Pokemon Discussion (Current Subject: Aerodactyl)

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Anti-Pop said:
Medicham outsweeps Gallade every day of the week.

BTW I was referring to the Scarf sets of both.
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Actually your argument makes no sense. Maybe you stay in every friday and saturday night playing pokemon the whole time so you know more than me, but look at your argument. First off, Gallade has elemental punches, second so what if medichams attack is a little higher that doesn't necessarily make it a worse sweeper. Heracross has a base 120 attack while Rampardos has 165 does that make it a better sweeper. Then, look at what you said. First you were telling me how dumb it was to look at Choice Band Garchomp (which you're wrong about it is very wide spread) and telling me about how Swords Dance is by far the way you go, then when I bring up Swords Dance for Gallade, who is no different as a sweeper and suddenly you're telling me about how much better a choice item is. make up your mind, you're contradicting yourself.
 
flamehaze94 said:
For one, even though Medicham has 480 base attack compared to Gallade's 383 base attack stat, Gallade Close Combat actually outdamages a Medicham's Brick Break, thus meaning that Medicham has to run Hi Jump Kick unless he wants to lose in the power department. Hi Jump kick has 100 base power and 90 base accuracy. Do you know how reliable that is? If you miss Hi Jump Kick, hit something resistant to fighting, or go against a ghost, Medicham will downright slaughter itself with the recoil damage, coming off 720 attack (including CB). The other moves commonly seen on the generic Choice Bander are as follows: the Elemental Punches and Psycho Cut/Double-Edge. The Elemental Punches are staples, since it's the only thing thing Medicham really gained that was notworthy besides Psycho Cut, but Gallade can also access the Elemental Punches by Emerald move tutor and also get Psycho Cut. Double-Edge is the only notable option to beat Cresselia, but Medicham must have Choice Band Adamant and max attack to actually put a dent to Cresselia, but the thing that put's it off is that it's illegal with Psycho Cut, which is a D/P breeding move, now you've just lost your most valuable weapon against Dusknoir. Another point is that Medicham is really only good as a Choice user, meaning that it's very predictable, and the shear suprise factor as Gallade as a sweeper seems to pressure and catch many people off guard. Gallade, not only can function as a generic CBer, it can fill niches in your team with status, Swords Dance sweeper, Bulk Up, Wish, etc, thus adding to it's unpredictability.

Now let's look at base stats: Medicham has 60 base HP, 60 base attack (with Pure Power), 75 base defense, 80 base speed, 60 special attack, and base 75 base special defense. And then Gallade's: 68 base HP, 125 base attack, 65 base defense, 80 base speed, 115 base special defense. Medicham is far more fragile than Gallade; a true glass cannon, and because of Gallade's useable HP and high SpDef, it can actually switch into stuff like Modest SpecsLuke Aura Sphere or something near those lines and threaten to counter them. Close Combat off Gallade is of par with that of Heracross's, meaning CC 2HKOs both Forretress and Skarmory. Not only does it get a nice weapon named Night Slash to effectively deal with both Dusknoir and Cress, but it also gets the same things Medicham gets. And unlike Heracross, it gets Ice Punch to kill Gliscor.
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pretty much sums it up.

you shouldn't be giving medicham cb unless you're desperate.

and back on topic: i've sweeped several teams with gardevoir actually XD

this is what i use:

Gardevoir @ Leftovers/Lum Berry
Calm Nature
Ability: Trace
252 HP/72 SP ATK/60 DEF/124 SP DEF
-Psychic
-Thunderbolt
-Trick Rom
-Will-o-Wisp

use it as a starter -- always sets trick room first unless it's vital to use another move. i've burned so many garchomp and weavile, it gets kinda old. you can pretty much use that ev set for all kinds of sets, which is why i went with it. trick room and wow were just options because they were much easier to get, but now they ended up being what makes gardevoir so useful. all those gengars who think they can switch in and perceive themselves as a threat-- not anymore! trick room is way more safer than twave.

only downside of this set is blissey. good think i have kecleon (yes, kecleon) for her.
 
Romo_Owens said:
Actually your argument makes no sense. Maybe you stay in every friday and saturday night playing pokemon the whole time so you know more than me, but look at your argument. First off, Gallade has elemental punches, second so what if medichams attack is a little higher that doesn't necessarily make it a worse sweeper. Heracross has a base 120 attack while Rampardos has 165 does that make it a better sweeper. Then, look at what you said. First you were telling me how dumb it was to look at Choice Band Garchomp (which you're wrong about it is very wide spread) and telling me about how Swords Dance is by far the way you go, then when I bring up Swords Dance for Gallade, who is no different as a sweeper and suddenly you're telling me about how much better a choice item is. make up your mind, you're contradicting yourself.
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One, so what if he said Choice Band is bad for Garchomp. That's a completely different Pokemon. So, I'd rather you not bring that up. Two, stop being insulting. You have very little to no credibility to even have the right to act that way towards other people.
 
Romo_Owens said:
Actually your argument makes no sense. Maybe you stay in every friday and saturday night playing pokemon the whole time so you know more than me, but look at your argument. First off, Gallade has elemental punches,

So does Medicham.

second so what if medichams attack is a little higher that doesn't necessarily make it a worse sweeper. Heracross has a base 120 attack while Rampardos has 165 does that make it a better sweeper.

That comparison has no relevance to Gallade and Medicham. And that difference in attack can actually decide if you KO something or not without a Choice Band boost.

Then, look at what you said. First you were telling me how dumb it was to look at Choice Band Garchomp (which you're wrong about it is very wide spread) and telling me about how Swords Dance is by far the way you go,

It is, I HAVE used both.

then when I bring up Swords Dance for Gallade, who is no different as a sweeper and suddenly you're telling me about how much better a choice item is. make up your mind, you're contradicting yourself.

No, Gallade is horribly slow while Garchomp has decent speed. Such annoying accusations :/
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I actually agree with flamehaze on the Choice Band argument.

As for Gardevoir, I remember in ADV when I was up against a CM Gardy and I has my CM passing Celebi. That Gardy set was weird though, and it used Toxic. Then we both started CMing up a lot until I had one more turn to CM up and the next toxic would kill me. I took a risk and did, and totally forgot Gardevoir can actually attack stuff, and it just murdered me with Fire Punch.

Uh oh!

My physical sweeper at that point was gone, so I stupidly sent out my CM Raikou. I tried to CM and beat it, but it eventually killed me. Skarmory had a similar fate when I tried to PHaze it :( It pretty much swept the rest of my team. I made so many stupid plays and yuck, I got swept by a Gardevoir.

^BTW the details are a little shaky as my memory of that is a little blurry.
 
Blueberry said:
New subject yo:

LUCARIO!
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Did you get this from the thread I made an hour or so ago? Can you at least post the set I made? I still need help on that.
 
sims796 said:
Damn you, Brawl! got me in the mood to play Lucario! I blame the society, and hippies from the 60's.

Spoiler:


Well, I like the mixed variant best, so I'll use that.

Lucario@???--Choice Scarf? I dunno
Nature:Naive/Naughty
Aura Sphere
Stone Edge
Blaze Kick/Extremespeed/Psychic----just kidding
Dragon Pulse
EV:???

I like Blaze Kick, but Extremespeed has priority. I think I noticed that most sweepers weak to fighting also has low[er] SP.DEF. Besides, since this was inspired by that bastard Brawl, I'll run Aura Sphere.

Now, some people may say Band is better. I don't care. I asked for mixed, so above all else, give me mixed.

Now, of course, feel free to give me Band, Scarf, whatever. But give me what I asked for first. Also, refrain from using "lol" as much as possible. That's litterally insulting a person's intellegence when you do that. Stupid is also insulting, to a point.

If you don't, your no better than those hippies from the 6ties.
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Yes, I got the idea from you. I decided to use a Pokemon a lot of people would use and thus, more discussion would occur.
 
Blueberry said:
Yes, I got the idea from you. I decided to use a Pokemon a lot of people would use and thus, more discussion would occur.
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Thank you. This makes more sense than just one asking for one poke set.
 
Okay so Dark_Azelf is going to come in here and post SD Lucario so let's let him because he does it with style. seriously.

Actually I have a funny experience fighting a Lucario. It was a Raikou rip-off (only no sandstorm weak, more resistances...oh no) with Calm Mind and it murdered me. It was awful :( Actually that's where I got my inspiration for APvire (no I'm not telling!)

Also SpecsLuke is just cool. Still ghost/Blissey beat it every time :(
 
A Lucario I used that worked amazingly for me was the following:

Lucario @ Focus Sash
Inner Focus
EVs: 92 HP / 252 SAtk / 164 Spd
Modest Nature
- Aura Sphere
- Shadow Ball
- Vacuum Wave
- Hidden Power Ice

Keep in mind this guy is almost always the recepiant of one or two Nasty Plots and an Agility from a Baton Pass(the Focus Sash allows him to take what would normally be a fatal attack upon switching in). Otherwise, attach a Choice Scarf/Choice Specs to him to maximize his Special Sweeping prowess.

-Aura Sphere is the generic, never misses special attack move with the Fighting STAB bonus. 90 Damage + x2 Nasty Plots kills virtually anything that doesn't resist it.

-Shadow Ball is rape to any incoming Ghosts hoping to negate the fighting moves, and kills Psychics with ease. Cresselia, Gengar, and Uxie are all dead to this. Once again, x2 or 1 Nasty Plot is enough.

-Vacuum Wave is there for priority, as it will outspeed any other priority attacker preventing them from killing Lucario off (with an Agility, mind you). Even without the Nasty Plot boost, it takes care of Weavile in one hit.

- Lastly, HP Ice is for Dragons or Flying types that think they can come in and absorb Lucario's attacks. After even just one Nasty Plot, this kills everything weak to it.

Basically, this thing is unstoppable once the Batons are Passed.

I personally use a defensive Ambipom to do my bidding. Baton Pass, Agility, Nasty Plot, Fake Out. Easy as pie.
 
Lucario@Life Orb/Leftovers
Modest Nature
EVs: 170 HP, 156 SpAtk, 184 Spd
-Calm Mind
-Aura Sphere
-Shadow Ball/Dark Pulse
-Roar

My all new revised CMCario. Roar with his speed, outspeeds the other roars so he doesn't get PHazed. Aura Sphere hits everything except the Ghosts and Psychics, but they are taken care of with Shadow Ball/Dark Pulse
 
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Angelic Diablo said:
Lucario@Life Orb/Leftovers
Mild/Rash Nature
EVs: 170 HP, 44 Atk, 112 SpAtk, 184 Spd
-Calm Mind
-Aura Sphere
-Shadow Ball
-Focus Punch

CMCario, Focus Punch helps with the predicted Special Wall switch ins (especially Blissey). Works best with Wish support as Lucario has no means of recovery barring rest.
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Well, with Aura Sphere, doesn't it do almost the same after 1 Calm Mind as Focus Punch does with the given EV investment?
 
Ooka said:
Well, with Aura Sphere, doesn't it do almost the same after 1 Calm Mind as Focus Punch does with the given EV investment?
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You know I've never really though about that, maybe its time to hit up the old damage calculator and see if I can make him pure special

EDIT: And here is what Lucario can do to a Blissey that is run with 252 HP, 252 Def

Aura Sphere after 1 CM
Damage: 403 - 475
Damage: 56.44% - 66.53%

Focus Punch
Damage: 944 - 1110
Damage: 132.21% - 155.46%

Hmm so a 2HKO with Aura Sphere, hmm maybe something else for the last slot and a change of EVs in order....
 
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I've been messing with an agility sweeper Lucario mainly because it's speed is rather poor compared to other pokemon.

Ability: Steadfast (or whatever the speed increase when flinching one is)
Nature: Adamant / Modest
Item: Life Orb / Focus Sash
HP: 4 ATK/SP ATK: 252 SPD: 252
Physical Moveset
Close Combat
Crunch
Stone Edge (could also be substituted for EQ since it's just an awesome move)
Agility

Special Moveset
Aura Sphere
Dragon Pulse (unless you can get HP Ice)
Dark Pulse (I guess this could be substituted for Shadow Ball if you'd rather the chance of lowering Sp Def)
Agility

Same EV spread as most fast(ish) sweepers. They work okay for me but are rather overshadowed by the offensive stat boost sets and choice banders/specs.

I guess a reversal set could work for him, since he has resistance to sandstorm. I've never tried a reversal set (for any pokemon actually) so I'm not sure how well it'd work with Lucario.
 
Anti-Pop said:
Okay so Dark_Azelf is going to come in here and post SD Lucario so let's let him because he does it with style. seriously.

Actually I have a funny experience fighting a Lucario. It was a Raikou rip-off (only no sandstorm weak, more resistances...oh no) with Calm Mind and it murdered me. It was awful :( Actually that's where I got my inspiration for APvire (no I'm not telling!)

Also SpecsLuke is just cool. Still ghost/Blissey beat it every time :(
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hehe

Lucario is such a beast, at first it seemed like a "Noob magnet" (Due to the pokemon movie lol) but after using it, it is insanely powerful.

Lucario@Life Orb
252 ATT / 252 SPEED / 6 HP
Adamant Nature
Trait : Stead Fast
~ Close Combat
~ Extremespeed / Bullet Punch
~ Swords Dance
~ Crunch / Bullet Punch / Stone Edge

This is one nasty set and is awesome with SR and spikes support.

Extremespeed decimates frail and fast pokemon like Azelf, Infernape, Dugtrio, Weavile, Jolteon etc, finishing them in one hit before they can touch you (Even without SR and Spikes support.) . Bullet Punch ohkos and rapes Aerodactyl and gengar/Mismagius if the latter two take residual damage before hand and if they run 4hp evs or less..

Crunch breaks Cresselia and Dusknoir aswell as celebi, Uxie etc. Stone Edge OHkos bulky Gyarados after a swords dance, EVEN after an intimidate, aswell as ending salamence should it switch in.


Close Combat is what makes this set deadly.

Damage Calculations

Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Skarmory 85.03% - 100.30%
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Bronzong: 96.15% - 113.02%
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Hippowdon: 76.43% - 90.00%
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Forretress: 80.23% - 94.63%
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Donphan: 82.81% - 97.40%

With Stealth Rock and/or some spikes up these "So called" physical walls who are 2hko'd, get Ohko'd after a Swords Danced Close Combat.

Cons : Gliscor and Weezing lol






No one posted Specs Luke either =o ?


Lucario@Choice Specs
252 SP.ATT / 252 SPEED / 6 HP
Modest Nature
Trait : Steadfast
- Aura Sphere
- Vacuum Wave
- Dragon pulse / Hidden power Ice
- Dark pulse / Shadow Ball

Aura Sphere can 2HKO Blissey if she ever gets any bright ideas about switching in.

Vacuum Wave picks of weak pokemon such as weavile and nearly ohkos Tyranitar too o_0

Dragon Pulse or Hidden Power Ice crushes Salamence and Garchomp—use Hidden Power Ice to destroy Gliscor and get more super-effective coverage, or use Dragon Pulse for an extra 20 base power and more neutrality

Use Dark Pulse if you like flinch and Normal coverage or Shadow Ball for hitting Heracross harder..

Problems with this set is that Gyarados can switch in rather easily, but meh, its still deadly.
 
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I like [and have been using] the SD Lucario set, although I gave it Lum berry instead of Life Orb. Lucario can still take at least 1 non SE hit, so Life Orb seems it would only take away for his ability to switch in easier. Lum berry keeps him safe from status, giving him one more turn to stat up.
 
revised my set... basically its Roar over Focus Punch with the Attack EVs in special attack... probably should've tried my Lucario out first but oh well
 
Panicz said:
A Lucario I used that worked amazingly for me was the following:

Lucario @ Focus Sash
Inner Focus
EVs: 92 HP / 252 SAtk / 164 Spd
Modest Nature
- Aura Sphere
- Shadow Ball
- Vacuum Wave
- Hidden Power Ice
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Focus Sash+HP evs=nonono IMO. if you wanna activate sash, you dont want it to survive an attack, which neutralises it. Besides, as far as sweepers go lucario is quite bulky, with base 70 in both defences.

Anyhoo, my special set:

Lucario@life orb
Hasty/Naive
252SpAtt/252Spd/6HP
Aura Sphere/Psychic
Dark Pulse/Shadow Ball
Dragon Pulse
Close Combat

Most of the set is self explanitory. Close combat deals with blissey and other special walls, because STAB and base 115 att is enough to put a large dent in them even without EVs in attack. Psychic if you have issues with two moves of the same type on one poke (Even though they serve differnt purposes)
 
i used a mixed life orb lucario. nothing special. it just makes me very sad when lucario doesn't get much of a kill XD
 
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