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Why did they change everything up so much?

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Illusionss said:
Also Ash-greninja? They trying to make a 2016 power rangers inspired game by having human/pokemon fusions?
Click to expand...

Be careful what you wish for...

These images are from The Shonen manga Pocket Monster Reburst... Drawn by Jin Kusude and published by Shogakugan.

*Edit*
Spoiler:


Ash-Greninja (As explained in the anime) a form in which Greninja can take when he's fully synchronized with Ash (Thoughts feelings, movement etc.) which happens because of the "Bond Phenomenon"

Bond Phenomenon - may be achieved when the trust between the Trainer and the Pokémon reaches maximum. While a Pokémon and Trainer are using this form, the Trainer shares the Pokémon's pain in the same place the Pokémon was dealt damage. The Trainer can also share the Pokémon's point of view. If the form is not mastered, the Trainer and Pokémon can pass out from exhaustion.

Bond phenomenon is tied to the hidden potential of a Pokemon (Not all Pokemon can have this potential tho... if they do, Ash's Pikachu would've achieved the bond form first). To date only Greninja has been shown to have this power as in the anime the Guardian of the ninja village is a Bond-Greninja, which means that Ash/Satoshi and his Greninja/Gekouga wasn't the first duo to awaken the power.
 
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CidHazard said:
Be careful what you wish for...

These images are from The Shonen manga Pocket Monster Reburst... Drawn by Jin Kusude and published by Shogakugan.

Spoiler:


Ash-Greninja (As explained in the anime) a form in which Greninja can take when he's fully synchronized with Ash (Thoughts feelings, movement etc.) which happens because of the "Bond Phenomenon"

Bond Phenomenon - may be achieved when the trust between the Trainer and the Pokémon reaches maximum. While a Pokémon and Trainer are using this form, the Trainer shares the Pokémon's pain in the same place the Pokémon was dealt damage. The Trainer can also share the Pokémon's point of view. If the form is not mastered, the Trainer and Pokémon can pass out from exhaustion.

Bond phenomenon is tied to the hidden potential of a Pokemon (Not all Pokemon can have this potential tho... if they do, Ash's Pikachu would've achieved the bond form first). To date only Greninja has been shown to have this power as in the anime the Guardian of the ninja village is a Bond-Greninja, which means that Ash/Satoshi and his Greninja/Gekouga wasn't the first duo to awaken the power.
Click to expand...

What did I wish for?

There's nothing in the spoiler tags btw, just blank img boxes.

The trainer sharing the Pokemon's pain sounds like a very silly idea in my opinion.
 
They changed it because the whole formula was getting stale. XY was the most barebones copy and paste adventure we've had so far. Durr pick a starter go to town beat the gym fight your rival OH NO there's an evil team that wants to kill us all and steal Pokemon we have to stop them! World domination! oh wait they were pushovers. also something about mega evolution and a war that was never really talked about much. oh hey elite 4 beat them and the champion congrats you're a Pokemon Master.

I agree when I first heard about the removals of Gyms I was a little upset and worried over it, but then I looked back and realized every single Gym Leader and Elite 4 member were pushovers in XY. They didn't give me the nostaligic feeling of collecting all the badges and being a Pokemon Champion it was more like oh I was blessed with Mega Evolution and even if I don't use it I swept the game easily. Trials sound way more refreshing and fun, even if you sadly don't fight the trial captains, but hey hunting around for stuff and discovering the land sounds more fun than press garbage cans many times until you get lucky enough to have the right to fight some dude and his Raichu. Kahunas take the role of Gym Leaders, and at least one of them has a freakin Guardian Pokemon with him, which I think is pretty rad. And it seems like Gyms might be returning after all, it's very likely they could be a post-game thing, as the Pokemon League actually is being built in the game, so at the very least you'll probably fight an Elite 4 and Champion.

I'm most excited for Sun and Moon because they look so fresh. You got trials, Team Skull who actually don't wanna blow up the world (they remind me of Team Rocket in a way, just goofier), whatever the Aether Foundation is, some mysteries with the box legendaries, Alolan forms (even if they are limited, the good ones are really damn good), Z-Moves seem fun, Poke Ride (NO MORE HMS THAT'S A BLESSING), Poke finder, Hyper Training, Trainer customization updated, Ultra Beasts and more. Pokemon may very well go back to the traditional form next generation, but I'm sure Sun and Moon will always be remembered for this very reason, the games are unique. I'm pumped man, give the games a chance, and they're already giving SO much love to the original games by making Alolan forms exclusive to Kanto Pokemon, most Pokemon in the Pokedex being from Kanto, including Red, Blue, Alolan Oak, and more.
 
So you would rather have same old boring thing?
 
Illusionss said:
Getting rid of gyms and the league is taking a large portion of the concept away, references such as?
Click to expand...

The Island Trials appear to be gyms by a different name really

Gen 1 references I remember off the top of my head:
-player character is stated to have moved to Alola from Kanto
-Alolan forms are exclusive to gen 1 pokemon
-Professor Oak has a cousin who basically looks like a Hawaiian version of him
-Red and Blue are featured in the post game battle facility as opponents and partners

And whatever else I'm forgetting
 
Man, people are getting all salty about the changes Sun and Moon will bring about!

I'm thinking, given how poorly received X/Y were since their release, and many of the same formulas being repeated in each new main series region (and remakes), Game Freak must have figured out that the Pokémon main games were getting to be tired an dated, and that they needed to be taken in a different direction. Every long-standing media franchise, no matter how static they may be over the years, will eventually need to be taken in a new direction at some point or else suffer the consequences.
As more information comes in and what all has been revealed so far, it appears things are finally coming together and the new things like riding Pokémon and Island Trial Challenges are replacements for key features (Bicycle and Gyms, respectively) that have been in place from day one, with these new elements deemed as giving Sun/Moon a "fresh" feel while taking the roles that have been previously a part of every main series game to date. (I remember there was a post somewhere here which relayed info that you would need a certain number of badges awarded by completing Trials in order for the demo's Ash-Greninja to obey you after being transferred into the full versions of Sun and Moon.)
 
The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced that I won't enjoy sun and moon.

I didn't play gen 5 until years after it's release as I wasn't into Pokemon at the time, and I've never been so glad that I've missed out on a video game before. The reason for this is because imo gen 5 stripped most of the nostalgia away from the game by making almost every previous gen Pokemon not available until so far towards the end/after the main game. And sun and moon seems to have done something similar in that sense to what gen 5 did, except to an even further extent, I'm started to consider canceling my pre-orders.
 
I'm taking a "wait and see" attitude to these games. Fundamentally, the basic gameplay formula hasn't changed in the slightest since the first generation, they've just been taking things out and adding other things in with each generation. With Sun & Moon, they've done the same thing, just in a slightly different way. It might work. It might not. Really, these games aren't hugely different from previous titles; they're still turn-based RPGs. All the changes they've made are just aesthetic ones you'll either like or hate, much the same way each game has a different region, evil team, regional dex, etc. Swapping Gyms for Island Challenges and all the rest is little more than semantics.

I'll play them and judge them on an individual basis, rather than comparing them to past titles and expecting to find certain things in there. That the gameplay is fundamentally the same is enough to convince me to try them before I condemn them as aesthetically inferior to past titles.
 
That's what you hear every generations, not just Pokemon. I've seen practically the same kind of people complaining about every single new generation of games. It's getting old.

Things change. Things have to be updated and added to keep people interested than the same ol' thing.

Spoiler:


I'm just one of the people whom accept whatever comes my way. And if I didn't like it (Like the current Yu-Gi-Oh!), I just ditch them. Simple. Although I don't see myself ditching Pokemon anytime soon, since I've been playing since the first generation and it holds a special meaning to me.

I have to admit I really detested BWB2W2, but no way would you see me complaining. I just simply run through it so I could transfer my Pokemon from previous generations onwards. XY was good, to be honest, and the addition of ORAS helped. I am honestly superbly excited about Sun and Moon. Especially after the leaks in YouTube.
 
If we're going to complain about changing up the formula, let's go all the way. How dare they banish HMs. They were there from the very beginning. It just isn't Pokemon without at least three HM slaves in your party.
 
Zoinkity said:
If we're going to complain about changing up the formula, let's go all the way. How dare they banish HMs. They were there from the very beginning. It just isn't Pokemon without at least three HM slaves in your party.
Click to expand...

Comparing HM moves being removed to gyms being removed is like comparing polishing a turd to polishing a glass table

Pheremosa said:
I'm taking a "wait and see" attitude to these games. Fundamentally, the basic gameplay formula hasn't changed in the slightest since the first generation, they've just been taking things out and adding other things in with each generation. With Sun & Moon, they've done the same thing, just in a slightly different way. It might work. It might not. Really, these games aren't hugely different from previous titles; they're still turn-based RPGs. All the changes they've made are just aesthetic ones you'll either like or hate, much the same way each game has a different region, evil team, regional dex, etc. Swapping Gyms for Island Challenges and all the rest is little more than semantics.

I'll play them and judge them on an individual basis, rather than comparing them to past titles and expecting to find certain things in there. That the gameplay is fundamentally the same is enough to convince me to try them before I condemn them as aesthetically inferior to past titles.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I agree tbh. Changing pretty much the whole goal of the game by defeating gyms and collecting badges to something different isn't changing the formula at all.
 
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If you're concerned that there will be no older Pokemon available to you during the main story like in Black/White, that's not the case in Sun/Moon. The list of Pokemon available during the main story has been leaked, and it contains both old and new Pokemon.
 
Nah said:
If you're concerned that there will be no older Pokemon available to you during the main story like in Black/White, that's not the case in Sun/Moon. The list of Pokemon available during the main story has been leaked, and it contains both old and new Pokemon.
Click to expand...

I didn't mean it would be like gen 5 in the sense that there's no older Pokemon, I meant that its still going to be stripping some (if not most) of the nostalgia out of it, in this case by removing gyms and going complete overkill with all the new stuff.
 
Illusionss said:
Getting rid of gyms and the league is taking a large portion of the concept away, references such as?
Click to expand...

they STILL have Alolan league and even HAVE elite four and champion... just no gyms... BIG DEAL!
 
As Pryce said, just because a region doesn't have Gyms doesn't mean it can't still have an Elite Four and Champion. The league is pretty much something that won't die down, and from what I heard from Ohmori and Masuda's Q&A sessions about the games, the reason Island Trials are substituting Gyms is because they wanted to focus on Alola being a nature-heavy region and the trials allowed the trainer to connect with nature.
 
It's actually a good thing. It will prevent the game from being boring. The trails is going to be fun and it will replace the gyms since we can experience the world with puzzles. The good thing is that the HMs are removed due to the new feature from the Demo, some of the good HMs are now TMs. However, some of the Pokemons really needs some upgrades too.
 
Illusionss said:
The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced that I won't enjoy sun and moon.

I didn't play gen 5 until years after it's release as I wasn't into Pokemon at the time, and I've never been so glad that I've missed out on a video game before. The reason for this is because imo gen 5 stripped most of the nostalgia away from the game by making almost every previous gen Pokemon not available until so far towards the end/after the main game. And sun and moon seems to have done something similar in that sense to what gen 5 did, except to an even further extent, I'm started to consider canceling my pre-orders.
Click to expand...

WOW... you sure whine a lot don't you?
Gen 1 is only pokemon to revcieve new Alolan form
Red and Blue is back.
Professor Oaks Cousin is here.
Not to mention according to leaked pokedex Alola will have various pokemon across generation INCLUDING MANY GEN 1 POKEMON!
WHAT MORE COULD YOU WANT? THERE ARE GEN 1,2,3,4,5,6,7 POKEMONS AND GEN 1 CHARACTERS RETURNING!
Seriously there is no pleasing people... if GF keeps old patterns people will complain every pokemon game is just a clone with improved graphic... and when GF tries something different like in Sun and Moon there are people like you who whine that their childhood is ruined!
 
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