Is a disability an excuse?

[gimmepie]

Basically what the title says. Is a disability or mental illness necessarily an excuse for acting in poor taste, breaking rules or even circumventing the law?

 

[Corrin]

Mmm, I think it depends on the disability? A lot of disabilities come with a developmental delay so maybe the person just doesn't know? I think educating the person on what is right and wrong would work better then punishing them, if they're developmentally delayed.

 

[Her]

It ultimately comes down to a lack of understanding/information, and in the most serious cases, a lack of empathy. When a lack of understanding disabilities develops into a lack of empathy, you become inured to anyone different to you. Sometimes it manifests as a simple look of condescension. Sometimes it becomes outright mockery. Left unchecked, it can become horrifying. You get the abhorrent situation seen in England where thousands of beneficiaries died because their situations were ignored, in favour of squeezing labour out of them that they physically or mentally weren't capable of. While that devastating scenario is at the absolute end of the scale, it is relevant as a clear example of what happens when not enough effort to taken to understand and care.

At the other end of the scale, sometimes you get people who don't make excuses exactly, but don't understand their own illness enough to know what they are capable of in spite of their impairment. Sometimes it's a self esteem thing, sometimes it is literally down to not having the correct medical information needed to advance themselves. How is one supposed to make a life with their illness if they do not understand it? Some people... really do make excuses, unfortunately. That's just what happens when you have a large enough population. But in the majority of They're Making An Excuse cases that people come across, I think it's a matter of misunderstanding on both ends.

 

[gimmepie]

Personally, I think that whilst disabilities or mental illnesses can certainly complicate an issue, as a general rule they are not an excuse. If you are capable of social interaction and independence then you are also capable of acting appropriately and within the confines of the law. Obviously really severe cases are an exception here though.

Mmm, I think it depends on the disability? A lot of disabilities come with a developmental delay so maybe the person just doesn't know? I think educating the person on what is right and wrong would work better then punishing them, if they're developmentally delayed.

I would argue that punishment and education go hand in hand. I agree that it is important to educate and to cater your actions to the appropriate developmental level, but that doesn't mean someone with autism or bi-polar should just be allowed to run rampant until they understand the lesson either.

 

[pastelspectre]

i think that there is no excuse for doing bad things because you have a disability or mental illness. unless it's a severe one, obviously, then...that's understandable?

 

[Pinkie-Dawn]

I feel it's being abused as an excuse for bad behavior, especially if the person in question is either lying about having a disability to get away with what they're doing or misdiagnosed of having a disability due to poor examinations from bad doctors.

 

[User19sq]

As a disability people myself, all I can say is: It's only an excuse for being unemployed. I've spent this whole past year looking for a job in tons of local places, but it turns out someone with my body problems isn't minimum-wage material. So I'm perpetually broke because of it.

But on the spectrum of what this thread asked: acting bad is a maybe, depending on certain variables (discrimination, lack of help, etc), but frowned upon. Breaking the law should never be allowed in this basis, as even the mentally-disabled should be punished for doing so. Just to a different, conditional extent, as sometimes hey don't understand that they broke the law when they didn't mean to. It's a horribly-gray area, certainly.

I remember a few years back, a black man with a mental disability was shot in his own doorway by two police officers for simply holding a screwdriver in his hands. Granted that they shouted at him to drop his "weapon" and gave him a maximum of three seconds before opening fire (which falls into a separate debate of its own), but he didn't use the screwdriver in any other way other than simply holding it in both hands. If more time were allowed, this debate thread would have been buzzing over this video in search of any plausible explanation over whether or not opening fire was necessary, rather than the event in question falling into racial tensions that have been lingering since the dawn of America.

 

[Hands]

https://dyspraxiafoundation.org.uk/dyspraxia-adults/

This is what I have, and whilst I don't often openly talk about it, it is relevant to bring up here I believe. My Dyspraxia causes me to sometimes behave poorly without realising I'm doing it. As such, yeah, I'd say my Dyspraxia is an excuse in those circumstances because it has directly caused that behaviour.

 

[Majestic Electric]

I think it mostly depends on the person's reason for needing to give an excuse in the first place. For example, if someone uses their disability as an excuse for stealing or another crime, it's not an excuse. There is no excuse for committing a crime! If you have a mental disability, get it checked instead of blaming it for your poor decision-making!
On the other hand, with disorders like ADHD, I sort of see a gray area in school or work-related situations. For example, if someone has ADHD and they are not doing well in school, I see it as a contributor to their poor grades, thus it is a legitimate excuse for needing extra help and the like. However, it is not an excuse for laziness, especially for those who don't even have disorders like ADHD. That's just how I see it.

 

[Hands]

There is no excuse for committing a crime! If you have a mental disability, get it checked instead of blaming it for your poor decision-making!

This is maybe the most misguided and ignorant statement I have ever read on PC.

There are mental disabilities that outright render adults with the intellectual profile of a six year old. Are you telling me a six year old knows the actual severity of right and wrong? Can process complex legal grey areas? What about autism? There are people on the spectrum who just cannot understand social constructs and as such, cannot process the idea of social morality and the laws around them. It absolutely is an excuse which is why no judge worth their salt will ever convict a disabled person without heavily considering if their disability is a mitigating circumstance in their action(s).

My Dyspraxia causes me to have severe issues with depth and distance perception. If I was to have an incident where my Dyspraxia caused me to be a catalyst for an accident then I absolutely would expect my disability/disorder to be considered because it directly caused that to happen.

 

[gimmepie]

I think it mostly depends on the person's reason for needing to give an excuse in the first place. For example, if someone uses their disability as an excuse for stealing or another crime, it's not an excuse. There is no excuse for committing a crime! If you have a mental disability, get it checked instead of blaming it for your poor decision-making!
On the other hand, with disorders like ADHD, I sort of see a gray area in school or work-related situations. For example, if someone has ADHD and they are not doing well in school, I see it as a contributor to their poor grades, thus it is a legitimate excuse for needing extra help and the like. However, it is not an excuse for laziness, especially for those who don't even have disorders like ADHD. That's just how I see it.

I think what irks me here is how backwards your logic is. ADHD is a hell of a lot easier to manage than conditions that actually effect your ability to properly interact with society. I'm well and truly in the camp of "you can't use your disability as an excuse" - I'm autistic and was raised that way and I believe I'm better for it - but there are still people out there who literally cannot control themselves and they deserve leniency a lot more than someone who isn't managing ADHD properly.

 

[Majestic Electric]

This is maybe the most misguided and ignorant statement I have ever read on PC.

There are mental disabilities that outright render adults with the intellectual profile of a six year old. Are you telling me a six year old knows the actual severity of right and wrong? Can process complex legal grey areas? What about autism? There are people on the spectrum who just cannot understand social constructs and as such, cannot process the idea of social morality and the laws around them. It absolutely is an excuse which is why no judge worth their salt will ever convict a disabled person without heavily considering if their disability is a mitigating circumstance in their action(s).

My Dyspraxia causes me to have severe issues with depth and distance perception. If I was to have an incident where my Dyspraxia caused me to be a catalyst for an accident then I absolutely would expect my disability/disorder to be considered because it directly caused that to happen.

I apologize if I offended you (or anyone else for that matter). That was not my intention. I wasn't referring to mental disorders like Dyspraxia when I made my post. The incident you described would not make you at fault for accidents of that caliber. I was referring to those who commit a crime and have no history of mental illness, but plea guilty due to insanity, aka they blame it on schizophrenia when they might not even have it. Again, my sincerest apologies... :(

I think what irks me here is how backwards your logic is. ADHD is a hell of a lot easier to manage than conditions that actually effect your ability to properly interact with society. I'm well and truly in the camp of "you can't use your disability as an excuse" - I'm autistic and was raised that way and I believe I'm better for it - but there are still people out there who literally cannot control themselves and they deserve leniency a lot more than someone who isn't managing ADHD properly.

ADHD is listed as being part of the autistic spectrum, unless I'm missing something. And I completely agree with you. When I made my post, I was mainly referring to those who commit a crime and have no history of mental illness, but plea guilty due to insanity, aka they blame it on schizophrenia when they might not even have it. Yes, there are legitimate cases of schizophrenia, but it is foolish to think no one lies while under oath because that is just untrue. I sincerely apologize if I offended you. I wasn't trying to offend anyone. :(

 

[Hands]

I apologize if I offended you (or anyone else for that matter). That was not my intention. I wasn't referring to mental disorders like Dyspraxia when I made my post. The incident you described would not make you at fault for accidents of that caliber. I was referring to those who commit a crime and have no history of mental illness, but plea guilty due to insanity, aka they blame it on schizophrenia when they might not even have it. Again, my sincerest apologies... :(



ADHD is listed as being part of the autistic spectrum, unless I'm missing something. And I completely agree with you. When I made my post, I was mainly referring to those who commit a crime and have no history of mental illness, but plea guilty due to insanity, aka they blame it on schizophrenia when they might not even have it. Yes, there are legitimate cases of schizophrenia, but it is foolish to think no one lies while under oath because that is just untrue. I sincerely apologize if I offended you. I wasn't trying to offend anyone. :(

My apologies, i misunderstood your post. I thought you were referring to people with mental disorders commiting a crime they might not understand, sorry.

 

[Majestic Electric]

My apologies, i misunderstood your post. I thought you were referring to people with mental disorders commiting a crime they might not understand, sorry.

It's okay. :) I suppose I should of worded it better, so that's on me.

 

[gimmepie]

Snip

Relax, I'm not offended either. The way your post was worded just implied something that needed correcting xD.

To the best of my knowledge, whilst's it's extremely common for those on the autism spectrum to have ADD/ADHD, ADHD is not on the spectrum. The characteristics of the two are extremely different which suggests I'm probably remembering correctly.

 

[Maki-Nishikino]

im a person with Autism, PTSD, depression and i think its ADD but i dont go out breaking the law (except downloading some movies, music and games from old consoles) other than that i stay good and not get myself into trouble when im not doing my daily stuff for my local tattoo shop (except on sunday) im usually at home playing some video games or watching a video or some TV

 

[BlazingCobaltX]

Some disabilities and disorders cause massive disruption in bodily function, behaviour and cognition, whether conscious (not being able to control your hand movement) or not (not understanding social conventions). Because of this, they should definitely be taken into consideration when someone with a known disorder or disability behaves badly or even commits a crime. It should not turn into "I have bipolar disorder so I can behave like an ass whenever", but I think that hardly happens (unless someone is already prone to being abusive or manupulative or something).

ADHD is listed as being part of the autistic spectrum, unless I'm missing something.

ADHD is not part of the autistic spectrum, but both are neurodevelopmental disorders.

 

[SunsetGreen]

Disabled people are people! So, they do all the things people do, for instance, using whatever they can to gain an advantage. Some people use their good looks, their youth, their old age, their wealth etc etc.

 

[Hands]

Disabled people are people! So, they do all the things people do, for instance, using whatever they can to gain an advantage. Some people use their good looks, their youth, their old age, their wealth etc etc.

You must live in a very bizarre and delusional world if you think having a life changing disability can grant someone the same advantages as good looks or wealth

 

[BlazingCobaltX]

Disabled people are people! So, they do all the things people do, for instance, using whatever they can to gain an advantage. Some people use their good looks, their youth, their old age, their wealth etc etc.

That's not the same. You'd need to be in at least a normal, unmarginalized position to use something like that to your advantage. Instead, disabled people are hardly considered people by non-disabled people (and even the government) and it's more likely that flaunting with their disability will cause more trouble than good.

Or is getting ahead of the line in Disney World 'taking advantage' of one's disability?