Occupy Wall Street

The federal reserve is as much as a problem to the financial situation as a nose is to a cold. It's problematic right now, but get rid of the main cause of the problem and things should get better. That problem being big money in the government. The Federal Reserve has the power to reduce unemployment since it pretty much controls the economy. Instead, it chooses to protect big money interests. Repeal citizens united. Pass the Saving American Democracy amendment. Get big money out of our government.
 
jpp8 said:
The federal reserve is as much as a problem to the financial situation as a nose is to a cold. It's problematic right now, but get rid of the main cause of the problem and things should get better. That problem being big money in the government. The Federal Reserve has the power to reduce unemployment since it pretty much controls the economy. Instead, it chooses to protect big money interests. Repeal citizens united. Pass the Saving American Democracy amendment. Get big money out of our government.
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I can't back that plan because it's unconstitutional. The Fed has the ability to reduce unemployment, but they don't. They never will. They are controlled by power brokers.
 
Again:
1. Repeal Citizens United
2. Make Saving American Democracy an amendment to the Constitution and therefore the repeal of Citizens United is constitutional
3. Regulate the influence big money has on our government
4. ???
5. Government starts serving the people once again
 
FreakyLocz14 said:
The Fed is actually harming our place in the international market. Everything the Fed prints money, the overall vale of the dollar goes down. Recent talks of discontinuing international trade in dollars is a result of this.

Also, who gets to use the money that's printed? Certainly not you and I. It's a predictable consequence that when we print money out of thin air, certain people benefit from it and certain people suffer the inflation it causes. The people that get to use the money first like the military industrial complex make a lot of money off of it and benefit while the middle class suffers.
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I don't know much but i'd assume that if that happened, the Euro would be the new international currency... Then again, I think some EU members are thinking of withdrawing so meh... Euro, Yuan (China's currency... I think), whatever Japan's currency is are my best guesses for what would be used. Then again, for all I know, the Peso could be the new international standard.

But still, printing money isn't bad. Well, to a extent. Some money needs to be printed to replace the damaged bills. But most of the printing is done due to our debts. It would be nice if the dems and repubs could quit their petty rivalry and work out a solution but its not going to happen. But still, points to both for not backing down on their ideals. They really don't care since they will be getting a nice big retirement when they are done no matter how bad they screw us over.

You know what spending needs to be cut? The spending that pays their salaries. I'd like to see some form of payment based upon the amount of bills that they pass instead of just giving them a check even if they do nothing. While its not the best solution, it would at least give them a incentive for doing things asap. Might not be good things, but still,I'd rather have the raw sewage moving instead of laying stagnant.

jpp8 said:
The federal reserve is as much as a problem to the financial situation as a nose is to a cold. It's problematic right now, but get rid of the main cause of the problem and things should get better. That problem being big money in the government. The Federal Reserve has the power to reduce unemployment since it pretty much controls the economy. Instead, it chooses to protect big money interests. Repeal citizens united. Pass the Saving American Democracy amendment. Get big money out of our government.
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Wait... Didn't SAD used to be called OCCUPIED? I'm sorry but really? I support the ideals, but good for the nation or not I can't bring myself to support anything named SAD.

Again:
1. Repeal Citizens United
2. Make Saving American Democracy an amendment to the Constitution and therefore the repeal of Citizens United is constitutional
3. Regulate the influence big money has on our government
4. ???
5. Government starts serving the people once again
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+1

But you forgot a couple.

6. 50 years later
7. Rich control everything... again.

The only solution I can think of would be using that communist ideal of spreading all the wealth equally, but even then in the long run that would end up screwing us.
 
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Printing money in itself isn't bad. Printing money that's not backed by anything is what's bad. It's tantamount to counterfeiting. All paper money that's printed should be backed by a certain amount of gold or other precious metals.
 
I don't see the point in backing a worthless piece of paper with some ink on it and fibers added in with a shiny piece of metal. If anything, cut off the cost of making the bills and deal with the metals themselves.

But still, I dislike the high value on certain metals. The values placed on most of them are more historical then practical anyway.

But still, gold itself raises and falls in value. Sure, it might be more stable, but you'll still have inflation and deflation from it.
 
Mr. X said:
I don't see the point in backing a worthless piece of paper with some ink on it and fibers added in with a shiny piece of metal. If anything, cut off the cost of making the bills and deal with the metals themselves.

But still, I dislike the high value on certain metals. The values placed on most of them are more historical then practical anyway.

But still, gold itself raises and falls in value. Sure, it might be more stable, but you'll still have inflation and deflation from it.
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In the short term you'll see rises and falls, but it is only rising in the long term. Such is always the case with nonrenewable resources. As the resources becomes more scarce, the ability for the supply to meet the demand goes down, making it more valuable.
 
I don't really get how Gold would be considered that. Well, I DO, but thats not what i'm meaning. In my mind, nonrenewable resources are those that are used and not easily replaceable.

Basically, people value gold to much to pointlessly waste it. Sure its a good conductor for electricity but money wise their are cheaper and sometimes more effective methods. Other then that, and jewelery, I can't see much use. Yeah, people would invest in it, but they would change it in for money so all it really does in change hands.

Basically, we'll have gold, more gold, even more gold, and more gold. Gold would, supply wise effecting price, go down in value since their is no way to remove it from the supply chain. Make rings, necklaces, whatever out of it but it can still be melted down and returned to its basic refined state.

Unless you put it in a rocket and blast it to the moon (or something) then I don't really see how we can remove enough of it to prevent it from tanking. Sure, the value will rise because people value it a lot, but all that does it set it up to fall like a poorly build house of cards.
 
FreakyLocz14 said:
The minimum wage has increased. States can also set minimum wages. State-level minimum wages have gone up.

Safety standards are some of the few regulations I can understand. Environmental protections, no.
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I'm not talking about minimum wage. But, since you brought it up, minimum wage should be raised even higher for you guys. It's higher here in Canada, and we're thinking of raising it further.

The stagnant wage I'm referring to are for the middle class. I don't think anyone trying to survive on a minimum wage job is in the middle class. Middle and low-level managerial positions, for example. Or those few still able to work in manufacturing. The average person who went to school, got a job, etc. The backbone of the economy. I'm not talking about the poor.

For them, their wages are roughly the same on average as they have been thirty years ago while expenses of all sorts continue to rise. No cost of living increases. For the same size house, people now shell out 50% of their income when it used to be 20%. This can't continue. That's not sustainable.

But if companies were to increase those wages, then they're just going to leave. So, in short, everyone's stuck up ****'s creek.

And environmental protections, as I see them, are safety protections. Why should the air we breath and the resources we consume get poisoned?
 
The Fed is actually harming our place in the international market. Everything the Fed prints money, the overall vale of the dollar goes down. Recent talks of discontinuing international trade in dollars is a result of this.
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if i remember correctly this happened to the euro before the country became so poor people couldnt work the country couldn't afford electricity and gas no one could drive.. also we went through this before... here



but this time i don't think we could recover, things are just too expensive and we've made so many enemies.. Our government just cannot afford to bail us out this time. Jobs are not being made they are being reduced etc.. I think the whole thing will just fall apart very soon..
 
Mr. X said:
The only solution I can think of would be using that communist ideal of spreading all the wealth equally, but even then in the long run that would end up screwing us.
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Whoa. Hell no. That'd be bad. You don't want communism. Yay individualism, and individual responsibility, and skill and hard work being rewarded.

Capitalism works. It's the best system out there. It's just broken and being abused right now.

- increase minimum wage
- mandate cost of living wage/salary increases
- completely rewrite the tax code, removing loop holes, make taxes fair, and increase taxes on the top income earners
- bring back manufacturing
- penalties for companies that take jobs elsewhere (like higher taxes)
- tax breaks for those companies that stay here
- better management in government, find efficiencies, cut the size.
- new banking regulations (our banks in Canada can't pull the same crap yours did in the events leading up to 2008, I can't see how that's a bad thing)
- decrease tuition fees
- balance budget amendment (we have it Canada, you guys should too)

Stuff for corporations, stuff for the government. As for the people, live within your means, you don't have to keep up with the Jonses.

It's still capitalism, it's just fairer and smarter.
 
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Mr. X said:
I don't really get how Gold would be considered that. Well, I DO, but thats not what i'm meaning. In my mind, nonrenewable resources are those that are used and not easily replaceable.

Basically, people value gold to much to pointlessly waste it. Sure its a good conductor for electricity but money wise their are cheaper and sometimes more effective methods. Other then that, and jewelery, I can't see much use. Yeah, people would invest in it, but they would change it in for money so all it really does in change hands.

Basically, we'll have gold, more gold, even more gold, and more gold. Gold would, supply wise effecting price, go down in value since their is no way to remove it from the supply chain. Make rings, necklaces, whatever out of it but it can still be melted down and returned to its basic refined state.

Unless you put it in a rocket and blast it to the moon (or something) then I don't really see how we can remove enough of it to prevent it from tanking. Sure, the value will rise because people value it a lot, but all that does it set it up to fall like a poorly build house of cards.
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Gold is nonrenewable because the supply of it in the world is finite. Once we use it all up, it's gone. Contrast this with a renewable resource that won't deplete eventually.

TRIFORCE89 said:

Whoa. Hell no. That'd be bad. You don't want communism. Yay individualism, and individual responsibility, and skill and hard work being rewarded.

Capitalism works. It's the best system out there. It's just broken and being abused right now.

- increase minimum wage
- mandate cost of living wage increases
- completely rewrite the tax code, removing loop holes, make taxes fair, and increase taxes on the top income earners
- bring back manufacturing
- penalties for companies that take jobs elsewhere (like higher taxes)
- tax breaks for those companies that stay here
- better management in government, find efficiencies, cut the size.
- new banking regulations (our banks in Canada can't pull the same crap yours did in the events leading up to 2008, I can't see how that's a bad thing)
- decrease tuition fees
- balance budget amendment (we have it Canada, you guys should too)

Stuff for corporations, stuff for the government. As for the people, live within your means, you don't have to keep up with the Jonses.

It's still capitalism, it's just fairer and smarter.
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I agree with decreasing tuition and a balanced budget amendment and tax breaks for companies that remain. Other than that, no.
 
TRIFORCE89 said:

Really? Not even reducing the size of government and running it in a more efficient manner? I would have thought you'd be all for that.
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That too. I must have of overlooked that.

The problem with mandated COLA wage increases is that companies will ship even more jobs overseas. As we both know, companies are greedy. That's just a fact of life that won't be changing anytime soon. It's so much cheaper to hire workers in China that companies will gladly pay your penalty and continue to send jobs there. Tax incentives won't be enough to compensate for the increased cost of doing business here.

Industries that can't outsource (i.e. service jobs) will just downsize by laying off workers to compensate for the increased wage mandates.
 
FreakyLocz14 said:
Gold is nonrenewable because the supply of it in the world is finite. Once we use it all up, it's gone. Contrast this with a renewable resource that won't deplete eventually.
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Thats my point. People value it to much to pointlessly waste it, so odds are, it will remain in the supply chain pretty much indefinitely. I like the cash for gold programs, but in this case all they do is bring a removed item back into the chain.

FreakyLocz14 said:
The problem with mandated COLA wage increases is that companies will ship even more jobs overseas. As we both know, companies are greedy. That's just a fact of life that won't be changing anytime soon. It's so much cheaper to hire workers in China that companies will gladly pay your penalty and continue to send jobs there. Tax incentives won't be enough to compensate for the increased cost of doing business here.

Industries that can't outsource (i.e. service jobs) will just downsize by laying off workers to compensate for the increased wage mandates.
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And thats why COL mandates go both ways. Screw if you do, screwed it you don't. If its not required, odds are corperations won't do it. And if it is mandated, they would leave.

TRIFORCE89 said:

Whoa. Hell no. That'd be bad. You don't want communism. Yay individualism, and individual responsibility, and skill and hard work being rewarded.

Capitalism works. It's the best system out there. It's just broken and being abused right now.

- increase minimum wage
- mandate cost of living wage/salary increases
- completely rewrite the tax code, removing loop holes, make taxes fair, and increase taxes on the top income earners
- bring back manufacturing
- penalties for companies that take jobs elsewhere (like higher taxes)
- tax breaks for those companies that stay here
- better management in government, find efficiencies, cut the size.
- new banking regulations (our banks in Canada can't pull the same crap yours did in the events leading up to 2008, I can't see how that's a bad thing)
- decrease tuition fees
- balance budget amendment (we have it Canada, you guys should too)

Stuff for corporations, stuff for the government. As for the people, live within your means, you don't have to keep up with the Jonses.

It's still capitalism, it's just fairer and smarter.
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A hard working farmer makes much less then some people who just set in a air conditioned office all day. Where is the farmers reward for his hard work? Hmm? I'm not accounting skill as these two people would have different skills.

And no. Capitalism isn't the best. No form of government is the best. All governments have their pros and cons, some just have more of one then the other.

As for your list, I don't agree with the stuff on taxes. Remove loopholes yes, but thats about it. I'd rather have a flat tax for everything. Tax breaks don't work, and higher taxes like you are saying they should be used would do more harm then good.

Balanced budget good. I don't like the fact that we'd have to have a constitutional amendment for it, but I do realize that its the only way it would happen since dems and repubs refuse to work with each other.

As for tuition fees, personally I'd rather like the schools to be completely restructured.
Right now, highschool doesn't teach much real life stuff. I'd like for highschool to be turning into, pretty much, a 4-year collage prep. Based on what you want to do later on in life, you'd have diffrient classes.
 
Mr. X said:
And no. Capitalism isn't the best. No form of government is the best. All governments have their pros and cons, some just have more of one then the other.
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Except that capitalism isn't a form of government. It is an economic system. Communism happens to be both, and almost always inseparable. Capitalism is different.

Capitalism is the best economic system out there, yes. It's not the best form of government because it isn't a form of government.
 
TRIFORCE89 said:

Except that capitalism isn't a form of government. It is an economic system. Communism happens to be both, and almost always inseparable. Capitalism is different.

Capitalism is the best economic system out there, yes. It's not the best form of government because it isn't a form of government.
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Agreed. It isn't perfect, but laissez-faire capitalism is by far the best system.
 
While it isn't, the corps with their policy of buying votes have pretty much droven the two together with a sledgehammer.
 
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