The Coder's Lounge

[Inkblots]

So, I'll have another Java exam next week and was wondering one thing... What do you all think about programming exams on paper? Like you get the task and you have to write it down on paper, without usage of the computer.

I feel about it the same way I feel about most exams: it's really not a good test of your abilities, since it's not a scenario most people are going to find themselves in - how often outside of an exam are you going to be required to write a program without even so much as being able to test it? But, if there's no other way to test you on it, then that's what you have to do I guess.

I think a pen-and-paper test is more suited to writing pseudocode or analyzing a given program, since you SHOULD be able to work out an algorithm without assistance, and it's always possible you'll be in a situation where you're having to fix somebody else's code, and might not have useful comments or error messages.

 

[Janp]

I used to pretty much religiously write out code on paper before ever bringing it onto an electronic device, so I think I would do fine with it. I still have several 'scrolls' of programs that are basically several pages of code taped together that I used to hang on my walls to examine all at once. XD

I don't have an obsession, I swear... >_>

I feel about it the same way I feel about most exams: it's really not a good test of your abilities, since it's not a scenario most people are going to find themselves in - how often outside of an exam are you going to be required to write a program without even so much as being able to test it? But, if there's no other way to test you on it, then that's what you have to do I guess.

I think a pen-and-paper test is more suited to writing pseudocode or analyzing a given program, since you SHOULD be able to work out an algorithm without assistance, and it's always possible you'll be in a situation where you're having to fix somebody else's code, and might not have useful comments or error messages.

I get used to drawing the diagrams, as it helps me to find flaws in my logic. I still have tons of paper when I was writing Double Linked List for my algorithm class. I also write code/psedocode sometimes when I have an idea and don't have computer near me.

 

[string555]

I've been doing something for quite a while without really thinking about it much, but I realized it's something that definitely helps me out with learning anything. Whenever I learn a new concept, I pretend in my head that I'm explaining the concept to someone that doesn't know much of anything about the subject. By pretending to explain it, I gain a better understanding of it myself, like it becomes more solid in my head. Basically, if you think you understand something, but you can't really explain it to someone else in a simplified way, then you must not really have a thorough understanding of it.

Of course it's even better to teach something to a real person, but as for me, I've put my parents through far too many lectures over the years about all that stuff. XD

 

[Tsutarja]

So out of curiosity, does anyone here code in PHP?

 

[malanaphii]

i do a lot of python in school, but i wanna do more coding - which programming language do you think is easiest to learn (in terms of there being tutorials & easy ways to use it)?

 

[Megan]

So, I'll have another Java exam next week and was wondering one thing... What do you all think about programming exams on paper? Like you get the task and you have to write it down on paper, without usage of the computer.

That can actually be really hilarious, especially when they don't specify a language or a certain method to solve the problem. It's these cases where you can pull off some real bs and show that you actually know your stuff, especially when you're doing this during an interview.

i do a lot of python in school, but i wanna do more coding - which programming language do you think is easiest to learn (in terms of there being tutorials & easy ways to use it)?

If you want to be boring, pick Java. If you want stuff to be done quick, pick Delphi/Free Pascal. If you want to learn more about programming, pick C. If you want something that works well with game creation, then Python, Ruby, Lua or C# are pretty useful.

They are all pretty easy (well, C maybe not so much) and mainstream enough to offer lots of resources.

 

[string555]

I've been learning C for a while now, and I still have a lot to learn. However, at some point I would like to move up into one of the higher C-based languages. Considering that I will mostly be using it for system programming type stuff (Both for Ubuntu and Windows 10), could anyone suggest which one might be more suitable for that?

I would imagine that a lot of it comes down to preference, though, but I thought I would ask anyway. :3

 

[Megan]

I've been learning C for a while now, and I still have a lot to learn. However, at some point I would like to move up into one of the higher C-based languages. Considering that I will mostly be using it for system programming type stuff (Both for Ubuntu and Windows 10), could anyone suggest which one might be more suitable for that?

I would imagine that a lot of it comes down to preference, though, but I thought I would ask anyway. :3

Well, with C and Assembler you would cover Linux pretty well. I suppose C++ is a good idea, as it is used in a lot of systems, so being able to use it gives you a lot more options in the workforce. For anything Microsoft, C# seems like the language to go.

If you want to be fancy, I'd recommend D as a language. I really like its design. Only downside is that it's not particularly well known, so some things like adding new libraries might be a little more complicated than in mainstream languages.

 

[string555]

Well, with C and Assembler you would cover Linux pretty well. I suppose C++ is a good idea, as it is used in a lot of systems, so being able to use it gives you a lot more options in the workforce. For anything Microsoft, C# seems like the language to go.

If you want to be fancy, I'd recommend D as a language. I really like its design. Only downside is that it's not particularly well known, so some things like adding new libraries might be a little more complicated than in mainstream languages.

Thank you. :D

I guess maybe I should just stick to C and NASM for Linux, as you said, and only learn C# for the Windows programming.

Also, until you mentioned it, I had never even heard of the D language. :X

I would really love to just use Perl for everything, but if you want other users to use your programs, it's just not really practical for most of them to deal with it. :''''''(

 

[Leviathan]

So out of curiosity, does anyone here code in PHP?

I do, and I enjoy doing so too, for some reason? So whenever I had to do projects in PHP, I had fun. I'm learning about different approaches at the moment though, including the Java equivalent in JSPs.

So, I'll have another Java exam next week and was wondering one thing... What do you all think about programming exams on paper? Like you get the task and you have to write it down on paper, without usage of the computer.

Oh godddd, give me theory questions any day over reproducing code! At least I can partially bluff my way through those. I've been asked before to do everything from write out a function that uses recursion to a full client-server application using web sockets. It shouldn't be so bad, you'd think, but the time constraints we're given to write it all out in is so short. I kinda hope I don't get coding questions in my summer exam this year.

I guess maybe I should just stick to C and NASM for Linux, as you said, and only learn C# for the Windows programming.

True but I thought I heard a while back that they wanted to / were going to take C# and the .Net languages cross-platform to compete with Java? I could be wrong though; I haven't touched C languages in about 2 years and not since moving on to Java.

Outside of that, though, does anyone know of some good places / books to look at for getting familiar with android development in java? I've been consulting the Google documentation and Vogella's tutorials, updating his sample apps to the latest Gradle builds and such, but there are certain things like Fragments? And SharedPreferences? That I can't seem to wrap my head around.

 

[Megan]

There's something intriguing when you randomly decide to download a ROM Hacking tool and it not only has its source code attached, but it also turns out to be a really old Delphi project. Now, if only the guy would have saved his form files in plain text format and not binary...

I would really love to just use Perl for everything, but if you want other users to use your programs, it's just not really practical for most of them to deal with it. :''''''(

I've heard Perl is pretty neat, especially when you want to deal with text patterns. Only downside, and as far as I know the reason why it stopped being relevant, is that the creator still hasn't released a new version which ultimately lead to newer languages, namely Python, to take over its niche.

I remember playing around with it for a little bit, but ultimately I just ditched it for Python. xD

 

[string555]

I've heard Perl is pretty neat, especially when you want to deal with text patterns. Only downside, and as far as I know the reason why it stopped being relevant, is that the creator still hasn't released a new version which ultimately lead to newer languages, namely Python, to take over its niche.

I remember playing around with it for a little bit, but ultimately I just ditched it for Python. xD

I like it because I got comfortable enough with it that writing code in it feels really natural and easy. So far, I've been able to bring to life practically everything I've dreamed up. :D

On Python, if it's similar to Perl, does that mean it has some type of regex feature as well?

 

[Megan]

On Python, if it's similar to Perl, does that mean it has some type of regex feature as well?

It does. I've played around with it a couple years ago and it got the job done.

I just yesterday used RegEx for the first ime in Delphi. It didn't cause me as much trouble as I thought it would. You know how the saying goes: "I have 99 problems and I use regular expressions to solve them. Now I have 100 problems."

 

[Inkblots]

Speaking of perl...

If you want a hilarious good time, hand a bunch of first-year software engineering students a program written in perl, give them zero information on how perl works, and tell them to modify it (and make sure the internet connection is super spotty so they can't actually look anything up)

(for the record though, my lab partner and I did manage it. I think I'm going to like perl, once I learn a bit more about it)

 

[Janp]

Speaking of perl...

If you want a hilarious good time, hand a bunch of first-year software engineering students a program written in perl, give them zero information on how perl works, and tell them to modify it (and make sure the internet connection is super spotty so they can't actually look anything up)

(for the record though, my lab partner and I did manage it. I think I'm going to like perl, once I learn a bit more about it)

That reminds me of my terrible Databases teacher this semester. No one in the class had any experiences with Databases and he expected us to create Database Model and some SQL codes on the first lecture, right after he asked us, if we had any experiences and everyone told him pretty clearly that we don't. There also was no computer in the class or internet connection, so it was fun. No one showed on his lectures again.

 

[Inkblots]

That reminds me of my terrible Databases teacher this semester. No one in the class had any experiences with Databases and he expected us to create Database Model and some SQL codes on the first lecture, right after he asked us, if we had any experiences and everyone told him pretty clearly that we don't. There also was no computer in the class or internet connection, so it was fun. No one showed on his lectures again.

Ugh, that sucks. Sometimes I wonder how professors (a) got their job and (b) manage to keep it

At least with my lab, part of the point (I think) was to "learn on the fly" and see what we came up with (it was just unfortunate that the network happened to be so spotty that day or it probably would've taken a lot less time - it was kinda fun anyway though, everybody snarking back and forth about how slow the computers were being and "what does THAT mean?")

 

[Inkblots]

That's what most of the labs I have are. We're free to discuss code and approaches, but not sharing solutions obviously. It's not bad, and some professors will also discuss with us ways to go about the assignment as well. Makes doing assignments nicer.

Yeah it's the same at my school - beginning of each semester we have an academic integrity talk about how we're allowed to discuss strategies and approaches, but can't share code (or pseudocode). One of my courses last semester had to have a talk again halfway through the semester because there were a bunch of assignments being flagged by MOSS as 90% similar (which like okay you expect one or two people in every course to cheat, but I think it was something like 25% of the class? And it's not like they were super hard assignments as long as you did the readings and paid attention in class. I got them all done by working on them 5 - 10 minutes at a time while waiting for a lecture to start, and then would just take an hour or so over my lunch to clean them up before submitting them)

My one course this semester is nice, because the professor is actually doing a "blog" for the first assignment since this is the first "big" multi-file program most of us have written - he works on the assignment himself for an hour every day, and then posts a blog outlining exactly what he did (e.g., files created, which functions he finished, how he tested them, and a little bit of code or pseudocode if he does something we haven't discussed in class yet) so if you just follow along you should get it done in time (and if you get stuck then you'll know you're stuck and can go get help)

 

[string555]

Damn, I really popped way off the stack this time (hehe). On Christmas weekend, I decided to take a break from all things coding, so I could come back to it with a clear and refreshed mind. Fast forward to NOW, and I still haven't been doing anything with it. :X

So just for the discussion, for those of you who have ever taken extended time away from coding, what things have you done to smoothly transition back into it? (Ridiculous jokes are welcome :P)

 

[string555]

When I've wanted to get back into coding I just try to find an old project that I hadn't finished, and look at the code. Perhaps fix some bugs, refactor some inefficient code, take things from a different approach (Using a vector/list instead of an array for flexibility), etc. It's from there that I start working on other things and get back to actually writing copious amounts of code again.

Hopefully this summer I'll have my urge to code enough that I can start working on a game engine through Unity. I know I'll need alcohol to get through it...

That seems like a good idea. Just like always, I guess once I get back into thinking about it, pretty soon it consumes my thoughts to where I'm thinking about some programs while working (My work has nothing to do with that stuff, lol), among other places. :D

Even though I don't want to really dive into graphics programming for games, I've had some experience with 3D modeling, and so I don't really understand how that kind of engine works. It can take an exceptionally long time just to render one frame in a 3D program, so does an engine somehow load EVERY possible frame in an area ahead of time, but not completely, then finishes each frame as needed? Or is it somehow efficient enough to completely render each frame on the spot as it's needed? Or some other method? :X

 

[Inkblots]

That's a very interesting way of going about doing an assignment. And it also allows people to work on it and discuss it as the professor works on it, and it allows those that are behind to not have an insurmountable wall of work to get past, they can just pace themselves. Kinda wish more profs here did that.

Yeah, it's really nice, especially because I was one of the ones who started way late lol. Definitely made it not quite so overwhelming when you have a plan already laid out for you, I would've had no idea where to start otherwise (previously we'd written single programs of 100 - 200 lines that maybe had a separate header file or interacted with a text file. This one was 6 different programs ranging from 30 - 400 lines + header + binary file). I didn't actually do too badly, got 11 days of work done in about 4... but everything fell apart when I got to the final day and the final program which was just supposed to be the "interface" (text-based - no GUI's yet) and suddenly nothing worked even though I'd tested everything extensively. Got it all worked out so it was working (almost) flawlessly, transferred it to the school's Linux server to test it before handing it in, which I've never had a problem with other than the compiler sometimes being a bit more nit-picky with its warnings. And it broke :/ wish I'd had time to re-write or at least go through the code more thoroughly, but I was down to the wire and not thinking straight anymore, so just got it so you could at least run the program and left it at that (had been working on it from 6pm straight through to 8am and it was due at 8:30. 14 hours straight of coding and three cups of tea is not a nice thing to do to your brain, let me tell you lol).

Oh well, lesson learned. The next assignment I'm going to keep up with the blog as much as I can, and do it right on the server so I don't have to worry about anything breaking.