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Do As I Say, Not What I Do

Pinkie-Dawn

Pinkie-Dawn

Vampire Waifu
    • 9,528
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    12
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    This is a classic form of hypocrisy from people who give advice to others on what they should do in their lives, whether it's an obese man constantly consuming food while telling others to eat less or a priest that's having an affair while preaching to people to not commit adultery. The most recent example is Leonardo DiCaprio from his documentary Before the Flood, which just recently aired on the National Geographic channel today. He preaches to people to limit their activities that's creating methane and other greenhouse gas, causing climate changes, and yet he used a private jet, which also causes climate change, to travel just to preach his warning in the first place. It's things like this is why my biology professor called him crazy. I'm sure you guys could explain me if there's a legit reason why these people aren't practicing on what they're preaching.
     
    Hypocrisy does leave a bad taste in the mouth, but to say that a hypocrite is wrong in their message can very easily become a tu quoque fallacy, that is, when you say that the message or point of view is wrong because the person doesn't follow it themselves. In other words, don't judge the message by the messenger. Judge it on its own merits.

    I think the hypocrisy argument is often used by people as an excuse to ignore something they don't like, don't want to hear, don't want to consider, don't want to argue. But, like, that's normal because we're human and we're imperfect and not all scholars and practiced debaters.

    Regarding the example, use of a private jet might be the most effective method if it means more people would change their actions (limit their emissions) than would not if they hadn't heard the message. The amount used in one private jet might be x amount of gases, but if more than x amount are reduced because of the use of the jet there's an argument to be made that it was worth it and not even hypocritical. One can still argue that there are better ways, but then you're getting into a much larger discussion.
     
    Im actually somewhat known at school for bits of wisdom. Im not a hypocrite per se... because I actually either follow it in total or do my best to improve.
     
    Esper said:
    Hypocrisy does leave a bad taste in the mouth, but to say that a hypocrite is wrong in their message can very easily become a tu quoque fallacy, that is, when you say that the message or point of view is wrong because the person doesn't follow it themselves. In other words, don't judge the message by the messenger. Judge it on its own merits.

    I think the hypocrisy argument is often used by people as an excuse to ignore something they don't like, don't want to hear, don't want to consider, don't want to argue. But, like, that's normal because we're human and we're imperfect and not all scholars and practiced debaters.

    Regarding the example, use of a private jet might be the most effective method if it means more people would change their actions (limit their emissions) than would not if they hadn't heard the message. The amount used in one private jet might be x amount of gases, but if more than x amount are reduced because of the use of the jet there's an argument to be made that it was worth it and not even hypocritical. One can still argue that there are better ways, but then you're getting into a much larger discussion.
    Click to expand...

    I agree. Hypocrisy is being lauded as a bad thing nowadays, but if the message is correct, why does it matter if the person is betraying it? Cow farts are causing climate as much, if not more than airline travel does.

    In fact, humans and every living thing exist to speed up entropy in the universe. The whole climate change thing has always been about 'saving ourselves' and not about 'saving the planet'. Now, is it hypocritical for Leonardo DiCaprio to use the private jet? Perhaps, but he's a millionaire, he can probably afford the Ark from the movie 2012 if something like a global flood would occur. In fact, he could probably afford a private jet than can fly on forever as the world flooded.

    Does it matter if we're calling him a hypocrite if we're drowning? Probably not. The most we can do is lynch him for being a hypocrite but we'll still drown if we ignore his message. Or maybe if we still don't want to listen to him, we can move away from the coast and settle in higher ground. I've always believed that calling people out for their own bull is important, but solving the problem is more important. If their advice is valid, why not?

    If anything, we know the true reason he made the documentary. It's not about climate change, it's not about how he's crazy or a hypocrite. It's about the moneeey and we hate him more for that than being a hypocrite really. But again, why does it matter? In fact, the most hypocrite thing I hear everyday is about how everyone doesn't care about money, they're doing it for something else (passion, love, good) etc. I hate this kind of hypocrisy more than a celebrity flying around flaunting their wealth while causing minor climate change with their private planes, preaching about climate change. At least, they're telling people to stop screwing themselves.
     
    Pinkie-Dawn said:
    This is a classic form of hypocrisy
    Click to expand...
    That isn't an example of hypocrisy, it's the definition of it.

    So I suppose the thread is just about what I think of hypocrisy. Hypocrisy is bad and says a lot about your character, but, as others have said, nothing about your argument.

    Dismissing an argument because it is hypocritical is a fallacy creatively named the appeal to hypocrisy. If a member of the KKK tells you that racism is wrong, that's probably not what they really think - they're being massively hypocritical. But the statement that racism is wrong is still true - the fact that the person is a hypocrite doesn't impact their argument at all. It's a type of ad hominem attack - you're trying to refute an argument not on the basis of the argument itself but on the basis of the person saying it. In this case, their history.

    Rune said:
    I agree. Hypocrisy is being lauded as a bad thing nowadays, but if the message is correct, why does it matter if the person is betraying it?
    Click to expand...
    I mean, hypocrisy is still a bad thing.
     
    Caaethil said:
    I mean, hypocrisy is still a bad thing.
    Click to expand...

    Good and bad is relative. After all, the most hypocritical groups in the world paint themselves as the most moral XD
     
    Not much to add here. "Don't do drugs" is a pretty good bit of advice, even if it does come from a drug addict...
     
    I really do think people who can't follow their own rules have no business telling others what to do.
     
    gimmepie said:
    I agree from an ethical standpoint. It doesn't really devalue the message either though.
    Click to expand...
    I think it devalues it in the sense that if they can't follow their own example, then what value did it really have to them? If it doesn't seem to be so valuable to them, then what does that say to the people they're preaching it to?

    People would probably be more willing to lead by some aesop if the people spouting those aesops showed they at least value it enough to not break it on a whim.
     
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