen at the same time, I put them in the same sprite that Charizard alone used to occupy. I also had to remove a color from each sprite and merge slightly similar ones to fit the differing colors in the two sprites into one palette line. Finally, I shifted the orientation of various elements of the title screen and changed a few more colors to give a more neutral appearance as opposed to the fire and red themes of the old title screen.
I could edit the LeafGreen screen, too, but I chose not to because I didn't get around to porting the Catch 'em All patch to it. I still could sometime, though. I could get it looking mostly similar to how it is in the FireRed version of Throwback, but the background animation will be different.
Also, there's no way I know of to properly make the title screen play more than one Pokémon's cry upon pressing Start, FYI. Ideally pressing Start would play Venusaur's cry in the left speaker and Charizard's cry in the right speaker.
Well I probably could. I just need to work on this a little more. I could give you a basic idea of what I want to do.
Fire Red: Updated tiles, I am thinking maybe Johto style. I have seen some really good ones
New Starters: Maybe Gen VI
Potential Fairy Type
P/S/S Obviously
Regional Seasons
Updated B/W Repel system
Updated Sprites
Nuzlocke Mode
Gen 6 Capture EXP System
Infinite TMs
Updated learn set, moves, type chart
New Moves
Decapitalization
Updated cries
Etc, Etc, Etc...
I literally just starting hacking a few days ago, I have played with some/most of the programs needed in the past but I am going to take a few months to get all my tools and skills polished before I release anything. But I will send you my rom base with the P/S/S implemented as a base for you.
It sounds like you're getting serious with the editing you'll be doing to my hack. I hope you're able to accomplish all that you're looking to do with it! Just make sure to give proper credit if you release it to the public.
I hope you're also keeping in mind the things you listed that are already in Throwback.
It sounds like you're getting serious with the editing you'll be doing to my hack. I hope you're able to accomplish all that you're looking to do with it! Just make sure to give proper credit if you release it to the public.
I hope you're also keeping in mind the things you listed that are already in Throwback.
I know of a canon way Eevee can evolve into Espeon or Umbreon without a time system, therefore allowing it to evolve in FireRed when played on an actual Game Boy Advance and LeafGreen.
In Pokémon XD: Gale of Darkness, there are key items called the Sun Shard and the Moon Shard, which evolve Eevee into Espeon and Umbreon, respectively, if leveled up in the bag. This is because, like FireRed and LeafGreen, they had no time system. You could use this method. I was thinking you could obtain them from Oak after you get the National Dex.
The only problem is that in XD, they are Key Items and you could only obtain one of them. This poses a problem because if you theoretically had both the Sun Shard and the Moon Shard, the game wouldn't know what to evolve Eevee into when it leveled up. My solution is that instead of them automatically evolving Eevee upon level up, they should still be Key Items and infinitely reusable, but act like evolutionary stones and be usable on Eevee.
I hope this is a good idea, unlike what I came up with before.
I know of a canon way Eevee can evolve into Espeon or Umbreon without a time system, therefore allowing it to evolve in FireRed when played on an actual Game Boy Advance and LeafGreen.
In Pokémon XD: Gale of Darkness, there are key items called the Sun Shard and the Moon Shard, which evolve Eevee into Espeon and Umbreon, respectively, if leveled up in the bag. This is because, like FireRed and LeafGreen, they had no time system. You could use this method. I was thinking you could obtain them from Oak after you get the National Dex.
The only problem is that in XD, they are Key Items and you could only obtain one of them. This poses a problem because if you theoretically had both the Sun Shard and the Moon Shard, the game wouldn't know what to evolve Eevee into when it leveled up. My solution is that instead of them automatically evolving Eevee upon level up, they should still be Key Items and infinitely reusable, but act like evolutionary stones and be usable on Eevee.
I hope this is a good idea, unlike what I came up with before.
Don't put yourself down because of your previous suggestions. They were actually fine! It's just that there are certain things I intend to keep consistent to the 3rd Gen games in Throwback.
As for the Eevee idea, it's an entirely plausible one for me to implement. I'd just need to plan out how the player would obtain the two of them. I'm not sure if it's something I will do, though. My ideal solution to the problem would be to port the time system from R/S/E to Throwback. I don't know if anyone has ever wanted that, strangely enough.
Erm, wait a minute, about the flutes. I'm pretty sure Blue Flute isn't exactly redundant.
Poke Flute exists, but it wakes up both you and the enemy when used doesn't it? Blue Flute works like an infinite Awakening. It would make for a good postgame item because of that, just an improved Poke Flute.
Erm, wait a minute, about the flutes. I'm pretty sure Blue Flute isn't exactly redundant.
Poke Flute exists, but it wakes up both you and the enemy when used doesn't it? Blue Flute works like an infinite Awakening. It would make for a good postgame item because of that, just an improved Poke Flute.
Well, I finally beat the Elite Four! It was a bit of a pain to grind, though... Nuzlocke makes things much more difficult than normal. I don't suppose you'd be willing to make the VS Seeker raise the rematch levels of a few trainers before the post-game? It's hardly necessary, but it feels weird to have the option of fighting trainers be worse for power leveling than the Victory Road wilds...
At this point, I've finished the events at Four Island, and looked at a couple of your custom events along the way...
Spoiler:
The way the rival gives you his starter is pretty much perfect! It fits his personality quite nicely, and even has precedent with the Fame Checker being a gift from him as well. He is the kind to see duplicate Pokemon as pointless to keep, after all.
The other starter, though... I like what you're going for here, but I did have some problems with it. First, while the "south-west" clue is helpful, it still leaves a considerable portion of the region to look though (especially since the girl actually says "South, or West, or...", making it even more vague). Combined with how well he's hidden, I ended up searching half the region or so before giving up and looking at the Event Guide. Second, the dialogue with both the grunt and the girl seems off. Most notably, she's using much bigger words than I'd expect from someone her age, and the grunt talks about "Blasting off" despite that phrase never appearing in the Kanto games outside of Yellow. The way he left did amuse me, but the whole interaction just seems odd.
Oh yes, I also noticed that Lance says you are a "Pokemon master." I think master ought to be capitalized there, if only because of how important the phrase is to Pokemon as a whole (and I'm pretty sure it's been shown capitalized somewhere else in the series, but I'm not sure where). That, and it sounded to me like the victory music after the Champion battle worked just fine. I had the music somewhat quiet at the time, so I'm not completely certain about that, but it shouldn't be too hard to check and update the OP, right?
With all that said, I'm inclined to think that Throwback is probably my favorite game in the series now. You've gone above and beyond what your mission statement for this project entailed, delivering an experience that rivals the official games (and flat-out beats some of them). There's not much that can be done to improve this further, at least not without making it a completely new game. At this point, it's mostly just about polishing what's there, and maybe working on that patching tool. Actually, this is making me itch for an Emerald equivalent of some kind. Obviously not the "Throwback" part, but if something similar to your "Catch 'em All" and Extras patches could exist for Hoenn...
Well, I finally beat the Elite Four! It was a bit of a pain to grind, though... Nuzlocke makes things much more difficult than normal. I don't suppose you'd be willing to make the VS Seeker raise the rematch levels of a few trainers before the post-game? It's hardly necessary, but it feels weird to have the option of fighting trainers be worse for power leveling than the Victory Road wilds...
At this point, I've finished the events at Four Island, and looked at a couple of your custom events along the way...
Spoiler:
The way the rival gives you his starter is pretty much perfect! It fits his personality quite nicely, and even has precedent with the Fame Checker being a gift from him as well. He is the kind to see duplicate Pokemon as pointless to keep, after all.
The other starter, though... I like what you're going for here, but I did have some problems with it. First, while the "south-west" clue is helpful, it still leaves a considerable portion of the region to look though (especially since the girl actually says "South, or West, or...", making it even more vague). Combined with how well he's hidden, I ended up searching half the region or so before giving up and looking at the Event Guide. Second, the dialogue with both the grunt and the girl seems off. Most notably, she's using much bigger words than I'd expect from someone her age, and the grunt talks about "Blasting off" despite that phrase never appearing in the Kanto games outside of Yellow. The way he left did amuse me, but the whole interaction just seems odd.
Oh yes, I also noticed that Lance says you are a "Pokemon master." I think master ought to be capitalized there, if only because of how important the phrase is to Pokemon as a whole (and I'm pretty sure it's been shown capitalized somewhere else in the series, but I'm not sure where). That, and it sounded to me like the victory music after the Champion battle worked just fine. I had the music somewhat quiet at the time, so I'm not completely certain about that, but it shouldn't be too hard to check and update the OP, right?
With all that said, I'm inclined to think that Throwback is probably my favorite game in the series now. You've gone above and beyond what your mission statement for this project entailed, delivering an experience that rivals the official games (and flat-out beats some of them). There's not much that can be done to improve this further, at least not without making it a completely new game. At this point, it's mostly just about polishing what's there, and maybe working on that patching tool. Actually, this is making me itch for an Emerald equivalent of some kind. Obviously not the "Throwback" part, but if something similar to your "Catch 'em All" and Extras patches could exist for Hoenn...
I never really looked that hard at the VS Seeker's function. I might check it sometime. I don't feel too inclined to change much about rematches right now, though.
Spoiler:
Thanks for checking out the Pokémon events! I could have sworn that there was at least one instance of the phrase "Blasting off" being used in the official games that aren't tied to the anime. If that's not the case, I can always change that. As for the girl's dialogue, I don't think it's that complex. Mostly every person in Pokémon games speak rather fluently, regardless of age. It's only when it is used as a character trait that it becomes apparently different. Also, I personally find all of the extended events that I added to be kind of off-putting compared to the rest of the game. The 1st Gen games don't have that many involved events to begin with, so it makes those kinds of things feel out of place.
I'll likely be overhauling elements of every event as I rebuild these patches from the ground up. My goal with that will be to make the events as natural-feeling as possible. If they feel added in and not a part of the natural game, it'll get changed.
The word "master" isn't capitalized in the base game, either. Capitalizing it would imply that "Pokémon Master" is an official qualification, whereas it's actually just an informal descriptor that someone might want to use with someone else. The music issue is that if you beat the Pokémon Champion with the 8-bit music playing, the victory music restarts after you exit battle rather than continue to play nonstop. That doesn't occur with the FR/LG music.
I don't know if I have it in me to do a similar patch for Emerald. There are a few things I might do:
Music: Replace the music with the tracks from Omega Ruby/Alpha Sapphire, if at all possible (maybe 3DS hacking will become a thing a year or so from now). I think it's fair to say that the tracks in those games are superior to the originals and remain entirely faithful to the original compositions. Catch 'em All: Make all Pokémon in the Hoenn Dex obtainable and keep all available creatures not in it in the game. I have no idea what I'd change the title screen to. Any "complete/fix" Pokémon hack that I'd do would have to nix the notion of versions altogether. The Eon Ticket, AuroraTicket, MysticTicket, and Old Sea Map would be made obtainable. I'll probably set up something similar for Jirachi as I have done for Celebi, but certain things in Emerald might make an in-game event more plausible. Wardrobe: Change Brendan and May back into their outfits from Ruby and Sapphire. Extras: A similarly-styled suite of options to what's available in Throwback. If possible, I might alter some handlings of the Battle Frontier to make it more fair. Decapitalization and higher quality cry patches would also be a thing for it.
Personally, if I do hack another game to do something similar, it'll likely be a different franchise altogether. The whole reason I've been a part of this community is to try and make the best version possible of one of my childhood favorites. I don't think I'll ever have the skill to do any of the things I want to do, but you never know!
And thank you so much for those kind words. They're incredibly humbling to me. :happy:
********************************
I'll spoiler my game editing thoughts because of them not really being related to Throwback or Pokémon in general. People may see it as some sort of personal soapbox or outlet, but whatever. I won't be able to work on any hacking again until mid-May, and I feel alright sharing this here.
Spoiler:
I've worked on a few personal mini-hacks to make some things more palatable for my gaming, like making Link's hair orange in The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past. I've only ever contributed to one other publicly-released hack: Sonic 3 Complete. I made the base graphical changes to player characters to fix them or porting sprites from other games. I actually started my part as a personal project: port Sonic's sprites from Sonic 2 into Sonic 3. I guess you could say I was the one responsible for sidetracking the project and implementing things that didn't need to be in the game in the first place. Unless you're Jeff Gerstmann. {XD}
Tiddles, if you're reading this, I hope everything's doing fine for you!
At this point, I've made my stance on hacking/modding clear: I'm interested in improving the experiences made by the developers. I lack the creativity (and skill, in non-Pokémon cases) to make big-time hacks that create entirely new experiences, but I admire those who do dedicate many hours to making them. I've tried out some hacks here, but I can't personally say that I'm really into them. The many changes made to them and the passion put into them is evident, and it really makes you appreciate what these hackers are doing as hobbies. It's just not really for me.
What would I be interested in doing, then? Well, it'd involve crazy hacking/modding skills that I don't really have, nor will I potentially ever have. I have friends that know computing, but I don't know how much that would help. But I digress, here are my dream projects that I've made for myself:
Make stand-alone versions of the All-Stars versions of Super Mario Bros. 2 and 3. Use the All-Star graphics with options to choose between original and All-Star soundbanks for music and sound effects. Implement extra features from the Super Mario Advance games, including the e-Reader features for SMB3.
Do something similar for the classic Ninja Gaiden trilogy. Also, make the respawn points for enemies in the first two games not absurd.
Port the SNES levels of Wolfenstein 3D into whatever the most-commonly used loader for the game is. I'm not sure if anyone has actually bothered to do that.
Fix the PC ports of older games that would otherwise be the most superior versions out there. Metal Gear Solid comes to mind.
Remove increased fake difficulty in the international versions of games from the early '90s to keep games fair. The Adventures of Bayou Billy, I'm looking at you. Or, in the case of a game like Battletoads, implement the decreased difficulty to make the game sane as well as fix game-breaking issues.
Make a truly definitive version of Street Fighter II. Choose between all possible character builds like with Ultra. Select music from any version of the game (CPS1, CPS2, FM Towns, SNES, SNES Super, Genesis Super, HD Remix, etc.). Include graphics options for all versions of the games, HD Remix included. Fix a few presentation elements that won't affect gameplay. Ultra does a lot of these things, but there's more that it could have done.
Yeah, the games for my dream game projects don't really have consistency to them. What can I say? I really enjoy the medium and want each part of it to shine as much as possible!
As I said, VS Seeker is pretty low priority since it mostly is fine. It's just a tad weird towards the end of the main game.
Spoiler:
Nope, I'm pretty sure it's only in Yellow, and I think it's only Jessie and James at that. Again, the "fake-out" nature of your event amused me, but I know you like to keep things canonically accurate. I'm not much of a writer, so I'm not really one to critique that aspect of the hack, but the speech for both of them (especially the girl) still seems a bit stilted to me... I don't know. Maybe I need to get my mother to play it, since she's the editor of the family? ^_-
Yeah, now that you mention it, Kanto didn't ever have that many events that happened across multiple areas. Sevii did, but even those are technically story events, whereas these are technically optional. Again, I'm not sure what the best way to go about changing them is, but they're still functional as is.
That's true. I had forgotten about that, but it makes sense now. It's been too long since I beat Lance in any version... Right, the 8-Bit music. I don't use that much, mainly because I don't feel any extra dose of nostalgia from it (since the first games I owned were Emerald and FireRed). I guess that would at least be good to clarify in the OP, if you haven't already.
All those ideas sound pretty good, for the most part (though I would want the outfit change to be optional, myself). Really, Emerald itself is already fairly neutral as versions go, so I don't think you would need to worry about that. To be honest, the main things I'd want would be the ability to complete the Hoenn Dex in one game (and National would be handled by trading with Throwback), and infinite TMs. Everything else is just a nice bonus, really. I think you sell yourself short, though -- even with its flaws, this is definitely the best hack I've ever seen!
You're welcome! I expect I'll probably be playing this hack many more times in the future, but right now I'm focusing on the post-game content. Speaking of, I just gave Celio the Sapphire. I should be good to find all the Legendaries and complete the Kanto Dex, right?
Really? So I guess I shouldn't expect any updates to Throwback for a while, then. Really, that kind of a "mission statement" is plenty good! Better than overextending and making a game that doesn't match your vision, right?
All those ideas sound pretty good, for the most part (though I would want the outfit change to be optional, myself). Really, Emerald itself is already fairly neutral as versions go, so I don't think you would need to worry about that. To be honest, the main things I'd want would be the ability to complete the Hoenn Dex in one game (and National would be handled by trading with Throwback), and infinite TMs. Everything else is just a nice bonus, really. I think you sell yourself short, though -- even with its flaws, this is definitely the best hack I've ever seen!
You're welcome! I expect I'll probably be playing this hack many more times in the future, but right now I'm focusing on the post-game content. Speaking of, I just gave Celio the Sapphire. I should be good to find all the Legendaries and complete the Kanto Dex, right?
Really? So I guess I shouldn't expect any updates to Throwback for a while, then. Really, that kind of a "mission statement" is plenty good! Better than overextending and making a game that doesn't match your vision, right?
As with Throwback, my idea would be that each part of my theoretical Emerald hack would be optional. So, if you wanted, you could keep the altered outfits in that game.
So long as you keep in mind the process you need to go through to get Celebi, you should be able to complete the Kanto Dex and obtain all Johto Pokémon.
Yeah, no updates for now. There are more pressing matters I have to attend to right now. I'll still respond to any questions or messages people have for me, but I won't have much to show in the immediate future. I hope it's not too incredibly long of a break, though!
You can peruse the script for the event and change which Pokémon the lady gives you simply enough, as well as what Pokémon the text refers to. Note that the provided save file is loaded with Celebi, including tons in the PC along with a shiny Celebi. It looks as if the save file has been altered somehow, as I no longer see any Celebi in storage. I'll need to fix that.
Once you change what Pokémon the lady gives you, load up on however many of it you think you need for distributing (probably one, but you never know) and release the Celebi. Then save your game. Use this new save for your distribution event, not the Celebi one.
It sounds like you're making nice progress (or at least have neat plans) with your upcoming hack. I hope it turns out great! :)
Having said that, I feel the need to bring this point up to anyone reading this thread. I'm plenty happy with people using Throwback as a base for their projects and derivative works given that all proper credit is given. However, people will need to keep in mind that this thread is about Pokémon Throwback. It is not the proper place to promote your own works, even if they use parts of Throwback. If they're finished, feel free to start a new thread dedicated to them. If not, please find a better avenue to discuss them.
Note that I'll still be willing to answer any questions people have about using my hack for their own purposes.
How can I implement your FireRed real-time clock/Espeon/Umbreon without the whole "Catch 'Em All" patch? I tried editing the hexes manually according to the documentation, but that just rendered the game unplayable. (It didn't go past the "Game Freak Presents" screen.)
How can I implement your FireRed real-time clock/Espeon/Umbreon without the whole "Catch 'Em All" patch? I tried editing the hexes manually according to the documentation, but that just rendered the game unplayable. (It didn't go past the "Game Freak Presents" screen.)
The RTC method I used for my hack is the one by ZodiacDaGreat and modified by Shiny Quagsire. It's available on GitHub. Modify the location to place the RTC data as needed., then assemble it, insert it into your ROM, and make the change noted at the top of the ASM file.
The Espeon and Umbreon code is found in the DNS thread. Jambo51 created the routines.
The RTC method I used for my hack is the one by ZodiacDaGreat and modified by Shiny Quagsire. It's available on GitHub. Modify the location to place the RTC data as needed., then assemble it, insert it into your ROM, and make the change noted at the top of the ASM file.
The Espeon and Umbreon code is found in the DNS thread. Jambo51 created the routines.
Insert the RTC wherever is best convenient for your hack based on where anything else you inserted is. Look up HackMew's thread on compiling ASM routines, he made a thumb.bat file for that.
So as to keep this thread on topic, make sure to refrain from questions that don't directly pertain to my hack in some way. If you have any more questions about general hacking, please PM them to me or find the appropriate threads for them. Thanks!
