Community Hack [Discussion]

[PokemonMasters]

What do you ROM Hackers here at PC think about a Community Hack? Like where all of us ROM Hackers here work together to make a fabulous hack? Since we all have something we specialize in, we could make a perfect hack. Fudgey said "That could be an interesting idea (though difficult to implement) and would probably be the largest team ever assembled lol." Which is true. Thoughts on this?

 

[tajaros]

I think Dr.Fuji is right it would be very hard to do since I think many will join and try to help and I think it will make the hack difficult to become a great hack because of the many Ideas of people and some might not get along. Or maybe some will say that they will help but will quit some time around. And it could be abandoned as well like what happened to the other forum's community hack... ;)

 

[Ach7AC]

As the idiom goes, too many chefs spoil the broth.
But it could be interesting. I mean, each of us could create a map and scripts for it, some of us could create custom sprites in order to create a giant hack. Albeit the problem would be the continuity. Some people may be making their maps to hard, while other may be making their maps too easy. So we would need a lot of standardization.

 

[tajaros]

Also to point things out, what's the point?

Isn't a team thread considered a community hack as well? Cause you are looking for people to help you with your hack in a community. People just doesn't go/apply to team threads because they are either lazy or not up to it. And also Ach7AC is right there must be someone leading the team so he/she can put up the hack's standards and it is most likely that you will get newbies to help in this.

 

[Rodriguezjames55]

i love this idea im up for it

 

[Platinum Lucario]

A community hack sounds great and all... but having said that, if there's no director of the ROM hack to organize the storyline or at least put in polls for voting in which ideas to use and stuff every 2 weeks or so... then a community hack won't exactly go as planned and would end up failing to be achieved.

If we were to start a community hack... there needs to be someone in charge of gathering all the ideas from the user's posts and then putting it all into a poll that would go for 2 weeks and one that is most voted would be used in the community hack and the people who are willing to help out with putting into the hack of what was most voted. There would need to be volunteer developers who are willing to accept whatever was most voted to put into the ROM hack.

And that... is the only way of how a community hack would work out properly... so that there's no arguments involved and all things chosen in a vote.

 

[Ninja Caterpie]

The problem with a vote is you end up having at least a portion of people voting for the general coolest thing rather than one that fits with everything else (ie. nobody has vision) and it ends up feeling very stuck-together and not cohesive.

If it were to happen, I would think it would end up just being one guy who actually 'directs' the hack, while the community gives input and makes maps/scripts/sprites/etc.

 

[Deokishisu]

With the general disparity in skill levels, it would not go well.

There's like, noob, respectable, a seemingly gigantic abyss, and then the hackers that actually know their stuff.

Not only that, the fact that ROM hacking in general requires you to be good at a whole bunch of disparate things, someone could be godlike with ASM but their maps look like a toddler put them together. Most new hackers are, frankly, bad at everything and need practice. Including the people who just downloaded Advance Map and XSE would ruin it for sure.

Cutting to the chase, if a community hack happened, the quality would be so horrendously terrible that it wouldn't even be worth looking at.

 

[Lord Varion]

With the general disparity in skill levels, it would not go well.

There's like, noob, respectable, a seemingly gigantic abyss, and then the hackers that actually know their stuff.

Not only that, the fact that ROM hacking in general requires you to be good at a whole bunch of disparate things, someone could be godlike with ASM but their maps look like a toddler put them together. Most new hackers are, frankly, bad at everything and need practice. Including the people who just downloaded Advance Map and XSE would ruin it for sure.

Cutting to the chase, if a community hack happened, the quality would be so horrendously terrible that it wouldn't even be worth looking at.

Well, having a large community working on a project, if someone messes something up, or their share is not up to standard, another member who shares the skills in the same aspect can help boost the quality.

Teamwork, bro.

 

[kj3400]

Maybe make more than one hack then? I don't know, it seems like a lot of people would result in a hack that's all over the place.

 

[Blah]

Organizing the whole thing would be hard, difficult, challenging, not easy (and other words that imply some high level of difficulty).

I've seen something like this in the pixel art section. Where some guy would start off a sprite with a line or something and the each successive spriter would add to it something. It was really interesting to see how some of the sprites came out. Not sure if that anecdote was relevant at all, but it's supposed to be a hint. :D

 

[machomuu]

I don't know if I see it happening. Not because of the trouble it would take to get it organized, but rather because of the INCREDIBLE divide in opinions I could see sprouting up. A divide in opinions will likely make making any sort of headway rather difficult, and there will be a lot of arguing and quitting because of it.

Disregarding that, I don't really think that having such a large team is a good idea unless we voted on several heads of development, because there has to be at least one head or the hack would become disjointed and disorganized, and there has to be several to manage such a large team.

This is not to say that it wouldn't be possible, it certainly would be, but it would be quite the task to make, let alone to simply plan and put together.

 

[NarutoActor]

See the problem is democracy. One person just needs to take charge and be the directer. Allocate a group of link minded people to make a storyline, a group of sprite artiest with similar talents, a group of mappers with similar styles, and bring it all together. I think unlike most people, that this can be done. The way it can be done is similar to how real games are made, where the directer sais do a Map this way, if you don't like it leave. This may seem harsh, but it will yield the best result.

 

[Blah]

See the problem is democracy. One person just needs to take charge and be the directer. Allocate a group of link minded people to make a storyline, a group of sprite artiest with similar talents, a group of mappers with similar styles, and bring it all together. I think unlike most people, that this can be done. The way it can be done is similar to how real games are made, where the directer sais do a Map this way, if you don't like it leave. This may seem harsh, but it will yield the best result.

That would imply less skilled hackers have no part in it, or at least next to nothing.

 

[karatekid552]

That would imply less skilled hackers have no part in it, or at least next to nothing.

Not necesarily, they could vote and help decide. Also, we could use it as teaching tool for young hackers. We could asign them to write the basic scripts and then as we see them getting better and better, they get tougher and tougher assignments. If they don't like their jobs, we find someone else. Maybe, an experienced scripter is paired with a beginner. They work together and the younger (in terms of experience) can learn under the older one.

But then again, everyone could end up hating each other:). This could bring us all together or it could tear us apart. But if everyone is only in it to make a hack by everyone and nobody's in it just for their name in the credits, then we shouldn't have a problem.

 

[NarutoActor]

That would imply less skilled hackers have no part in it, or at least next to nothing.

And that is how it should be! Why would you want unskilled hackers working on the hack? That makes no sence, that is like a company hiring unskilled workers just because they live in the area.

I am just giving the outline for the highest yield in quality and success. If this is to be a success though decisions half to be made. Contrary to popular belief, everyone opinion. . . does not matter.

 

[machomuu]

Not necesarily, they could vote and help decide. Also, we could use it as teaching tool for young hackers. We could asign them to write the basic scripts and then as we see them getting better and better, they get tougher and tougher assignments. If they don't like their jobs, we find someone else. Maybe, an experienced scripter is paired with a beginner. They work together and the younger (in terms of experience) can learn under the older one.

But then again, everyone could end up hating each other:). This could bring us all together or it could tear us apart. But if everyone is only in it to make a hack by everyone and nobody's in it just for their name in the credits, then we shouldn't have a problem.

This seems like an efficient way to go about the hack. It would not only increase productivity rates, but it would also increase the skill and give experience to many new or inexperienced hackers. I could see some ragequiting here and there, but otherwise it seems pretty efficient.

It's also a great way to include the entire community without hindering the project in the process.

 

[DrFuji]

If we leave out new hackers then it would boil down to handful of all-stars working under the guise of a 'community'. That's not how it works.

I agree that there should be some sort of quality control and a system of hierarchy if something like this ever eventuates, and the idea of veterans helping out new members sounds incredibly enticing. It sort of reminds me of workshop threads in the past where people came together for the good of helping others through mentoring and problem solving. Regardless, in my opinion it should live up to both the name and standards of a community project.

 

[BlitŻ1]

Take advice from experience developers in other computer related fields and make the first goal as a community to create a revision control system, more commonly referred to as a VCS. Be it anything from Github to dropbox, it is very important for all those contributing to be regulated, monitored, and have a easy to see history of changes that contributors made.

 

[Blah]

And that is how it should be! Why would you want unskilled hackers working on the hack? That makes no sence, that is like a company hiring unskilled workers just because they live in the area.

I am just giving the outline for the highest yield in quality and success. If this is to be a success though decisions half to be made. Contrary to popular belief, everyone opinion. . . does not matter.

Because I don't just wanna sit there and watch it all happen. I'm a man of involving nature.

If we leave out new hackers then it would boil down to handful of all-stars working under the guise of a 'community'. That's not how it works.

I agree that there should be some sort of quality control and a system of hierarchy if something like this ever eventuates, and the idea of veterans helping out new members sounds incredibly enticing. It sort of reminds me of workshop threads in the past where people came together for the good of helping others through mentoring and problem solving. Regardless, in my opinion it should live up to both the name and standards of a community project.

I agree, someone must dedicate their time to this project and not let it be just some side thing. Another fairly important detail that I'd like to add is story line. I suggest having a solid story line and a pseudo event line planned out. That way when people add to it, they won't just blindly be adding random events/event sequences that make no sense and everyone won't be making a "main" rival named after themselves.

Graphics such as tiles should be left out for the beginning since everyone's opinions differ. We should change that up later if people feel it's really taking away.

That being said, a nomination must be made for the "leader" of this project through a community vote out of a group of individuals who have volunteered for the job (or we can let Pokemon masters do it for coming up with the idea, though it's not original). Maybe at the end everyone who participated can have a nice shiny emblem and a mention in the credits for some incentive :D?