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The general competitive standard: Rules

As much as this thread is openly showing the opinions of both sides lets's not get to arguing and eventually to flame at each others opinions guys.

: /
 
Eh, I suppose you have a point. Ill leave it alone. In any case, The rules are their for a reason. Not everyone is going to like it but it for the most part, They are there for peoples best interest
 
Meh I'm not trying to change the rules or anything. I just like to speak my mind on these topics. ^_^
 
Thats cool. Do your thing man
 
Yeah, try not to get too upset at each other or anything. ^_^; Other opinions are good for your side—if you can shoot them down, it strengthens your argument. And we all benefit from having our opinions tested. That said, it just feels like the only decent counters for Double Team are too narrow and otherwise worthless. In the case of DT Skarmory, yeah, Shock Wave Alakazam can stop it, but not everyone wants one of those. And it does nothing about a Double Teaming Donphan or Rhyper or anything. If Double Team wasn't such a universal move, then it could be more easily dealt with by analyzing the Pokemon that can learn it. But in DT's case, that's all Pokemon. So there's not really a good solution for it.
 
I agree with you, I just believe clauses were made for the competitive interest in mind.
 
I'd like to contribute the notion that a Calm Mind Alakazam is next to useless. When, except for the rare, rare occasion like the Skarmory example above, would Alakazam ever be able to pull off a CM without taking a physical hit immediately afterward?
 
Well yea, Alakazam is pretty frail, but typically it takes at least 2 hits to knock Alakazam out unless you are using a phys sweeper (then again, you may not need that much). and if he survives this long, then (I assume he goes first since he has high spd):

Alakazam CMs
He takes physical attack, hes left with like 10% hp
He uses special attack, may knock out opponent, may not but will do lotsa dmg
If he does knock it out, then he can attack the next Pokémon with a special attack and take a significant chunk of hp out (unless its like Umbry or something). Then Alakazam is knocked out

I guess Alakazam is kinda the Kamikaze Pokémon... I mean many of those letters are in his name! =P
 
Arkarian said:
I'd like to contribute the notion that a Calm Mind Alakazam is next to useless. When, except for the rare, rare occasion like the Skarmory example above, would Alakazam ever be able to pull off a CM without taking a physical hit immediately afterward?
Click to expand...

Calm Mind Zam is not useless by any means. Try a set like this: Calm Mind, Psychic, Encore, Focus Blast/filler to hit dark types. Encore a useless move, such as a Blissey's aromatherapy. Proceed to CM up, and then wail away on everything that tries to ruin your fun. Lots of potential here. Even if they don't stay in, you still get a free CM and thus a set-up for an attack.
 
Where do I get the Soul Dew BTW?
 
Calm Mind seems a lot less prevalent than it used to be, but it's still good. Getting a free one on the switch is probably your best bet. Encore can work, but there's not a lot Alakazam can safely Encore; Blissey would probably switch out due to Focus Blast now. Combined with the very popular 3v3 Life Orb, it can work. It's just that other Pokemon do it better.

Red X said:
Where do I get the Soul Dew BTW?
Click to expand...

This isn't the right place for that question. ^_^; There used to be a thread for quick, simple questions but...I don't see it now. So to answer your question, Soul Dew is obtained off of Latios or Latias that are fought with the Eon Ticket event. You'll either need an E-reader with the Eon Ticket card, or to mix records with someone who's already gotten it. This works in Ruby and Sapphire; I'm not sure about its availability in Emerald.
 
Updated first post with the tentative accepted tiers
 
Lol, Thanks. Ill keep this updated as much as possible with new things
 
Where did you get that list from? It seems a little weird, especially in the BL section. I think Crobat's OU if simply because it has a 394 speed Hypnosis with 70 accuracy—up to 77 with Wide Lens. Donphan also seems like OU material, with such high defenses. Vaporeon was OU last gen, and probably still is this one. And I know it's still under debate, but a lot of people think that the 600 base stat special Pokemon should all be uber, even Shaymin and Manaphy.

I'm not saying it's wrong or anything. ^_^; I'm just curious as to where it came from.
 
Neoseeker is where i found it. Apperently, I've seen several lists that look just like that one.
 
Where did you get that list from? It seems a little weird, especially in the BL section. I think Crobat's OU if simply because it has a 394 speed Hypnosis with 70 accuracy—up to 77 with Wide Lens. Donphan also seems like OU material, with such high defenses. Vaporeon was OU last gen, and probably still is this one. And I know it's still under debate, but a lot of people think that the 600 base stat special Pokemon should all be uber, even Shaymin and Manaphy.

I'm not saying it's wrong or anything. ^_^; I'm just curious as to where it came from.
Click to expand...
No Pokémon should be judged by base stats alone. Let's take, Celebi, for example, though it's still an awesome Pokémon and a real pain to take down, it has 7 weaknesses, 4 of which are a fairly common and then there's that nasty 4x Bug weak that Heracross and Rhyperior love to exploit. Shaymin is in pretty much the same situation, as being a pure Grass type makes it weak to many common types. As for Manaphy, even though it can learn Tail Glow and is an overall great Pokémon, a strong Thunder Fang or two will screw it over big time. Manaphy can't really do much damage before it gets an Sp.Attack boost, either and Blissey walls Manaphy extremely effectively. I do agree on Crobat being OU, though, but it's hard for me to tell as I haven't even got Diamond or Pearl yet.
 
Smarties-kun said:
No Pokémon should be judged by base stats alone. Let's take, Celebi, for example, though it's still an awesome Pokémon and a real pain to take down, it has 7 weaknesses, 4 of which are a fairly common and then there's that nasty 4x Bug weak that Heracross and Rhyperior love to exploit. Shaymin is in pretty much the same situation, as being a pure Grass type makes it weak to many common types. As for Manaphy, even though it can learn Tail Glow and is an overall great Pokémon, a strong Thunder Fang or two will screw it over big time. Manaphy can't really do much damage before it gets an Sp.Attack boost, either and Blissey walls Manaphy extremely effectively. I do agree on Crobat being OU, though, but it's hard for me to tell as I haven't even got Diamond or Pearl yet.
Click to expand...

I'm not judging them by their base stats—"600 base stat Pokemon" is just an easy way to refer to Mew, Celebi, Jirachi, Shaymin, and Manaphy collectively. ^_^; I understand that they're not equal; Mew is probably the best one out of them. And Shaymin is the worst, due to a poor movepool (excluding Seed Flare). The reason that some call for a blanket ban is because, with the exception of Manaphy, none are easy to legitimately obtain, and most of them border the uber status as is. There probably won't ever be a definite judgment on them. I'd personally love to use Mew, since it's so cute, but it's the most likely to be banned out of all of them. With DP offering so many ubers this time around, there are enough of them for an uber metagame; banned Pokemon won't necessarily be unusable, just in a different class. So they'll still see use in some way~
 
I'm not judging them by their base stats—"600 base stat Pokemon" is just an easy way to refer to Mew, Celebi, Jirachi, Shaymin, and Manaphy collectively. ^_^; I understand that they're not equal; Mew is probably the best one out of them. And Shaymin is the worst, due to a poor movepool (excluding Seed Flare). The reason that some call for a blanket ban is because, with the exception of Manaphy, none are easy to legitimately obtain, and most of them border the uber status as is. There probably won't ever be a definite judgment on them. I'd personally love to use Mew, since it's so cute, but it's the most likely to be banned out of all of them. With DP offering so many ubers this time around, there are enough of them for an uber metagame; banned Pokemon won't necessarily be unusable, just in a different class. So they'll still see use in some way~
Click to expand...
Which I think is completely ridiculous. If people have gone through alot of trouble to obtain Celebi, for example, and it isn't overpowered in any way, then I think they should have full rights to use those Pokémon. Hackers are another case, but I personally don't care if a Pokémon is hacked as long as it hasn't been caught in a hacked Master Ball and doesn't have hacked stats. And you said all of the 600 base stat Pokémon excluding Manaphy are hard to obtain with legitimate methods, which isn't entirely true. Jirachi is fairly easy to obtain as well as it can be obtained both from the European version of Pokémon Channel and the Pokémon Colosseum bonus disc, the latter which, from what I've heard, has an infinite supply of Jirachi.

I think people (I'm not directing this at you, in case it seems like that.) should wake up and smell the coffee and realize that if certain Pokémon are to be banned because they're one of a kind or extremely rare and most importantly, supposedly ''too powerful'' then by the same logic Garchomp, Dragonite, Tyranitar etc. should also be banned in standard play because they belong in the same base stat group (600 total) and some of them are stronger than, for example Shaymin, that I'm sure everyone will ban even after it can be obtained legitimately.
 
the sleep clause is really really annoying! it should be removed because putting pokemon to sleep and destroying them is a legit strategy, plus its fun to watch pplsz switch, then I put THEM to sleep. It causes frustration wich will hinder trainers rational thoughts and thy'll go all out and not think about stategy
 
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