The way I interpreted Joker?s original post is not that men should not have input re: feminism whatsoever. The real message, to me, was that men should not be able to dictate that feminism is not an actual issue/dismiss feminism as a nonissue/etc. And, that?s true - the oppressors cannot dictate whether or not someone is being oppressed.
And who's saying that peeps are? I get peeps that are saying feminism is all crazy right now, but no one aside from Incels really are. Peeps are critiquing the stuff about feminism and honestly giving points in regards to how it is functioning and how it is going on.
Even if we take the point that "Oppressors cannot dictate whether or not someone is being oppressed" (which while I agree, at the same time is not what is at play here). By this, I'm not saying women don't have problems caused by men nor vica versa, however I will say that if you're going to call attention to oppression, you should show it and anyone can look at it and critique what you brought.
Dismissal isn't so cut and dry as to "dismiss the person" but the basis being brought and right now that's what's going on here. Debates are all about that. From what a lot of peeps have inputted, a critique of feminism is that it's too focused on it's own agenda and peeps and not taking in the whole aspect of "Equality" which is kinda where you're going, but if feminism is truly about equality of the sexes then you should probably just add all the types of guys to it as well since well, equality of sexes.
So, while your thing is more lax, I have to say "No s*** sherlock" to peeps not forcing others what to do. I mean, you have the freedoms <-- emphasis on this word
to do what you want as long as it doesn't infringe on the rights of others. We're talking about issues and the validity of many things and the common critique I've seen in this thread regarding feminism is still there and isn't being addressed.
So let me ask you this then.
I agree that feminism is about equality (though I went on a big rant on how it doesn't own the idea I believe in this very thread), so then riddle me these things,
1) If feminism is about equality and you agree men should have input, then shouldn't they also have a say in critique and how things are? Not saying imposement, but this is a movement to bring up issues that should be discussed, so wouldn't it be better to all sides sit down and look at these things and issues?
2) To your feminine comment earlier, femininity is associate with weaker/lesser to a degree by society, doesn't mean that everyone thinks every woman is that way. Not to mention femininity isn't a bad thing, since both males and females share both masculine and feminine traits. Also, masculine traits are also viewed as irrational and other things, angry and whatnot. So, if feminism is about equality of the sexes, why focus on just women? I'd understand brining up issues that regard women more, but this is no more a campaign for citizenship rights anymore, but brining up other issues and from what I've seen, haven't been living up to what their legacy would imply.
I respect your civility though.