Question: The rationale with "excessive swearing"

[Alexander Nicholi]

Don't get me wrong by making this thread, but I'm curious: what is the staff's stance with what they've said in the changes as "excessive swearing"? Also, could that stand to be clarified, or possibly changed?


What I'm having a bit of trouble agreeing with is the allowance to hand pick this or that that may be deemed excessive, or gross. I'm not suggesting that it be all one way, but... is it really concise to have social opinion dictate what "this or that" really is? The rules say "excessive swearing and inflammatory/derogatory swearing," but the lack of clarity I'm seeing is with what exactly is classified as derogatory or excessive. One could argue on any mark of the field of what's derogatory or excessive. Could we get an iron line laid down with that? Maybe something else could be done? I'm not sure... I just don't think the leeways and restrictions with the censor rules are the most concrete thing and thought some discussion could be had about that. Surely something better can be done.

 

[Aquacorde]

I would interpret excessive as like, sentences made of mostly swearing or a very aggressive swear post ya know? And inflammatory/derogatory would be like directed at other users or specific groups or instigating shit. It's really not that hard to tell what's acceptable I don't think. It's not like ya gonna get warned for using 'fuck' a few times times in a decent post, more like if ya whole post is "fuck these fucking cunts" or something.

idk man PC's rules have always been pretty common sense and people who would be getting talked to about that kind of thing are probably the kind of people who are clearly in the wrong rather than borderline? So hardass definitions probs aint needed so much. Any specific instances you're worried abt can probs be taken up with staff but... I have seen literally no issue with this kind of thing.

 

[Klippy]

Often people use swears as enhancers for their words and that's somewhat of the same idea for what applies here. You're free to swear insofar as it does so as an enhancer and not just for the sake of being able to. Excessive would be using a swear constantly in a post in which it adds little or nothing to your post, in a sexual manner, and in any other offensive way.

What is deemed offensive is determined by any staff member of their own discretion. They are given the authority to act upon it if they determine it to be offensive.

My usual spiel: If anyone feels they were disciplined unfairly, they may PM a higher staff member to review their case. We're here to help. :)

 

[Her]

My interpretation was that 'excessive swearing' constitutes the repeated usage of swears past an acceptable point in a single post or the consistent usage of swears in various posts in a short time period. In either case, it's when the swears become so unsightly that they impact on forum discussion.

 

[Alexander Nicholi]

Often people use swears as enhancers for their words and that's somewhat of the same idea for what applies here. You're free to swear insofar as it does so as an enhancer and not just for the sake of being able to. Excessive would be using a swear constantly in a post in which it adds little or nothing to your post, in a sexual manner, and in any other offensive way.

What is deemed offensive is determined by any staff member of their own discretion. They are given the authority to act upon it if they determine it to be offensive.

My usual spiel: If anyone feels they were disciplined unfairly, they may PM a higher staff member to review their case. We're here to help. :)

No, it's not that I have a problem with the discipline I got... I thought that criterion could prove helpful in calling judgments. Like, getting specific with things - no really bad words (n- and c- come to mind), refrain in X kind of discussion, or something like that. An analytical approach. But this isn't broken, either. So I dunno.

 

[Her]

I think it's kinda obvious where/when swears of any kind/of any ratio are appropriate and when they are inappropriate.

 

[Klippy]

No, it's not that I have a problem with the discipline I got... I thought that criterion could prove helpful in calling judgments. Like, getting specific with things - no really bad words (n- and c- come to mind), refrain in X kind of discussion, or something like that. An analytical approach. But this isn't broken, either. So I dunno.

Each case like this will be handled individually. In general, if you are posting here, you should be aware of the language you use and what is deemed acceptable when posting. Excessive would constitute anything outside a few swears to enhance the language in your post and offensive would constitute anything vulgar or insulting, though like I said, each case will be handled individually and by staff members of their own volition.

 

[Nihilego]

I think it's kinda obvious where/when swears of any kind/of any ratio are appropriate and when they are inappropriate.

This. And this is why it's up to moderator judgement. Because quite honestly it's really easy to tell when you're swearing just for the sake of being able to. When we changed how the swear filter works we were very clear that swearing was not to be used just for the sake of it, and we left the community with the trust that it could deem what's okay and what isn't (just like they would in everyday conversation). Setting a hard line of what's okay and what isn't just goes against that. I'd sooner re-enact swear filtering than tell people how to do something as simple as decide what kind of language is appropriate. Honestly, if you're struggling to understand how much swearing is appropriate then the issue is with your communication skills, not our rules.

 

[Maruno]

If you choose to use swears in your own posts, apply common sense—use them as sparingly as you would in a conversation with friends.

I think this sentence of the rules should be reworded, as some people have rather uncouth friends who would routinely throw around swear words for the sake of edginess or whatever. Say something about "polite society" instead, because that's what (I hope) we are.

 

[Nick]

The rule is subject to staff interpretation.

This is something that always bothered me, even on the staff. I am in no way of the opinion that staff members can't decide on their own, but there is very little familiarity in severity of actions amongst staff members, so you kind of have to be weary regardless. Stricter staff members handle things more severely than lax staff members, who may not do anything at all. It's sort of like you have to have the luck of the draw for absolutely everything around here, which makes it pretty dangerous. I'm not arguing in the sense that you should be breaking the rules or anything in the first place, but when you post something that's a little blurred that you yourself think "Eh, this will be fine.", it's sort of a guessing game from there.

 

[Maruno]

Alternatively, you could say that this rule is effectively trying to police English, which is an awful thing to be trying to make absolutes about. Every case is different, there's no black and white, and all we can use are guidelines and our best judgements.

If anyone thinks they received too severe a punishment, they can of course contest it by going to a higher member of staff - this will at the very least call all staff's attention to it, allowing them to compare reactions and figure out what level of reaction they should have had, which will balance their future decisions on similar matters. Plus some staff will ask on their own if they're not sure.

You only run the line of "luck of the draw" if you swear in the first place. There's an easy way to avoid this fuzzy rule frontier.