Do you think the writers and the (dub) actors are incompetent?

[yadon]

I can see why someone thinks that, but then again I'm completely happy with the incompetency of both the writers and VAs. Maybe I'm jaded by the fact that Pokemon has such a nostalgia hold over me, but whatever reason I appreciate it for what it is and don't read too much into it or give it's faults too much thought. I know that sounds crazy, but it makes me happy and Pokemon certainly isn't a serious matter, so I suppose it's perfectly fine to turn a blind eye to the problems with it.

I will not when I want serious anime I usually dabble into things like PMMM. Pokemon to me means mindless fun. No offense to anyone.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

I can see why someone thinks that, but then again I'm completely happy with the incompetency of both the writers and VAs. Maybe I'm jaded by the fact that Pokemon has such a nostalgia hold over me, but whatever reason I appreciate it for what it is and don't read too much into it or give it's faults too much thought. I know that sounds crazy, but it makes me happy and Pokemon certainly isn't a serious matter, so I suppose it's perfectly fine to turn a blind eye to the problems with it.

I will not when I want serious anime I usually dabble into things like PMMM. Pokemon to me means mindless fun. No offense to anyone.

Hey, I at least am not advocating making it about as serious as Batman, but Pokémon really cannot be about mindless fun either, especially when Ash and Pikachu are still the main focus and they still have a goal that, you know, implies progression and an actual point. If you want mindless fun, I suggest you watch something like Bugs Bunny, since that doesn't have any overarching goals, and literally is mindless fun.

 

[Famon]

I never said Pokemon has to be serious Because I want Pokemon to be as or more hilarious then the Original series.
However Humilating Ash didn't made BW series funny ! Hack it didn't even catch up to the Original series.
To be Honest , Ash wasn't even like a Real Kid. He was like a Bad actor overacting as a Kid .
That what Ash currently is now !
I never said Ash to be Mature ! He's a 10 year old Boy , He supposed to be immature and doing silly stuff ! I simply want Ash to be smart & Competent.
However , The writer doesn't know the difference between Being an Idiot and Doing silly stuff .
For example : Luffy (One piece) & Goku (DBZ) does a lot of silly thing But they does use their brain at right time .
Even PokeSpe's Arthur Kusaka get that ! Thats why he manage to create character like Gold , Red , Dia & Black.
Truth is , Ash & his friends need to do a lot of silly stuff and the series need a character who will get angry at their silly action and deliver hilarious Punchline with Hilarious reaction.
For example : Ash , Serena & Bonnie are super supportive of Clemont invention and doesn't say anything when it fail . Bonnie just give a sigh if a invention failed .
THAT WHAT MAKE IT BORING !
What really need to happen is Ash , Serena & Bonnie being doubtful of Clemont's invention and deliver punchline when it fails .
Also , I surprise to see Nobody ever asking Clemont ''Where do you keep those stuff''.

May be Ash being Supportive of Clemont Invention was needed for bonding however the Series should handled it differently . Like this-

(After an invention failed )

Clemont : I guess My invention are a failure ! You think that as well , right Ash .

(Ash sit beside Clemont)

Ash : You know ! A lot of people waste their whole life trying to invent one thing . But you keep inventing different machine over & over no matter how much it fails . I think that admirable .

(Clemont look at Ash with team in his eye)

Clemont : Ash

(Ash smiles )

Ash : So never give up ! Okay .

Clemont : You know , I also made this helmet that give you Psychic Power ! Wanna try ?

Ash : NEVER IN A MILLION YEAR !

 

[OminousFlare]

Long-ass debates that are tl;dr aside, Detective Conan, Naruto, One Piece, Bleach, and pretty much hundreds of shounen anime out there shared the same syndrome - and I don't see a major problem with it. If you don't like it, don't watch it. It's simple. It's like watching a bunch of teenagers complaining about Twilight all year long even though they hate it so much.

Also, long-ass debates aside, I caught mentioning of not treating the anime as separate shows, but as one gigantic show... Yeah, that's a foolish thought, considering that with every Japanese season (OS and AG as two separate seasons rather than eight seasons) was a revamp to introduce Pokemon to the new generation. Hell, it was even stated in the season two title, "Advanced GENERATION." Naturally, Satoshi is going to make the same ol' mistakes again, and also bringing up his Pokedex upon Pokemon that he had previously seen in previous seasons. It's a gimmick, live with it. Otherwise, don't watch it and shut up. Please, for the sake of everyone.

Also, don't go crying about the anime not being faithful to the games - again, for the hundredth time. The anime writers didn't write the show for you. You are not their targeted audience. So if you want to nitpick every single detail about how Satoshi is a far more inferior trainer than Overrated Red, then go ahead, but I assure you that it won't mean s*** to the writers, and the anime you hated so much would continue on and on till kids and children are no longer a part of reality.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

Long-ass debates that are tl;dr aside, Detective Conan, Naruto, One Piece, Bleach, and pretty much hundreds of shounen anime out there shared the same syndrome - and I don't see a major problem with it. If you don't like it, don't watch it. It's simple. It's like watching a bunch of teenagers complaining about Twilight all year long even though they hate it so much.

Also, long-ass debates aside, I caught mentioning of not treating the anime as separate shows, but as one gigantic show... Yeah, that's a foolish thought, considering that with every Japanese season (OS and AG as two separate seasons rather than eight seasons) was a revamp to introduce Pokemon to the new generation. Hell, it was even stated in the season two title, "Advanced GENERATION." Naturally, Satoshi is going to make the same ol' mistakes again, and also bringing up his Pokedex upon Pokemon that he had previously seen in previous seasons. It's a gimmick, live with it. Otherwise, don't watch it and shut up. Please, for the sake of everyone.

Also, don't go crying about the anime not being faithful to the games - again, for the hundredth time. The anime writers didn't write the show for you. You are not their targeted audience. So if you want to nitpick every single detail about how Satoshi is a far more inferior trainer than Overrated Red, then go ahead, but I assure you that it won't mean s*** to the writers, and the anime you hated so much would continue on and on till kids and children are no longer a part of reality.

I don't even watch Pokémon anymore as it is. Even if I still had cable, there's no way in heck I'm watching it after the frankly disastrous methods they did. So yes, I am doing exactly what you are telling us we should do.

And BTW, Pokémon is not a "separate show" when Ash is still the main character and the actual focus, regardless of how Japan does things. You want a different show, try the Original Star Trek and Star Trek: The Next Generation. Those have completely different casts, not to mention are set in a time distance long enough that with the possible exception of Spock, none of the original members of the cast can actually appear in person. Either that, or actually HAVE Ash grow up.

And showing off new Pokémon or not, the plotline is still that he win a league and become a Pokémon Master, which implies an adherence to a strict continuity system, yet they don't even do that well.

And about not showing things from the games, I can tolerate some elements being removed, such as electric types being unable to damage Onix, for example. But when they've actually removed a lot of things that actually have a lot of plot potential that actually ARE from the games, such as the World Conference in BW2, yes, that is indeed something bad. It's also for that reason why people found it bad how the Plasma arc was treated, even cancelling a potential two-parter, not because of an earthquake, but literally because of BW2.

 

[Lizardo]

Whether or not something counts as a different show (or movie) depends strictly on what the people said show market it as, not subjective criteria. OS, AG, DP, BW, and XY are marketed as separate series that share one timeline in Japan, so I think that's really how they should be approached, regardless of what we think of Satoshi's journey. Moreover, like the games the anime franchise adapts, each series centers around a single formula that's told in a different way. While Satoshi aims to get to the Pokémon League each time, the nature of his journey is always different. There are new characters, rivals (or lack thereof), villains, and - most importantly - new Pokémon to interact with each time.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

Whether or not something counts as a different show (or movie) depends strictly on what the people said show market it as, not subjective criteria. OS, AG, DP, BW, and XY are marketed as separate series that share one timeline in Japan, so I think that's really how they should be approached, regardless of what we think of Satoshi's journey. Moreover, like the games the anime franchise adapts, each series centers around a single formula that's told in a different way. While Satoshi aims to get to the Pokémon League each time, the nature of his journey is always different. There are new characters, rivals (or lack thereof), villains, and - most importantly - new Pokémon to interact with each time.

Yes, except they should have removed Ash and used a completely different character each time to get the desired effect. When a show has an ongoing continuous point (such as Ash trying to become a Pokémon Master, the world's greatest, in fact), there needs to be an actual point, and thus actually depicting him taking the goal very seriously. The only ones of the five "series" so far to actually have him doing such is the OS (since he does improve in Johto) and DP. AG and BW stank precisely because he didn't improve, and XY is still in the gray area right now.

And Batman Begins and the Dark Knight are two different movies, yet they definitely share a lot of continuity, definitely a lot more than the various Pokémon series do for each other.

 

[OminousFlare]

I don't even watch Pokémon anymore as it is. Even if I still had cable, there's no way in heck I'm watching it after the frankly disastrous methods they did. So yes, I am doing exactly what you are telling us we should do.

Good. Now quit *****ing and shut up, Trekkie.

And BTW, Pokémon is not a "separate show" when Ash is still the main character and the actual focus, regardless of how Japan does things. You want a different show, try the Original Star Trek and Star Trek: The Next Generation. Those have completely different casts, not to mention are set in a time distance long enough that with the possible exception of Spock, none of the original members of the cast can actually appear in person. Either that, or actually HAVE Ash grow up.

Regardless of your pointless analogy about Star Trek (we all know Wars is better and cooler, not to mention more badass), Japan treated each season as a different show, evidenced by the clip show recaps they showed with each season, not to mention their pandering to younger audiences rather than mature ones. You complaining about this makes little sense, merely setting an example of plain butt-hurt. That is also why you don't see older casts reappearing in much newer seasons (such as Kasumi) because the Japan team understands that the generation they are pandering to won't understand such references. It's a cheap marketing scheme, sure, but an effective one, evidenced by the longevity of the anime.

And showing off new Pokémon or not, the plotline is still that he win a league and become a Pokémon Master, which implies an adherence to a strict continuity system, yet they don't even do that well.

Wrong. He aspires to win several leagues with each season, not just one league. Each league panders to a different generation, so your example merely contributed to my argument. This is also why Satoshi never wins a league, because they are using the same "winning isn't everything" formula on a brand new generation of children (being an educational message of such). Again, it's a gimmick. You either live with it or shut up.

And about not showing things from the games, I can tolerate some elements being removed, such as electric types being unable to damage Onix, for example. But when they've actually removed a lot of things that actually have a lot of plot potential that actually ARE from the games, such as the World Conference in BW2, yes, that is indeed something bad. It's also for that reason why people found it bad how the Plasma arc was treated, even cancelling a potential two-parter, not because of an earthquake, but literally because of BW2.

I haven't watched B/W yet, so I'd just assume you're right (considering that I've heard similar rumors). And yet again, this has nothing to do with the games, aside from butthurt gamers *****ing about. This anime is a business meant to target at naive children who don't give a damn about such nerdy subjects. If it's not your taste, then **** off.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

Good. Now quit *****ing and shut up, Trekkie.


Regardless of your pointless analogy about Star Trek (we all know Wars is better and cooler, not to mention more badass), Japan treated each season as a different show, evidenced by the clip show recaps they showed with each season, not to mention their pandering to younger audiences rather than mature ones. You complaining about this makes little sense, merely setting an example of plain butt-hurt. That is also why you don't see older casts reappearing in much newer seasons (such as Kasumi) because the Japan team understands that the generation they are pandering to won't understand such references. It's a cheap marketing scheme, sure, but an effective one, evidenced by the longevity of the anime.

If they didn't understand such references, they wouldn't release boxed sets or do reruns at all, "keep circulating the tapes" in other words, yet the fact that they do clearly demonstrates that to be false.

And BTW, I'm a Star Wars fan as well, probably moreso than a Star Trek Fan. Guess what? It STILL had a different cast between the Original Trilogy and Prequel Trilogy (Luke and Leia don't even appear until Episode III, and even then only at the very end).

Wrong. He aspires to win several leagues with each season, not just one league. Each league panders to a different generation, so your example merely contributed to my argument. This is also why Satoshi never wins a league, because they are using the same "winning isn't everything" formula on a brand new generation of children (being an educational message of such). Again, it's a gimmick. You either live with it or shut up.

Ash specifically stated his goal is to become a Pokémon Master, EACH Season/Series. DP even made clear that it was to win a league, not just by actually winning first place, but also taking out the Elite 4 and champion of THAT region. When you have a goal, you have to accomplish it, pure and simple, as otherwise there's no point to even following the show, and kids are being driven away from it even in Japan. You want a show with an actual educational message? Try Barney and Friends, or Arthur, or any of those things, at least they don't have an overarching goal that involves actually trying to be the best with an actual unambiguous endgoal, unlike Pokémon.

I haven't watched B/W yet, so I'd just assume you're right (considering that I've heard similar rumors). And yet again, this has nothing to do with the games, aside from butthurt gamers *****ing about. This anime is a business meant to target at naive children who don't give a damn about such nerdy subjects. If it's not your taste, then **** off.

In case you've forgotten, AG actually relocated the Battle Frontier to Kanto and made a whole arc on it. If they could do it there, they most certainly can do it with Best Wishes and the World Conference arc. And considering the point of the anime is to advertise the games, yes, they are in fact OBLIGATED to use it, especially when they already ruined Ash's character by making him a complete dummy in that series for a poorly-thought-out "clean slate." Oh, and when one of the people complaining about how the show is being done includes even a former showrunner (ie, Takeshi Shudo, who even regrets removing Misty as well), yes, they definitely messed up very badly.

 

[OminousFlare]

If they didn't understand such references, they wouldn't release boxed sets or do reruns at all, yet the fact that they do clearly demonstrates that to be false.

And BTW, I'm a Star Wars fan as well, probably moreso than a Star Trek Fan. Guess what? It STILL had a different cast between the Original Trilogy and Prequel Trilogy (Luke and Leia don't even appear until Episode III, and even then only at the very end).

DVDs and reruns are for the nostalgia-freaks then, while the main series is for the new gen kids. Furthermore, Star Wars is a totally different franchise altogether. Star Wars is a global sensation, while the Pokemon anime is clearly a Japanese-centric show with all its cultural references and Prof. Oak Senryu.

Seriously, you've gotta think of this in a marketing way. As much as I understand the criticisms towards the writers' merits as writers, it's kinda pointless to whine about a business franchise effectively making loads of money. People complain about Transformers movies all day long, and Michael Bay is still making movies.

Ash specifically stated his goal is to become a Pokémon Master, EACH Season/Series. When you have a goal, you have to accomplish it, pure and simple, as otherwise there's no point to even following the show, and kids are being driven away from it even in Japan. You want a show with an actual educational message? Try Barney and Friends, or Arthur, or any of those things, at least they don't have an overarching goal, unlike Pokémon.

An overarching goal that has little bearing or significant impact on the show? I'd say that's a marketable material for the kids. Run a gimmick, kids enjoy it, repeat the process, profit.

And besides, it's better that Satoshi doesn't become a Pokemon Master. God knows the kind of influence the show would have on children if Japan decides to take that "Gotta Catch'em All" mentality seriously. Next thing you know, children will be running around trying to be "Pokemon Masters". This is almost as disturbing as the fanatical idea that Pokemon exists in real life.

In case you've forgotten, AG actually relocated the Battle Frontier to Kanto and made a whole arc on it. If they could do it there, they most certainly can do it with Best Wishes and the World Conference arc. And considering the point of the anime is to advertise the games, yes, they are in fact OBLIGATED to use it, especially when they already ruined Ash's character by making him a complete dummy in that series for a poorly-thought-out "clean slate."

Hah! My fat Aunt Annie ass like hell it is! Obligated? You must be new to adapted materials. Welcome to the adult world of "we adapt it and make tons of money off you".

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

DVDs and reruns are for the nostalgia-freaks then, while the main series is for the new gen kids. Furthermore, Star Wars is a totally different franchise altogether. Star Wars is a global sensation, while the Pokemon anime is clearly a Japanese-centric show with all its cultural references and Prof. Oak Senryu.

Seriously, you've gotta think of this in a marketing way. As much as I understand the criticisms towards the writers' merits as writers, it's kinda pointless to whine about a business franchise effectively making loads of money. People complain about Transformers movies all day long, and Michael Bay is still making movies.

I AM familiar with marketing stuff, actually. I have an uncle and an aunt who teach advertising and is an advertising agent, respectively, and I've also gone through economics and public speaking courses as well, not to mention have actually experienced production of a commercial first hand by my aunt inviting my mom and I to actually watch a commercial being filmed.

And BTW, I brought up Star Wars because you did. And if they were simply money driven, they'd go further to alienate the older fans to cater solely to the new crop than they already have by, you know, not doing ANY reruns or DVD releases at all, basically Orwellian-based retgonning any prior series.

An overarching goal that has little bearing or significant impact on the show? I'd say that's a marketable material for the kids. Run a gimmick, kids enjoy it, repeat the process, profit.

And besides, it's better that Satoshi doesn't become a Pokemon Master. God knows the kind of influence the show would have on children if Japan decides to take that "Gotta Catch'em All" mentality seriously. Next thing you know, children will be running around trying to be "Pokemon Masters". This is almost as disturbing as the fanatical idea that Pokemon exists in real life.

When it pretty much forms the backbones of the entire plot of each series, yes, it definitely is significant. Heck, Dragon Ball had the tournaments actually be significant (heck, the ending of Dragon Ball even had Goku actually winning a tournament. I'm talking original Dragon Ball here, not Z or GT.).

And as far as your comment about Pokémon Master, actually, the show makes clear that becoming a Pokémon Master doesn't mean catching every Pokémon known to man. Heck, if anything, Gary had 200 Pokémon by the Indigo League (and that's likely not even counting Legendaries), yet he didn't even achieve the rank of Pokémon Master at all (he did worse than Ash in the Indigo League, even with going for ten badges, not to mention got beaten by him in Johto and actually gave up the training profession in favor of following his grandpa's footsteps afterwards). It all has to do with actual, utter, pure strength and skill, which can only be demonstrated at the leagues. Heck, that was even spelled out in DP as well, to say nothing about how Mewtwo was actually considered the World's Greatest Pokémon Master in the first movie (and considering how he had been utterly unbeatable in combat in Movie 1, he definitely proved his claim very well if you ask me).

Hah! My fat Aunt Annie ass like hell it is! Obligated? You must be new to adapted materials. Welcome to the adult world of "we adapt it and make tons of money off you".

I'm not new to it, actually. I've seen a few Disney adaptations of Fairy Tales, and Dragon Ball itself was adapted from Journey to the West. That's not even getting into some DC Animated adaptations of certain comic books that I've at the very least read up on, and have watched the Harry Potter film adaptations as well as read the actual books, watched the Lord of the Rings Trilogy, and have watched the first three Narnia movies, and read the first book in full.

And considering the anime is explicitly considered an advertising agent of the games, especially now with the likes of AG, DP, and even BW and XY (and BTW, Takeshi Shudo made clear he didn't intend for the anime to be an advertising wheel for the games, but just an adaptation of the games), yes, trying to include as much of the games as possible is indeed very much necessary and an actual obligation. Otherwise they'd be sued for false advertising.

 

[OminousFlare]

I AM familiar with marketing stuff, actually. I have an uncle and an aunt who teach advertising and is an advertising agent, respectively, and I've also gone through economics and public speaking courses as well, not to mention have actually experienced production of a commercial first hand by my aunt inviting my mom and I to actually watch a commercial being filmed.

And BTW, I brought up Star Wars because you did. And if they were simply money driven, they'd go further to alienate the older fans to cater solely to the new crop than they already have by, you know, not doing ANY reruns or DVD releases at all, basically Orwellian-based retgonning any prior series.

I guess. Still, this seem to be digressing off our original discussion... which was what again? Something to do with the anime being separate shows? Now it's turned into a discussion of the profitability of the show?

Anyway, back to the original point. Considering the numerous signs and evidence amidst the anime that clearly showed that the targeted audience are newgenners, this subject can come to a close.

When it pretty much forms the backbones of the entire plot of each series, yes, it definitely is significant. Heck, Dragon Ball had the tournaments actually be significant (heck, the ending of Dragon Ball even had Goku actually winning a tournament. I'm talking original Dragon Ball here, not Z or GT.).

And as far as your comment about Pokémon Master, actually, the show makes clear that becoming a Pokémon Master doesn't mean catching every Pokémon known to man. Heck, if anything, Gary had 200 Pokémon by the Indigo League (and that's likely not even counting Legendaries), yet he didn't even achieve the rank of Pokémon Master at all (he did worse than Ash in the Indigo League, even with going for ten badges, not to mention got beaten by him in Johto and actually gave up the training profession in favor of following his grandpa's footsteps afterwards). It all has to do with actual, utter, pure strength and skill, which can only be demonstrated at the leagues. Heck, that was even spelled out in DP as well, to say nothing about how Mewtwo was actually considered the World's Greatest Pokémon Master in the first movie (and considering how he had been utterly unbeatable in combat in Movie 1, he definitely proved his claim very well if you ask me).

Still doesn't change the fact that Satoshi not being a Pokemon Master doesn't stop the show from continuing. As long as the plot is not affected (or rather, the profit of the anime is not affected), I don't see how it is a significant factor. Like I said, repeat process and rake in profits.

Otherwise they'd be sued for false advertising.

And yet they weren't so... your point is?

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

I guess. Still, this seem to be digressing off our original discussion... which was what again? Something to do with the anime being separate shows? Now it's turned into a discussion of the profitability of the show?

Anyway, back to the original point. Considering the numerous signs and evidence amidst the anime that clearly showed that the targeted audience are newgenners, this subject can come to a close.


Still doesn't change the fact that Satoshi not being a Pokemon Master doesn't stop the show from continuing. As long as the plot is not affected (or rather, the profit of the anime is not affected), I don't see how it is a significant factor. Like I said, repeat process and rake in profits.


And yet they weren't so... your point is?

First of all, no, the anime is actually LOSING profits and ratings. Just compare the ratings of that Ponyta episode from Kanto (you know, the one where Ash has to participate in a race?) with the Pike Queen Lucy episode (which at the time it aired had the lowest ratings of ANY Pokémon episode, and it's undoubtedly gotten even lower, especially with the turnout of BW.).

Second of all, Ash not actually meeting the goal or even getting closer to actually achieving it in the case of BW is in fact harming the show.

Third of all, it still doesn't work. Heck, BW is actually cited as being one of the worst anime series of all time by various people, and it's telling when XY actually has to avoid the type of things that BW was made of, even having Team Rocket regress back to some comic relief, as well as actually depicting Ash as someone who actually knows what he is doing. Not to mention how messily they dealt with Team Plasma.

And just because they're getting profits doesn't mean they're actually doing a good job. Barack Obama ended up winning reelection, even though he pretty obviously was doing a terrible job running the country (huge unemployment numbers, several scandals in political office including the IRS Scandal and Benghazi, and the like). And BTW, Love Hina also did fairly well with its cash flow, to such an extent that it was abruptly cancelled specifically because it actually lost money unexpectedly.

 

[OminousFlare]

First of all, no, the anime is actually LOSING profits and ratings. Just compare the ratings of that Ponyta episode from Kanto (you know, the one where Ash has to participate in a race?) with the Pike Queen Lucy episode (which at the time it aired had the lowest ratings of ANY Pokémon episode, and it's undoubtedly gotten even lower, especially with the turnout of BW.).

Second of all, Ash not actually meeting the goal or even getting closer to actually achieving it in the case of BW is in fact harming the show.

Third of all, it still doesn't work. Heck, BW is actually cited as being one of the worst anime series of all time by various people, and it's telling when XY actually has to avoid the type of things that BW was made of, even having Team Rocket regress back to some comic relief, as well as actually depicting Ash as someone who actually knows what he is doing. Not to mention how messily they dealt with Team Plasma.

And just because they're getting profits doesn't mean they're actually doing a good job. Barack Obama ended up winning reelection, even though he pretty obviously was doing a terrible job running the country (huge unemployment numbers, several scandals in political office including the IRS Scandal and Benghazi, and the like). And BTW, Love Hina also did fairly well with its cash flow, to such an extent that it was abruptly cancelled specifically because it actually lost money unexpectedly.

True as that may be, whether if the nature of the anime has to do with the profitability of it is subjective. Pokemon is profitable until BW, yes? That means it's profitable for four seasons at least (or 10-12 seasons in America). One season's failure doesn't mean much in the big picture. Many other anime have fared far worse and still managed to sell by the end of the day.

So really, in the end, the only one saddened by this is you, the viewers.

That said, I haven't actually gotten to BW, as I previously stated, so I wouldn't know how bad it is. I've heard several things, and the racial undertones of including a black girl for a BLACK and WHITE adaptation does seem pretty fishy, but I guess I'll just have to find out for myself eventually. Diamond and Pearl does seem to be the anime's strongest season yet.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

True as that may be, whether if the nature of the anime has to do with the profitability of it is subjective. Pokemon is profitable until BW, yes? That means it's profitable for four seasons at least (or 10-12 seasons in America). One season's failure doesn't mean much in the big picture. Many other anime have fared far worse and still managed to sell by the end of the day.

So really, in the end, the only one saddened by this is you, the viewers.

That said, I haven't actually gotten to BW, as I previously stated, so I wouldn't know how bad it is. I've heard several things, and the racial undertones of including a black girl for a BLACK and WHITE adaptation does seem pretty fishy, but I guess I'll just have to find out for myself eventually. Diamond and Pearl does seem to be the anime's strongest season yet.

Love Hina was also profitable, look what happened to its anime adaptation. Got cancelled before the second arc in an abrupt manner because it unexpectedly lost money.

And BTW, Takeshi Shudo actually made very big complaints in his blog about how the anime is actually doing terribly before his death a few years back. You can even read up on them on Bulbanews. I even posted a link. That's also not getting into complaints by Misty and Meowth's VAs about how the show is currently doing.

And when the production staff actually view some of the things going on in the Anime as being badly done, that is BAD news, period, even without the viewers (which, BTW, the audience is shrinking as well. Had I been in their position, I'd be in full panic mode right now.).

And I'll give you a good idea how bad BW is: Ash came across as so stupid and idiotic in his actions that even Indigo Ash seemed smarter than him, he lost to a Snivly whose trainer was literally just starting out, Team Plasma was utterly butchered with their story arc, and with the actual league, Ash actually managed to do WORSE than before (ending in Top 8, instead of actually increasing to Top 2, heck, even just maintaining Top 4).

 

[OminousFlare]

Love Hina was also profitable, look what happened to its anime adaptation. Got cancelled before the second arc in an abrupt manner because it unexpectedly lost money.

And BTW, Takeshi Shudo actually made very big complaints in his blog about how the anime is actually doing terribly before his death a few years back. You can even read up on them on Bulbanews. I even posted a link. That's also not getting into complaints by Misty and Meowth's VAs about how the show is currently doing.

And when were these quotes taken, exactly? In terms of the seasons' release dates in both Japan and America? I'd be surprised if this occurred during D/P, which as I said, is the best season as of yet.

And I'll give you a good idea how bad BW is: Ash came across as so stupid and idiotic in his actions that even Indigo Ash seemed smarter than him, he lost to a Snivly whose trainer was literally just starting out, Team Plasma was utterly butchered with their story arc, and with the actual league, Ash actually managed to do WORSE than before (ending in Top 8, instead of actually increasing to Top 2, heck, even just maintaining Top 4).

Yeah, definitely smells like a reboot. Ah well. All franchises go through this, even the good ones. It's hardly surprising. It's the natural order, really.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

And when were these quotes taken, exactly? In terms of the seasons' release dates in both Japan and America? I'd be surprised if this occurred during D/P, which as I said, is the best season as of yet.


Yeah, definitely smells like a reboot. Ah well. All franchises go through this, even the good ones. It's hardly surprising. It's the natural order, really.

Here's a link: https://bulbanews.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Bulbagraphic:Translating_the_Blog_Entries_of_Mr._Shudo

And it was from 2005-2010.

And also, a true reboot would ensure the ENTIRE CAST is replaced. In other words, Ash wouldn't even be there at all, and we'd have the main characters from BW in his place. You want a true reboot? Look at PokeSpecial or Star Trek: The Next Generation, where pretty much the entire cast was replaced.

 

[OminousFlare]

Here's a link: https://bulbanews.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Bulbagraphic:Translating_the_Blog_Entries_of_Mr._Shudo

And it was from 2005-2010.

So which was it? Because you know there's a significant difference between Advanced Generation Battle Frontier arc and D/P itself, right?

And also, a true reboot would ensure the ENTIRE CAST is replaced. In other words, Ash wouldn't even be there at all, and we'd have the main characters from BW in his place. You want a true reboot? Look at PokeSpecial or Star Trek: The Next Generation, where pretty much the entire cast was replaced.

Now you're just playing with semantics. A "true" reboot? Give me a break. Satoshi is an empty vessel to sail the kids' ratings to the creators, that is all. Whether if he's replaced or not is irrelevant, as his entire personality and abilities were clearly replaced or reset anyway by B/W, so he might as well have been a new character.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

So which was it? Because you know there's a significant difference between Advanced Generation Battle Frontier arc and D/P itself, right?

Considering 2010 was pretty much nearing the end of DP, yes, it still applies.

And BTW, he was talking about both.

Now you're just playing with semantics. A "true" reboot? Give me a break. Satoshi is an empty vessel to sail the kids' ratings to the creators, that is all. Whether if he's replaced or not is irrelevant, as his entire personality and abilities were clearly replaced or reset anyway by B/W, so he might as well have been a new character.

Considering they reference his past rankings in the leagues, and have his Pokémon appear in the leagues, yes, it is indeed relevant to actually replace him. And BTW, had I been the writers, then regardless of whether Ash was an "empty vessel", I'd still replace him anyways come BW, knowing the kids will lap up a new character all the same.

 

[OminousFlare]

Considering 2010 was pretty much nearing the end of DP, yes, it still applies.

And BTW, he was talking about both.

Then he would have had poor tastes then. I enjoyed AG and D/P a lot, even the Frontier battles. No, especially the Frontier battles. Regi Trio, anyone?

Considering they reference his past rankings in the leagues, and have his Pokémon appear in the leagues, yes, it is indeed relevant to actually replace him. And BTW, had I been the writers, then regardless of whether Ash was an "empty vessel", I'd still replace him anyways come BW, knowing the kids will lap up a new character all the same.

So the writers felt that it was a risk to suddenly replace the protagonist in between the transition of each generation. Big deal. So they were poor writers. This is Pokemon. You hardly need to be Shakespeare, as can be seen from the games' story department. Yes, even B/W due to B/W2's existence.