Purpose of Member Fan Clubs

[22sa]

I realize everybody's use to Visitor Messaging by now, but I wish to point out some problems...

As an older member, it's not that fun to just butt into kiddy convos on the forum. There's just too much conflict of interests, it just doesn't work. Hence what's left of PC for people like me is the likes of Visitor Messaging. It's painstakingly hard to find an actual thread to post in.

Nothing wrong with Visitor Messaging, but it's not a forum discussion that's going on. Other people can't naturally join in, our themes can't contribute to the discussion environment... it's just not posting as it should be.

I'm asking for the sake of older members who still want to have fun actually posting to bring back Member Fan Clubs to PC.

Doesn't hurt to bring back that forum does it? I want it be left open for people who want to use it to use it, now and in the future of PC when there'll be bigger and bigger generation gaps.

 

[Aquacorde]

Wasn't the reason for it being taken down was that people were feeling left out/unpopular if they didn't get one? Or was it just because it was considered fairly spammy with the increasing popularity of VMs idk.

But I'd like 'em back tbh. Didn't really get around to enjoying them while they existed, which is a sad thing. They seemed fun.

 

[Ho-Oh]

Member fanclubs were becoming inactive and only about 2-3 were posted in often enough before they were closed. Even so, only six were posted in during the last month of its existence and unless there was lots of interest shown now I don't see them returning. Yes, there are other forums which are more inactive, but there's also the fact that the vm system really does cover that as mentioned, whereas other forums don't really have a whole system for activity to locate to.

But yeah, to be honest, with the amount of DCC's in every section (back in the past there weren't nearly as many DCCs, now I think there's at least 6 or so), that also makes up for this too, imo. Since even OC's allows anyone to jump in the conversation at any time, and it doesn't necessarily have to be "how was your day?" because you can discover that from the actual vms.

You've also got OVP/C&M/etc for the non-Pokemon discussions, too, so I see it pretty much completely covered. Really in the past there were a lot less discussion threads too in general from what I noticed, whereas now they are a lot more common. I'm by no means against member fanclubs, though, they just seem somewhat redundant when you compare how the forum has changed from when they were around to now.

 

[22sa]

Yes it became unpopular, but it doesn't hurt leaving it as an option for those who still want to use it. The fact is VMing isn't the same as forum discussion after all.

We have a long history with Member Fan Clubs, it shouldn't be bad to give it more credit and leave it available.

 

[Alternative]

I wasn't around when Member Fanclubs were a happy-funtime place, but I don't like the reasons for bringing them back. It's essentially talking off-topic in a club which you may be friends with a person and find new friends because of a mutual interest or whatever. The biggest thing which I don't like is that it can bring in some form of sucking up to other members which may be more likeable than others. It may not seem like a well-reasoned argument but yeah I really don't know what I'm talking about. I'm not really for bringing them back, since they would be off-topic chats about nothing, which really does belong in the Daily Chit Chat thread.

 

[bobandbill]

I'm asking for the sake of older members who still want to have fun actually posting to bring back Member Fan Clubs to PC.

Not all old members were interested in member fan clubs to begin with or still are, tbh. =/

They always seemed somewhat spammy in nature as well as cliquey. I wouldn't be for them coming back at all. They're not the same as VMing, no, but the basic point of talking to the member is still there and forums move on with such additions after al. Always going to be things added (like blogs) and dropped (like that section and social groups).

 

[Shining Raichu]

I'm going to throw in my support for them as well. Granted, I wasn't around for them, I think they were long before my time, but I've heard a lot about them and I think they sounded like a lot of fun. I think if there was a reason for something to exist once, there's reason for it to exist again.

If it fails it fails, but how will we know unless we try?

 

[bobandbill]

I think if there was a reason for something to exist once, there's reason for it to exist again.

I disagree - I don't think that something being relevant once in the past (and this section was only active years ago - before it was removed it was inactive quite considerably by all reports) means it should be brought back, and not with MFC. And although it's not the same as VMing (or PMing or contacting the member via msn/etc which is offered via the contact tab on everyone's profile, and as mentioned the various chat threads we have in a number of sections), I don't see much that it specifically offers over all the other options that makes it a good enough reason to be brought back given the previous lack of interest and other points raised.

Also unsure on how much of an impact stuff like:

our themes can't contribute to the discussion environment...

If that's one of its saving graces I don't see much going for it then, imho. =/ (And somewhat of a moot point given how many people spend a lot of time making fancy profile themes on which VMs are carried out upon as well).

 

[Deleted member 143209]

There's just no point in having a section with 2 or 3 active threads for the purpose of being a fan club. That's about it.

 

[22sa]

I wasn't around when Member Fanclubs were a happy-funtime place, but I don't like the reasons for bringing them back. It's essentially talking off-topic in a club which you may be friends with a person and find new friends because of a mutual interest or whatever. The biggest thing which I don't like is that it can bring in some form of sucking up to other members which may be more likeable than others. It may not seem like a well-reasoned argument but yeah I really don't know what I'm talking about. I'm not really for bringing them back, since they would be off-topic chats about nothing, which really does belong in the Daily Chit Chat thread.

Like I said - the generation gaps that exist in the current large and diverse PC makes it too hard for the DCC to serve everyone. You say it they belong in the DCC, but the DCC has annoying rules like you have to say something related to the topic at hand. What if that topic has nothing to do with me? Am I just to quit posting, lose any hope of having fun here and come back later? And I don't want to be disrespectful to the other people there just because of my own lack of interest in the current DCC topic either. But Member Fan Clubs would make up for the times when one can't join in the DCC - and I'm sure you can imagine how many people would look at the DCC each day just to leave without posting because they can't contribute to it. But Member Fan Clubs just might help those people keeping posting on PC.

Not all old members were interested in member fan clubs to begin with or still are, tbh. =/

They always seemed somewhat spammy in nature as well as cliquey. I wouldn't be for them coming back at all. They're not the same as VMing, no, but the basic point of talking to the member is still there and forums move on with such additions after al. Always going to be things added (like blogs) and dropped (like that section and social groups).

Posting enthusiasts like myself were interested. Of course, if you don't have any use for the forum. But I do. I'm sure there's nothing wrong with leaving it available to me, is there.

I'm going to throw in my support for them as well. Granted, I wasn't around for them, I think they were long before my time, but I've heard a lot about them and I think they sounded like a lot of fun. I think if there was a reason for something to exist once, there's reason for it to exist again.

If it fails it fails, but how will we know unless we try?

Check it out, the once biggest forum on PC, Member Fan Clubs: https://www.pokecommunity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=72

I disagree - I don't think that something being relevant once in the past (and this section was only active years ago - before it was removed it was inactive quite considerably by all reports) means it should be brought back, and not with MFC. And although it's not the same as VMing (or PMing or contacting the member via msn/etc which is offered via the contact tab on everyone's profile, and as mentioned the various chat threads we have in a number of sections), I don't see much that it specifically offers over all the other options that makes it a good enough reason to be brought back given the previous lack of interest and other points raised.

Also unsure on how much of an impact stuff like:
If that's one of its saving graces I don't see much going for it then, imho. =/ (And somewhat of a moot point given how many people spend a lot of time making fancy profile themes on which VMs are carried out upon as well).

It's actually one the reasons I joined PC - we allow bigger avatars and flashier than every other forum I know. We're a community of graphic artists. It matters to me and the identity of PC.

Btw, in view conversation mode you can't see the pretty profiles, only small avatars. Don't you think that minimizes the experience?
On the other hand, viewing a thread conversation everything is there.

There's just no point in having a section with 2 or 3 active threads for the purpose of being a fan club. That's about it.

Or PC can respect those few members who still use it, and leave it open for improvement.

Member Fan Clubs deserves more credit than PC gives to it right now.

With new members everyday, who knows what will happen ? Let them have a choice whether to use Member Fan Clubs or not.

 

[Alternative]

I'll be honest, those are the points which I feel means they don't need it. They really were a spamfest back in the day. There'd still be the rules about spamming whatever if it's not relevant to the thread though, like if A fanclub about me was made, and we were talking about how much I like Boldore and that doesn't interest you, you wouldn't be allowed to waltz in and change the topic either.

As for your posting thing, I do feel like it's a nice way to make friends and stuff through a mutual friendship; I've even done it with people in the past. I'd also have no problem with this coming back either, so long as post count was banned there. I still don't totally agree with the idea, but I wouldn't turn a blind eye to it.

 

[donavannj]

I'll be honest, those are the points which I feel means they don't need it. They really were a spamfest back in the day. There'd still be the rules about spamming whatever if it's not relevant to the thread though, like if A fanclub about me was made, and we were talking about how much I like Boldore and that doesn't interest you, you wouldn't be allowed to waltz in and change the topic either.

As for your posting thing, I do feel like it's a nice way to make friends and stuff through a mutual friendship; I've even done it with people in the past. I'd also have no problem with this coming back either, so long as post count was banned there. I still don't totally agree with the idea, but I wouldn't turn a blind eye to it.

Post count was pretty much always turned off for the duration of the existence of Member Fanclubs, if my memory serves.

 

[Nick]

To put it into some kind of perspective, the entire h-staff agreed (which doesn't happen often!) with removing member fan clubs for all the reasons stated, so even if one of us were to humor the idea, it'd probably be turned down nearly immediately. The three major reasons being: the section was pretty dead and there were only eight active threads there for months, VMs, and they weren't what they used to be. They became huge spam pits and personal admiration threads for pretty much everyone.

I can understand why you and some other longterm members would want them back, since they were very big back in the day, but we can't hold onto things and keep them around because they were big back in the day. There'd be no progression if we used that for making community decisions. VMs replaced them. It's really as simple as that. If you want to use what Member Fan Clubs was for, just host it all on their VMs. People post messages to each other expressing something about the person's VMs they're posting on all the time these days.

Also, there's not enough need or interest in reinstating them enough for putting them back. We wouldn't create a forum in the first place unless those things were there, and they aren't.

 

[22sa]

I'll be honest, those are the points which I feel means they don't need it. They really were a spamfest back in the day. There'd still be the rules about spamming whatever if it's not relevant to the thread though, like if A fanclub about me was made, and we were talking about how much I like Boldore and that doesn't interest you, you wouldn't be allowed to waltz in and change the topic either.

As for your posting thing, I do feel like it's a nice way to make friends and stuff through a mutual friendship; I've even done it with people in the past. I'd also have no problem with this coming back either, so long as post count was banned there. I still don't totally agree with the idea, but I wouldn't turn a blind eye to it.

The post count isn't fundamental to me, I just want the extra posting environment because I don't want to just walk away from PC when no topics interest me.

Post count was pretty much always turned off for the duration of the existence of Member Fanclubs, if my memory serves.

They were on at the beginning, but were turned off later.

To put it into some kind of perspective, the entire h-staff agreed (which doesn't happen often!) with removing member fan clubs for all the reasons stated, so even if one of us were to humor the idea, it'd probably be turned down nearly immediately. The three major reasons being: the section was pretty dead and there were only eight active threads there for months, VMs, and they weren't what they used to be. They became huge spam pits and personal admiration threads for pretty much everyone.

I can understand why you and some other longterm members would want them back, since they were very big back in the day, but we can't hold onto things and keep them around because they were big back in the day. There'd be no progression if we used that for making community decisions. VMs replaced them. It's really as simple as that. If you want to use what Member Fan Clubs was for, just host it all on their VMs. People post messages to each other expressing something about the person's VMs they're posting on all the time these days.

Also, there's not enough need or interest in reinstating them enough for putting them back. We wouldn't create a forum in the first place unless those things were there, and they aren't.

I'm not sure on this one - but isn't the H-staff bored with PC? How often do you see the H-staff posting? Because if so they shouldn't ruin it for members who still have fun a forum they don't approve of any longer.

That's not all! I wasn't just saying it was once big and wonderful. I am comparing VMing and posting - and I prefer posting, so I want more posting options.

Well I'll agree with your last point... nobody still left on PC right now seems to really care but me. :P But it can't hurt to leave the option open can it? Try opening MFC again for a month or so, see if things change. It's not bad to experiment.

 

[Ivysaur]

I'm not sure on this one - but isn't the H-staff bored with PC? How often do you see the H-staff posting? Because if so they shouldn't ruin it for members who still have fun a forum they don't approve of any longer.

Well, huh, Nick himself is Higher Staff (and so am I), and we do post often, so it's not like we are weird martians who hide in a cave and only randomly visit the surface to ban people XD

And I'm sorry, but a forum which only got 55 posts in a month (not even two a day, and most of them from the same small group of regulars) and had only seen one new thread created in 4 months is not really worth keeping. If a TV show was only being watched by 10,000 people, I know those few people would miss it, but the station would figure that it's not worth keeping at all. And that's what we did, I'm sorry. 99% of the posts made in those forums are just "Hey what's up", "Happy birthday!" or "Hey, what do you think about lettuce?" and that can effortlessly be asked on VM's- in fact, that's what everybody did once they were introduced, and that's the main reason for MF's downfall. And, in some way, VM's are more open for everybody and easier to use so I'll stay with them.

 

[Livewire]

You say it they belong in the DCC, but the DCC has annoying rules like you have to say something related to the topic at hand.

You don't post there, so how would you know? I'm pretty lax with the DCC in Other Chat, It's purpose is to be a laid back, hangout thread with light discussion.

We're not going to be bringing back personal spam pits. Either deal with that, or I humbly direct you to the log-out button in the top-right hand corner of your screen.

 

[luke]

Normally I'd be open to bringing stuff back but the Member Fanclubs were just awful, awful things.

 

[Taemin]

The post count isn't fundamental to me, I just want the extra posting environment because I don't want to just walk away from PC when no topics interest me.

If member fanclubs were what mainly held you to PC, then I'm sorry that they're gone, and we know that there were a handful or two of members who still felt attached to that area. The thing is we watched that area die down, a lot, and plenty of it's regulars even said they left the area and all their threads because VMs was much easier and they preferred that. I enjoyed that area too, it was just losing too much activity.

At the same time, if PC still really truly interests you then I'd bet you could find other topics to post in. Hang around OVP more, or game areas, etc. If you get into it enough then some other aspects can make up for member fanclubs being gone.

And I'm sorry if I ignored other posts / points in this thread, I'm about to leave for work. Rushed! D:

 

[Nick]

I'm not sure on this one - but isn't the H-staff bored with PC? How often do you see the H-staff posting? Because if so they shouldn't ruin it for members who still have fun a forum they don't approve of any longer.

That's not all! I wasn't just saying it was once big and wonderful. I am comparing VMing and posting - and I prefer posting, so I want more posting options.

Well I'll agree with your last point... nobody still left on PC right now seems to really care but me. :P But it can't hurt to leave the option open can it? Try opening MFC again for a month or so, see if things change. It's not bad to experiment.

Contrary to popular belief, decisions aren't made on bias. They're usually discussed and analyzed from all perspectives for a great deal amount of time before a decision is made and implemented. Being active and posting in the forum isn't necessarily needed to know what's best for it. Like Jake said, this wasn't done on a whim, and decisions that impact the community never are.

I know, and I totally get that. I do. But to bring back member fan clubs so many things need to happen other than you just preferring posting to VMs, which is what my last point was mainly about. There needs to be a demand and sufficient need for it other than just preferring one to the other.

 

[Deleted member 143209]

I agree with Nick and Jake here, the bottom line is PC can't simply open up sections for a tiny minority of members. The decision to abolish the section in the past was not based on a whim. It simply ran its course and no longer found a place on the forum; it simply became outdated and it became a section that was simply a haven to a few members.

I understand that you may feel hard done by, but you can't point fingers and say the section was taken down by carelessness. If we were to create a section for a very small base of members, then it would be quite subjective as it would mean sections would need to be created for any small group of members who decided they wanted one. Member Fan Clubs simply ran its course and became an inactive section in which became an inactive sub forum with very little activity. Bringing it back would only lead to the same end result.

If you wish to find a place for all your friends to chat, well, it's the internet, your options are endless. You could even set up your own irc channel for your PC pals. But basically; a section cannot simply exist if it has little or no activity and a very small demand to actually exist.