FireRed hack: Zelda: Sacred Paradox (DOWNLOAD)

[machomuu]

Yeah, true, because Link never really fights against other humans anyways unless they're a boss/miniboss. I like that idea, but on the other hand, it may get a bit boring without some sort of trainers... so maybe the triforce of courage can be used, but in some other way? Hmm. This one needs some thinking on. Because I'd like to have sprites for some of the other NPCs to show up in-game at some point, at least for the artistic appeal of the game.... gotta think on both sides of this

Well what I was thinking was that trainers could be just about any enemy, be they field mobs, important characters such as...say, the Twinrova sisters, and bosses. I mean, when it comes down to it, I think it only seems like it would be boring if you confine yourself to the idea of a trainer.

Look at it this way, what is in Pokemon a "Trainer" could be a party of any sort, be they a group of guards, a couple monsters, or even a few boss characters that fight together. They wouldn't really be enemies so much as they would be parties or adversaries, and how fun or interesting they are would really depend on the context in which they're fought, just like in other Turn-Based RPGs.

Plus, assuming the Triforce were to have an effect on the crystals, Ganon and Zelda would be able to use them as well.

 

[Danno]

Well what I was thinking was that trainers could be just about any enemy, be they field mobs, important characters such as...say, the Twinrova sisters, and bosses. I mean, when it comes down to it, I think it only seems like it would be boring if you confine yourself to the idea of a trainer.

Look at it this way, what is in Pokemon a "Trainer" could be a party of any sort, be they a group of guards, a couple monsters, or even a few boss characters that fight together. They wouldn't really be enemies so much as they would be parties or adversaries, and how fun or interesting they are would really depend on the context in which they're fought, just like in other Turn-Based RPGs.

Plus, assuming the Triforce were to have an effect on the crystals, Ganon and Zelda would be able to use them as well.

Great point. I think that's how we'll go about it. Gotta keep some sort of a Zelda feel haha. And on that note, I was thinking... maybe I shouldn't keep the overworlds in the FRLG style at all, maybe I should revamp the old GBC overworlds with more colors? It would definitely change the style, and with the right colors it could be eye popping and nostalgic.

Okay, so I finished Moosh's front sprite. Which do you guys thinks looks better as the shiny variant, the green or the gray?

Or white maybe?

 

[GoldfishHorde]

I would say white, because POLAR BEAR MOOSH FTW.

Also, shouldn't shiny sprites have every color within the palette different, besides for things like eyes? I've noticed that by looking at other shinies, and just wanted to point it out. Although, I'm not complaining with what we got right now.

 

[Danno]

I would say white, because POLAR BEAR MOOSH FTW.

Also, shouldn't shiny sprites have every color within the palette different, besides for things like eyes? I've noticed that by looking at other shinies, and just wanted to point it out. Although, I'm not complaining with what we got right now.

They usually do, yeah, but not always. Besides, we don't really have to go by those rules lol....

EDIT: Though there could be this?

And this is what I meant before:

The middle one is what I was talking about, a revamped GBC Link instead maybe? Also just a concept.

The other overworlds would all be revamped as well, and between Seasons, Ages and Links Awakening there are plenty of characters that could already be there for editing.

EDIT: I might just go with this at least temporarily, unless something else better comes along. Minish Cap sprites are too big

 

[DJTiki]

I can DEFINETLY see these enemies being "pokefied" especially with bosses from Twilight Princess. Argorok for Dragon/Steel with Levitate. I don't know if you would want help in this regard, pretty sure you already have it planned.

Scervo > Dreadfuse.

 

[machomuu]

For Moosh, that's a tough pick. The gray one's my favorite, but it has more of a "variant" feel than a "shiny" one. I really like white, too, but I really think green is probably the way to go.

As for the sprites...ooh. I like the idea of using the revamped GB/C sprites, but that is a nice Pokemon-styled one. I really think the verdict should depend on how the world's tiles are styled. They need to mingle or else one or the other will feel out of place.

 

[GoldfishHorde]

They usually do, yeah, but not always. Besides, we don't really have to go by those rules lol....

And this is what I meant before:

The middle one is what I was talking about, a revamped GBC Link instead maybe? Also just a concept.

I dunno, I'm really liking Oracle Link, but revamped GBC Link doesn't look half bad either. Your call though.

Also if Ricky becomes a Pokemon I will laugh so hard. Fighting/Flying because he can jump high and his Tornado Punch?

Finally, just throwing this out there, what if each town represented an area from each of the games? Not all of these areas have to have temples or whatever, but the routes and areas around them should have Pokemon from those games.

 

[DJTiki]

I dunno, I'm really liking Oracle Link, but revamped GBC Link doesn't look half bad either. Your call though.

Also if Ricky becomes a Pokemon I will laugh so hard. Fighting/Flying because he can jump high and his Tornado Punch?

Finally, just throwing this out there, what if each town represented an area from each of the games? Not all of these areas have to have temples or whatever, but the routes and areas around them should have Pokemon from those games.

I could see various towns being in the game. With Clock Town being the largest one. Kakariko Village has a few incarnations, so you'll have to decide on one. Skyloft would be a weird one, being in the sky and all.

As for the shiny: I like the Gray and Green ones best :) but really can't decide on one.
And for the sprite, the GBC revamp looks fine, but I personally prefer the very right.

 

[Danno]

For Moosh, that's a tough pick. The gray one's my favorite, but it has more of a "variant" feel than a "shiny" one. I really like white, too, but I really think green is probably the way to go.

As for the sprites...ooh. I like the idea of using the revamped GB/C sprites, but that is a nice Pokemon-styled one. I really think the verdict should depend on how the world's tiles are styled. They need to mingle or else one or the other will feel out of place.

I agree, I do like the green... That is a tough pick lol. And the tiles, I'm intending on using revamped GBC tiles and maybe some Minish Cap tiles too, so yeah, I think I'm gonna go with the revamped GBC Link.

Also if Ricky becomes a Pokemon I will laugh so hard. Fighting/Flying because he can jump high and his Tornado Punch?

Finally, just throwing this out there, what if each town represented an area from each of the games? Not all of these areas have to have temples or whatever, but the routes and areas around them should have Pokemon from those games.

Ricky and Dimitri will be made too of course haha. There won't be any trading or battling other players, so who says it has to be balanced? :D :D :D


And on that note about the HMs and key items and stuff, I think I'll have it so you can use an HM at any point in the game, not depending on the badges and such I mean. Being a Zelda game, it'd make more sense this way as you'd need certain items to get yourself further in the game. While in development though, since I know literally 0 scripting or ASM, I'd need to use gameshark to walk through walls to test different maps and such.

I could see various towns being in the game. With Clock Town being the largest one. Kakariko Village has a few incarnations, so you'll have to decide on one. Skyloft would be a weird one, being in the sky and all.

I would love to have Clock Town in here...... so bad. Sure, it's in Termina, but hey, who cares? :D

 

[DJTiki]

I would love to have Clock Town in here...... so bad. Sure, it's in Termina, but hey, who cares? :D

You need to implement a 3-Day time limit system cx. Have the moon crash if you don't beat the Gym Leader(Skull Kid)

 

[Danno]

You need to implement a 3-Day time limit system cx. Have the moon crash if you don't beat the Gym Leader(Skull Kid)

Yeah no I don't think so lol... but there are other ways to go about it for sure. Speaking of the Skull Kid, if you fight him, maybe when he sends out his monsters you have to fight Marjora's Mask, Majora's Incarnation(A little long of a name though...) Majora's Wrath etc? Then maybe after he's defeated and he drops the mask, you obtain it. Then you can choose to evolve it from Majora's Mask to Wrath or not.

The clock tower could be an entire dungeon if done right.

 

[machomuu]

In that case...I actually have something of a very basic idea for a story. It's more of a concept, and it's not completely original.

I'm sure that you're aware of the of the Zelda timelines. You know, the Adult Timeline, the Child Timeline, and, if you follow Nintendo's timeline, the Link Defeated timeline. So what if, the conflict in this game is that the timelines (and places, so that would include Termina) are converging- not for the better, mind you. This would explain characters, places, and items unique to specific games being there, and it would also give you a lot of freedom in choosing not only where you want to add, but what. I imagine that such convergence would lead to paradoxes, contradictions that reality dictates cannot exist. As a result...maybe, should the convergence not be stopped, reality would try to correct itself by writing out the contradictions and effectively erasing the paradox (which wouldn't be good for those involved). Well, the last part is more of an idea for story, but prior to "I imagine" it's mostly what I see as a working concept.

Again, it's not completely original. I think FFVIII did it, a show called Those Who Hunt Elves pulled it last minute and in Inazuma Eleven GO vs Danball Senki W, it's the villain's plot...but I still think it works here. It would create a reason for the game to cross canons without stepping on too many toes and giving you free reign.

 

[DJTiki]

Yeah no I don't think so lol... but there are other ways to go about it for sure. Speaking of the Skull Kid, if you fight him, maybe when he sends out his monsters you have to fight Marjora's Mask, Majora's Incarnation(A little long of a name though...) Majora's Wrath etc? Then maybe after he's defeated and he drops the mask, you obtain it. Then you can choose to evolve it from Majora's Mask to Wrath or not.

The clock tower could be an entire dungeon if done right.

It'd be a cool way to obtain evolutions. HEY, now that I think of it, Majora kkkiiiiinda looks like Deoxys-S in a weird way. Could Majora potentially be another Deoxys? With Mask as standard, Incarnation as Speed, and Wrath as Attack, dropping Defense?

 

[Danno]

In that case...I actually have something of a very basic idea for a story. It's more of a concept, and it's not completely original.

I'm sure that you're aware of the of the Zelda timelines. You know, the Adult Timeline, the Child Timeline, and, if you follow Nintendo's timeline, the Link Defeated timeline. So what if, the conflict in this game is that the timelines (and places, so that would include Termina) are converging- not for the better, mind you. This would explain characters, places, and items unique to specific games being there, and it would also give you a lot of freedom in choosing not only where you want to add, but what. I imagine that such convergence would lead to paradoxes, contradictions that reality dictates cannot exist. As a result...maybe, should the convergence not be stopped, reality would try to correct itself by writing out the contradictions and effectively erasing the paradox (which wouldn't be good for those involved). Well, the last part is more of an idea for story, but prior to "I imagine" it's mostly what I see as a working concept.

Again, it's not completely original. I think FFVIII did it, a show called Those Who Hunt Elves pulled it last minute and in Inazuma Eleven GO vs Danball Senki W, it's the villain's plot...but I still think it works here. It would create a reason for the game to cross canons without stepping on too many toes and giving you free reign.

This is all gold man, lovin' it. That would make Ganondorf have the ability to use classic Ganon against you, and damn, think of it... Vaati, Skull Kid, Zant.... Man.... this could be epic as hell. The possibilities with that.
The thing is, since I'm going with like a HGSS shading style for the sprites, the enemies will all be following that, and it's slightly cartoony looking, as you guys may have noticed with the Oktorok. It also goes pretty well with the art from the Oracle series. But that being said, the other variants of the Oktorok won't be in here, namely the red classic oktoroks that pretty much turned into the modern deku. So if the timelines merge, each monster will still only have 1 look. Doesn't mean that an OOT fairy can't evolve into a Windwaker Great Fairy though.

It'd be a cool way to obtain evolutions. HEY, now that I think of it, Majora kkkiiiiinda looks like Deoxys-S in a weird way. Could Majora potentially be another Deoxys? With Mask as standard, Incarnation as Speed, and Wrath as Attack, dropping Defense?

Maybe, I'm not really concerning myself with how the monsters are setup just yet, but it's definitely worth keeping in mind. I do plan on changing some of the moves, mainly their names and in some cases if I can get the help, the animations, but Deoxys sounds like a pretty good base pokemon for Majora I guess :D

 

[GoldfishHorde]

Perhaps give certains Pokemon that aren't common enemies Pokemon-ish names? Let's go with the Majora Idea, for example.

Maskjora -> Majorvenile -> Majora ?

Just an example.

 

[Danno]

Perhaps give certains Pokemon that aren't common enemies Pokemon-ish names? Let's go with the Majora Idea, for example.

Maskjora -> Majorvenile -> Majora ?

Just an example.

Maybe, we'll need to come up with names anyways for some of the other creatures, especially the ones that are created only to be part of an evolutionary chain. It would solve the issue of the names being too long too.



Moosh's backsprite so far, without the wings:
-withheld, damn that was ugly lmao-


Yeah, it's an edit of Snorlax lol. If it ain't broke don't fix it they always say.

 

[DJTiki]

Technically, you don't need to have Gym Leaders, it could just be a nice Zelda with just some Pokemon concepts and so on and so forth. So maybe not having them in, would be for the better, but rather have the plot if the story, lead you through 8 bosses, and potentially to Hyrule Castle, which could act as the "League".

Zelda's timeline is kind of weird, especially if you are making a game like this. So maybe a celebration of Zelda, with just a heep of enemies from other Zelda games. Disposable items, would be easier to make of, with A.I.E being a thing.

As for dungeons, the theming around that, could very well present the different games. Water dungeon could reperesnt The Great Sea, etc. Secret caves and such is a MUST. Of course, Pokemon moves and such must change, as well as animations. Skyward Sword's enemies, had distinctive theming around enemies, so dreaming them up isn't too hard.

But I do feel, as there will be alot of Steel, Ghost, Psychic, Dark, and Grass types. But that's me.

 

[Danno]

Technically, you don't need to have Gym Leaders, it could just be a nice Zelda with just some Pokemon concepts and so on and so forth. So maybe not having them in, would be for the better, but rather have the plot if the story, lead you through 8 bosses, and potentially to Hyrule Castle, which could act as the "League".

Zelda's timeline is kind of weird, especially if you are making a game like this. So maybe a celebration of Zelda, with just a heep of enemies from other Zelda games. Disposable items, would be easier to make of, with A.I.E being a thing.

As for dungeons, the theming around that, could very well present the different games. Water dungeon could reperesnt The Great Sea, etc. Secret caves and such is a MUST. Of course, Pokemon moves and such must change, as well as animations. Skyward Sword's enemies, had distinctive theming around enemies, so dreaming them up isn't too hard.

But I do feel, as there will be alot of Steel, Ghost, Psychic, Dark, and Grass types. But that's me.

Yeah I covered that gyms thing on the last page, they'll be replaced by the dungeons. After you defeat/obtain the bosses (or maybe both, I also threw out the idea that if you beat certain monsters you'd obtain them anyway) you will get the "spiritual stones" or "medallions" or whatever we come up with, and those could be important for certain other events instead of gym badges, like progressing further in the game. Maybe even having 3 different areas open from the start, but you need to beat the first 3 areas to use the stones/medallions or whatever to progress further like in OOT. Also just an idea.

And yeah, there'll be a lot of those kinds of enemies... but to counter it, you could have others just 'join your party' like the Subrosians I mentioned on the last page.

 

[PokemonMaster1111]

Yeah I covered that gyms thing on the last page, they'll be replaced by the dungeons. After you defeat/obtain the bosses (or maybe both, I also threw out the idea that if you beat certain monsters you'd obtain them anyway) you will get the "spiritual stones" or "medallions" or whatever we come up with, and those could be important for certain other events instead of gym badges, like progressing further in the game. Maybe even having 3 different areas open from the start, but you need to beat the first 3 areas to use the stones/medallions or whatever to progress further like in OOT. Also just an idea.

And yeah, there'll be a lot of those kinds of enemies... but to counter it, you could have others just 'join your party' like the Subrosians I mentioned on the last page.

I like the dungeons idea

 

[machomuu]

Technically, you don't need to have Gym Leaders, it could just be a nice Zelda with just some Pokemon concepts and so on and so forth. So maybe not having them in, would be for the better, but rather have the plot if the story, lead you through 8 bosses, and potentially to Hyrule Castle, which could act as the "League".

Zelda's timeline is kind of weird, especially if you are making a game like this. So maybe a celebration of Zelda, with just a heep of enemies from other Zelda games. Disposable items, would be easier to make of, with A.I.E being a thing.

As for dungeons, the theming around that, could very well present the different games. Water dungeon could reperesnt The Great Sea, etc. Secret caves and such is a MUST. Of course, Pokemon moves and such must change, as well as animations. Skyward Sword's enemies, had distinctive theming around enemies, so dreaming them up isn't too hard.

But I do feel, as there will be alot of Steel, Ghost, Psychic, Dark, and Grass types. But that's me.

There's a lot of equating something from Zelda to something in Pokemon, but really, it doesn't have to be that way. Don't think of this as a Zelda skin of a Pokemon game, think of it as a Zelda game running on a Pokemon engine. Don't try to find the equivalent of something in Zelda to something in the official Pokemon games because, in the end, it only limits the ideas that you'll come up with. If you just think of this as a Zelda game that makes use of Pokemon's engine, it will more fluidly end up feeling like exactly that, but the key is that it will feel like Zelda game and not like a Zelda skin.

For instance, take the idea about using the Castle as a League. If we remove the League from the equation than that just makes the post-8 medallion portion the endgame, which is traditionally semi-nonlinear and can be taken many ways. But if we just see it as "what is the Pokemon League in Pokemon", it will be...well, the Pokemon League from Pokemon, with Zelda.