The Best Overall Team (Unofficial)

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A counter for Heracross, hm? Okay, let's see...

Standard said:
Heracross @ Choice Band/Choice Scarf; Guts
Adamant; 252 Attack, 104 HP, 152 Speed
Megahorn
Close Combat
Stone Edge
Pursuit
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DEFENSIVE COUNTERING

Bug is resisted by...

Fire, Fighting, Poison, Flying, Ghost, Steel

Fighting is resisted by...

Poison, Flying, Bug, Psychic

Rock is resisted by...

Fighting, Ground, Steel

Dark is resisted by...

Fighting, Dark, Steel

Possible Combinations with No Weaknesses to Those

Fire/Fighting
Fire/Steel
Steel/Flying
Steel/Psychic
Steel/Fighting
Fire/Ground
Ground/Flying

Possible Pokémon

Infernape
Blaziken
Heatran
Skarmory
Metagross
Jirachi
Bronzong
Lucario
Gliscor
Camerupt

OFFENSIVE COUNTERING

Starmie can resist Close Combat and hit with Psychic.
Gliscor can resist Megahorn or Close Combat and hit with Aerial Ace.
Infernape can resist Megahorn and hit with Flare Blitz or Flamethrower.
Metagross can resist Stone Edge and hit with Zen Headbutt.
Lucario can resist Megahorn and hit with Psychic.
Camerupt can resist Megahorn and hit with Flamethrower, Fire Blast, or Lava Plume.

You already have Infernape, which leaves Starmie, Lucario, Gliscor, and Metagross as the best counters.

If you use Electivire, you should probably use Starmie, so you can bait Electric attacks for Motor Drive.

If you use a Dragon-type sweeper, you should use Gliscor for your Heracross counter. I mean, come on, it's the best one there.

If you use your own Heracross, that opens up pretty much all of those as options.

I suck at countering, don't I? I guess that leaves you to discuss all this.
 
Don't we already have Infernape anyway? And do you mean switching with the "Infernape can resist Megahorn and hit with Flare Blitz or Flamethrower?" Because no one in their right mind would use Megahorn on an Infernape on purpose.
 
Wooty McWoot said:
Don't we already have Infernape anyway? And do you mean switching with the "Infernape can resist Megahorn and hit with Flare Blitz or Flamethrower?" Because no one in their right mind would use Megahorn on an Infernape on purpose.
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Choice Item Pokémon take prediction to be used. They also take prediction to be countered. What you do is predict when <attack> is going to be used and switch accordingly.
 
Ooh, prediction. That's a lot of fun when it actually works. >_>
 
Waker of Chaos said:
A counter for Heracross, hm? Okay, let's see...



DEFENSIVE COUNTERING

Bug is resisted by...

Fire, Fighting, Poison, Flying, Ghost, Steel

Fighting is resisted by...

Poison, Flying, Bug, Psychic

Rock is resisted by...

Fighting, Ground, Steel

Dark is resisted by...

Fighting, Dark, Steel

Possible Combinations with No Weaknesses to Those

Fire/Fighting
Fire/Steel
Steel/Flying
Steel/Psychic
Steel/Fighting
Fire/Ground
Ground/Flying

Possible Pokémon

Infernape
Blaziken
Heatran
Skarmory
Metagross
Jirachi
Bronzong
Lucario
Gliscor
Camerupt

OFFENSIVE COUNTERING

Starmie can resist Close Combat and hit with Psychic. But not Night Slash/Pursuit
Gliscor can resist Megahorn or Close Combat and hit with Aerial Ace.
Infernape can resist Megahorn and hit with Flare Blitz or Flamethrower. But not Stone Edge. His defenses are too shabby to properly wall it, anyway
Metagross can resist Stone Edge and hit with Zen Headbutt. But not Close Combat
Lucario can resist Megahorn and hit with Psychic. But not Close Combat
Camerupt can resist Megahorn and hit with Flamethrower, Fire Blast, or Lava Plume. Camerupt sucks

You already have Infernape, which leaves Starmie, Lucario, Gliscor, and Metagross as the best counters. They are in no way Hera counters. Cept Gliscor. Possibly Meta, to an extent.

If you use Electivire, you should probably use Starmie, so you can bait Electric attacks for Motor Drive.

If you use a Dragon-type sweeper, you should use Gliscor for your Heracross counter. I mean, come on, it's the best one there.

If you use your own Heracross, that opens up pretty much all of those as options.

I suck at countering, don't I? I guess that leaves you to discuss all this.
Click to expand...

This is the thing. There is no need to overthink. You don't need to think of counters for his types. It's about who can survive his hits, yeah, but also about retaliating. Heatran, Infernape, Blaziken, Lucario, Metagross, they all fall to Hera, due to the fact that he won't use one move on them. Pokemon are Diverse. He won't have one move. Infernape is in no way a reliable Hera counter. So he resist ONE move-Megahorn. Despite the fact that it gets beat by all his other moves-that's even if it survives that Megahorn. So Metagross resist Stone Edge. He is still very much open to Close Combat. So Starmie resist Close Combat. Megahorn, anyone?

Remember, type isn't everything. Especially when the pokes you mentioned only resist one move at a time. Plus, some pokes you mentioned has lousy defense. It has more to do with our wall's staats, and resisting ALL of it's moves.

EDIT: Just cause he's Choiced isn't enough to wall it. You must predict far too much to really wall it.
 
sims796 said:
This is the thing. There is no need to overthink. You don't need to think of counters for his types. It's about who can survive his hits, yeah, but also about retaliating. Heatran, Infernape, Blaziken, Lucario, Metagross, they all fall to Hera, due to the fact that he won't use one move on them. Pokemon are Diverse. He won't have one move. Infernape is in no way a reliable Hera counter. So he resist ONE move-Megahorn. Despite the fact that it gets beat by all his other moves-that's even if it survives that Megahorn. So Metagross resist Stone Edge. He is still very much open to Close Combat. So Starmie resist Close Combat. Megahorn, anyone?
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And therefore I suck. I may as well just leave this thread alone. The only other idea I had was Spite Spiritomb, but you won't even consider that.
 
Stats kinda do > the type of the Pokemon. I mean, look at Blissey. Its HP and special defense pretty much shield it from all special attacks. The normal type doesn't have to help at all.

Edit: You don't have to go emo and leave because some of your ideas don't work. I barely have experience with DP, and I stay here. If nothing else, you'll learn some good strategies, and you'll be better off than when you started.
 
Waker of Chaos said:
And therefore I suck. I may as well just leave this thread alone. The only other idea I had was Spite Spiritomb, but you won't even consider that.
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Look, I never said you suck. Stop doing that. All I did was point out the glaring flaws in your idea. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work. Gliscor resist all of his moves. Donphan does not take major damage from any of Hera's moves. Forry can outwall Hera anyday. And none of them resist every move that it has. Yet their stats makes them the superb choice. So type isn't everything.

Just because you are proven incorrect, at something that was an honest error, doesn't mean we are personally attacking you.

As for Spite Tomb, Hera would switch on the spot, making Spite pretty moot. Or, he might get KOed before Spite does major damage. Pain Split would work better.
 
sims796 said:
Look, I never said you suck. Stop doing that. All I did was point out the glaring flaws in your idea. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work. Gliscor resist all of his moves. Donphan does not take major damage from any of Hera's moves. Forry can outwall Hera anyday. And none of them resist every move that it has. Yet their stats makes them the superb choice. So type isn't everything.

Just because you are proven incorrect, at something that was an honest error, doesn't mean we are personally attacking you.

As for Spite Tomb, Hera would switch on the spot, making Spite pretty moot. Or, he might get KOed before Spite does major damage. Pain Split would work better.
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You never said I suck. I told myself I suck. It's not you, it's me. I despise making even the slightest mistake. I know you're not personally attacking me; I attack myself by default.

I think Spite Spiritomb has Pain Split anyway.

EDIT: I checked, the standard Spite Spiritomb doesn't have Pain Split. However, we could modify it to use it.
 
Yeah, what we're saying is that it's a pretty lol notion that infernape can counter heracross. Not only is the scarf variant faster, but infernape isn't going to be surviving attacks from heracross. Even megahorn, which is double resisted, probably does a lot. But Close Combat would be a OHKO.

Blaziken is just like Nape, only a little more bulky but a lot slower.

Heatran actually does have a weakness, and it's to close combat. Good luck surviving that.

Skarmory is 2HKOed by close combat from CBcross, but otherwise works.

Metagross takes a beating from heracross's STAB moves.

Jirachi is much like metagross.

Bronzong has weaker defense than Skarmory and rarely has any EVs there anyways. 2HKOed by STAB moves...

Lucario...lol, OHKOed by close combat, not exactly what I'd call a counter...

Gliscor is pretty obvious as the best Hera counter in the game with Weezing (BTW, why in the world isn't that on the list? O_o And the nidos? Crobat double resists STAB moves and a focus sash saves it from stone edge...)

Camerupt is loled at by close combat.

Above proves why doing everything by types is ineffective. And stop begging for sympathy or saying you suck. Keep that to yourself.
 
Ye'know what we should do? Get back on topic. Ok so right now Gliscor or Bronzong, and if we go Starmie over Gengar, that leaves Donphan open to do some Phazing. That looks better to me.
 
Star wasn't the special sweeper, just the bulky spinner.

I don't care for Bronzong much. It doesn't focus on one defense.
 
Well if Starmie replaces Gengar, we get a spinner, special sweeper (Who can survive ice hits), and if we use Gliscor, we also get a more reliable physical wall. And I say we keep Donphan as a physical tank.
 
We're still hanging over this stupid Ice weak? It isn't that severe.
 
We weren't using legendaries iirc either, Waker. >_> What would be the set for this Starmie?
 
Someone here didn't like Sandstorm. I forget who. But yeah. I don't think we have a rock type to exploit sandstorm either.

Edit: Nope, we don't.
 
Wooty McWoot said:
Someone here didn't like Sandstorm. I forget who. But yeah. I don't think we have a rock type to exploit sandstorm either.

Edit: Nope, we don't.
Click to expand...

I meant with so many people using Tyranitar or Hippowdon, we can use their sandstorms to our advantage, though a small one.
 
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