6th Gen Primal Reversion Discussion & Speculation Thread

[TriforceCourage]

I'm glad my prediction came true and Groudon got an Ability that flat-out negates Water attacks. It puts it on a much more even playing field with Kyogre, as they are supposed to be. And before anyone says they are OP, Groudon and Kyogre will always be banned from VGC's (the metagame Game Freak balances for mostly); these guys are supposed to be super powerful, because they are not made with the competitive metagame in mind, but rather with their lore and story.

Now I'm looking forward to Primal Rayquaza with an Ability that can negate these...it definitely draws some parallels to the Auras of Xerneas and Yveltal, and Zygarde's Aura Break. I wonder if Primal Rayquaza's Ability will have some extra aspects to it, too.

Only reason people said OP is because it was hopes to come to Metagame for a little while, but i think all that changed when the Primal abilities were revealed That was insta-ban.

 

[TriforceCourage]

That scary thought came to me too...Primal/Mega Rayquaza will only have two weaknesses if that's the case, same as Kyogre. Now Primal Groudon is well rounded, with it having Solar Beam to take down other Ground types.

Dont forget Water types, no effect and Solar Beam weakness. I swear to God if Gamefreak even considers making this meta im hanging up the glove with pokemon competitive play.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

Primal Groudon is a BOSS in the Story. You have a 1 in 3 chance of 1HKO.

But Now every hoenn starter will have trouble with this guy.

Yeah, Mega Blaziken will need to use Earthquake or a stab fighting move to do maximum damage on that thing, Mega Sceptile interestingly is the least affected due to it's typing, it will get Neutral on both of Primal Groudon's stab...sadly Groudon has access to Dragon Claw...
and Mega Swampert won't even be able to use it's ability and while having Ground stab it may not be fast enough on it's own to land a Earthquake.

Now Sceptile is interesting as it benefits from both Primals. If tagged teamed with Primal Kyogre it will have even less to fear (actually nothing) from fire attacks (thus giving it two immunities since it has Lightning Rod). Ohhhh...Mega Sceptile plus Primal Kyogre are the ultimate duo as Mega Sceptile will keep it safe from electric attacks while Primal Kyogre eliminates fire for good.

Now when Sceptile is teamed up with Primal Groudon it will be able to instant Solar Beam any Ground types that come close to the Primal...plus ice moves are weakened too due to the Drought like effects. Funny how ice isn't affected by Primal Groudon's ability... maybe there is a loophole and ice attacks hit Primal Groudon as if they were normal water attacks thus giving it 4x damage...well one could hope...

 

[Altairis]

Wow, I'm glad that they added a new element to the weather abilities and didn't just bring back the permanent aspect of it. I wonder to see how the way that we can't change the weather or use opposing type moves will affect competitive gameplay.

 

[Nah]

Dont forget Water types, no effect and Solar Beam weakness. I swear to God if Gamefreak even considers making this meta im hanging up the glove with pokemon competitive play.

I don't think that you'll need to worry about that. In both VGC and Smogon rules (and in Rated Battle Spot battles), regular Groudon and Kyogre always have been and always will be banned, so the Primal forms will be insta-banned upon ORAS's release as well. The only time you'd ever have to fight one would be in Battle Spot Free Battles or Smogon's Uber tier.

Now when Sceptile is teamed up with Primal Groudon it will be able to instant Solar Beam any Ground types that come close to the Primal...plus ice moves are weakened too due to the Drought like effects. Funny how ice isn't affected by Primal Groudon's ability... maybe there is a loophole and ice attacks hit Primal Groudon as if they were normal water attacks thus giving it 4x damage...well one could hope...

Eh? Ice has never been weakened by Drought, despite the fact that that would make sense. Ice moves are also just 1x effective on P-Groudon.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

I don't think that you'll need to worry about that. In both VGC and Smogon rules (and in Rated Battle Spot battles), regular Groudon and Kyogre always have been and always will be banned, so the Primal forms will be insta-banned upon ORAS's release as well. The only time you'd ever have to fight one would be in Battle Spot Free Battles or Smogon's Uber tier.


Eh? Ice has never been weakened by Drought, despite the fact that that would make sense. Ice moves are also just 1x effective on P-Groudon.

I thought it was.
Oh the ice thing doing 4x damage was in reference to how they could have the effect turn ice move into water type moves. It'll make sense.

 

[TriforceCourage]

I don't think that you'll need to worry about that. In both VGC and Smogon rules (and in Rated Battle Spot battles), regular Groudon and Kyogre always have been and always will be banned, so the Primal forms will be insta-banned upon ORAS's release as well. The only time you'd ever have to fight one would be in Battle Spot Free Battles or Smogon's Uber tier.


Eh? Ice has never been weakened by Drought, despite the fact that that would make sense. Ice moves are also just 1x effective on P-Groudon.

Yes but there is always a time where they try something new. I already know that they will ban it, im just saying if that 1% chance happens then im out. 1% is still a chance.

 

[Aizuke]

Rayquaza be like;

Poor Rayquaza is getting dissed for bad, Rayquaza needs more love.

As Primal Kyogre and Groudon, their weather abilities actually scare me lol

Having water and fire attacks rendered useless? Holy moly, the struggle will be real.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

Yes but there is always a time where they try something new. I already know that they will ban it, im just saying if that 1% chance happens then im out. 1% is still a chance.

If they ever allow the Primals to be used my guess is we'll be restricted to one. If Rayquaza has one then that'll mean we have the option of three. Most may end up pickiing Rayquaza.

 

[TriforceCourage]

If they ever allow the Primals to be used my guess is we'll be restricted to one. If Rayquaza has one then that'll mean we have the option of three. Most may end up pickiing Rayquaza.

Well like in most rated battles you can only have one of each poke so i dont see that as a problem, Sunny day and Rain dance teams would go through the roof, and Sandstorm and hail teams would be no more, people would ditch Charizard Y, Drought Nintails, Tyranitar, Drizzle Politoed, and Mega Abamasnow because they would be rendered useless. If they let even one of them it would be Poke-Apocalypse. The only way theyd let them is if for say Desolate Land condition changed when opponent Primal Reverts Kyorge activating Primodial Sea or Primal Rayquaza gets an ability to cancel the other 2. But since its pretty clear that nothing happens unless switched or fainted i dont see that happening...maybe...

 

[Jacrad]

Hm, will Castform change forms in either of the new weather conditions? :0a

 

[Cerberus87]

Funny thing is that Smogon will most certainly try to ban Primal Groudon and Kyogre from Ubers, not realizing that Ubers is supposed to be an anything goes tier, so everything should be allowed.

The standard metagame will be unaffected. Groudon and Kyogre are already banned even from VGC so I don't see how these abilities could be a problem.

In future generations I can see the other Ubers getting something similar, but for now, the Mega Mewtwos, Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre are all we have.

 

[Altairis]

Hm, will Castform change forms in either of the new weather conditions? :0a

I doubt it, because even though it's different mechanically it's still technically sun & rain. Although I do hope we get a Hail Castform :) While I don't think Rayquaza fits, we need a Hail legendary!

In future generations I can see the other Ubers getting something similar, but for now, the Mega Mewtwos, Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre are all we have.

Something similar to these abilities? Or like what? :O

 

[Cerberus87]

Something similar to these abilities? Or like what? :O

Well the others need something to boost their power compared to Mewtwo, Groudon and Kyogre, don't they? It would be cool to see Lugia and Ho-Oh getting Megas or something that made them over the top for example.

 

[L0RD G3NGAR]

Funny thing is that Smogon will most certainly try to ban Primal Groudon and Kyogre from Ubers, not realizing that Ubers is supposed to be an anything goes tier, so everything should be allowed.

The standard metagame will be unaffected. Groudon and Kyogre are already banned even from VGC so I don't see how these abilities could be a problem.

In future generations I can see the other Ubers getting something similar, but for now, the Mega Mewtwos, Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre are all we have.

No, the reason they are trying to ban Gengarnite from Ubers is because it fits Smogons definition of uncompetitive because of the trapping set.

Unless Primal Groudon and Kyogre stop switching, I doubt they will be suspected lol.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

Funny thing is that Smogon will most certainly try to ban Primal Groudon and Kyogre from Ubers, not realizing that Ubers is supposed to be an anything goes tier, so everything should be allowed.

The standard metagame will be unaffected. Groudon and Kyogre are already banned even from VGC so I don't see how these abilities could be a problem.

In future generations I can see the other Ubers getting something similar, but for now, the Mega Mewtwos, Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre are all we have.

You mean legendary Ubers right, seeing how some of them are already Megas of other Pokemon (like Mega Mawile).

They might get a powerup, but I kind of doubt it'll be as big as the abilities of these two considering their normal abilities don't do much, at least the Johto bird duo and the creation trios, much like how Mewtwo's ability doesn't do much, and it's Megas don't either. Now the Tao and XYZ trio may get them (I know Zygarde isn't uber...yet, nor is Black Kyurem).

 

[Cerberus87]

They might get a powerup, but I kind of doubt it'll be as big as the abilities of these two considering their normal abilities don't do much, at least the Johto bird duo and the creation trios, much like how Mewtwo's ability doesn't do much, and it's Megas don't either. Now the Tao and XYZ trio may get them (I know Zygarde isn't uber...yet, nor is Black Kyurem).

Never underestimate GF's ability to break the game. :P

Lugia and Ho-Oh's HAs are excellent, actually. They're a vast improvement on Pressure, and, if they got a stat boost from a Mega, they'd become incredible.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

Never underestimate GF's ability to break the game. :P

Lugia and Ho-Oh's HAs are excellent, actually. They're a vast improvement on Pressure, and, if they got a stat boost from a Mega, they'd become incredible.

Now their Hidden abilities are a different story. I can see their Megas getting them. I don't think they'll get Primals as one can tell by my last sentence.

 

[DJTiki]

Okay. Primal Rayquza is happening. I will bet money on this. Primal Groudon has Desolute Land, which is harsh sun. Primal Kyorge is Primodial Sea which is heavy rain. Both abilities are VERY similar, only differing in what types comes to play and the exact weather. But the premise is the same. An endless and powerful weather condition.

What did XY have? Well they had Xerneas and Yvetial with similar abilites. One that boosted Fairy moves and one that boosted Dark ones. The Aura abilites. Now Zygarde had Aura Break, which not only negated the effects but turned it against the two abilites, rounding them out.

Rayquaza had Airlock, Groudon and Kyorge has Drought and Drizzle. Primal Rayquaza, when it happens, will have a similar effect with Xerneas, Yveital, and Zygarde. Two similar, super powered abilites and one that destroys it. Primal Rayquaza will probably not only STOP the weather but reverse its effects too.

 

[destinedjagold]

Okay. Primal Rayquza is happening. I will bet money on this. Primal Groudon has Desolute Land, which is harsh sun. Primal Kyorge is Primodial Sea which is heavy rain. Both abilities are VERY similar, only differing in what types comes to play and the exact weather. But the premise is the same. An endless and powerful weather condition.

What did XY have? Well they had Xerneas and Yvetial with similar abilites. One that boosted Fairy moves and one that boosted Dark ones. The Aura abilites. Now Zygarde had Aura Break, which not only negated the effects but turned it against the two abilites, rounding them out.

Rayquaza had Airlock, Groudon and Kyorge has Drought and Drizzle. Primal Rayquaza, when it happens, will have a similar effect with Xerneas, Yveital, and Zygarde. Two similar, super powered abilites and one that destroys it. Primal Rayquaza will probably not only STOP the weather but reverse its effects too.

An ability that not only can it cancel weather, it also won't allow other Pokémon to change the weather, perhaps? ^^