Lets Be Honest ...... -_-

[Piii]

To be fair Ash only seemed mature in the XY series, he's the same character he was in DP. And a bit like his BW counterpart albeit with out the stupidity of forgetting things. People assumed Ash was more mature because of how both Clemont and Serena looked up to him, and often put him on a pedestal. The design of his outfit also helped since it was a tight fighting blue jacket that made him look taller than he was in previous sagas, when in reality he's still shorter than his female companion.

And reality check to all those XY fan's the saga's "DARK" tone, only materialized in the literal back end of XY not the majority (Only foreshadowed in episode 92 & 93 with the prophecy of the hero of Kalos, and Mega evolution special IV). With the rest of the show before that being standard pokemon fair.

We'll never get the old animation style back, that's counterintuitive. Why would they return to an clearly obsolete way of animation and design... We could see a hybrid between the old style and the SM style however, kinda how the Ash in M20 is drawn.

The old animation was much better then the current animation that they used nowadays. I doubt the old animation will ever be used again since it is outdated now. Ash still acted immature in both AG and DP, but he still mad stupid mistakes in those two series, the only two series he did acted more mature in were both BW and XY, there were only a few times that he did acted childless in both of these two series.

 

[CidHazard]

The old animation was much better then the current animation that they used nowadays. I doubt the old animation will ever be used again since it is outdated now.

Wait... so still frames with only mouth flaps and no other actions on screen, other than basic facial animations is better how? It may generate better still shots, but in terms of movement and actual "ANIMATION" it's much better.

It's OK to rail on the character designs since it's personal preference. I get where people are coming from. But the animation on the show is objectively superior and much more consistent than the older series hands down...

Here's a well researched video by the Canipa effect on the subject.

The Canipa Effect: Animation spot light sun and moon.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrBH3IYRjaw&t=324s

 

[Frozocrone]

Wait... so still frames with only mouth flaps and no other actions on screen, other than basic facial animations is better how? It may generate better still shots, but in terms of movement and actual "ANIMATION" it's much better.

It's OK to rail on the character designs since it's personal preference. I get where people are coming from. But the animation on the show is objectively superior and much more consistent than the older series hands down...

Here's a well researched video by the Canipa effect on the subject.

The Canipa Effect: Animation spot light sun and moon.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrBH3IYRjaw&t=324s

Even when I do see mouth flaps, the characters move and react to people talking.

 

[BettyNewbie]

These arguments only prove why Ash should've been retired as a protagonist after Johto. When you keep a main character around for 20+ years, you're forced to constantly "reset" his personality every few years to keep things "fresh," dooming him to never having consistent characterization or any kind of continuity in his storyline. XY wasn't any less guilty of this than SM, nor were AG, DP, and BW.

 

[Purist of Black Water]

Ash looks weird af in his design. Everyone else is fine.
Just ash looks so much off putting, among the rest of the cast.

I'd still watch it though, cause I cannot say no to the pokemon.

 

[Hikamaru]

And either way, I'm also liking that SM is actually bringing about a league. It's about high time, especially after how they openly advertised that they won't have one since before it aired.

The fact Kukui mentioned he'd construct a Pokemon League is not just to shoutout the games, but to maybe rescue the series from its haters because it has been my new least favourite due to the drastic change of the artstyle and format, on top of Ash's dorkiest design and worst outfit to date, which looked completely copy and pasted from the games.

When it was announced the school would be Ash's main goal for Alola and that the trials were pushed to the side to have the school be the main focus, I was worried bad because of how rushed the trials were, even completely skipping the Fire-type trial. If the league is rushed as well or if Ash loses in a stupid way (which would be extremely trollish considering he's been a Gary Stu when it comes to beating trials so far), Sun & Moon will officially end its run as my least favourite Pokemon series of all time.

 

[janejane6178]

Can people stop trashing on the art style, jesus ****ing christ.

And Pokemon is literally always has been and always will be. Just because it's more """childish"" looking doesn't make it any less for kids than it already was.

Jesus Christ.

Sorry for hating the new artstyle. and yes- I try to ignore it but I cant. Ash looks retarded. I can tolerate everything, from the so many new characters, non-traveling concept , school stuff, hardly battling but NOT this.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

The fact Kukui mentioned he'd construct a Pokemon League is not just to shoutout the games, but to maybe rescue the series from its haters because it has been my new least favourite due to the drastic change of the artstyle and format, on top of Ash's dorkiest design and worst outfit to date, which looked completely copy and pasted from the games.

When it was announced the school would be Ash's main goal for Alola and that the trials were pushed to the side to have the school be the main focus, I was worried bad because of how rushed the trials were, even completely skipping the Fire-type trial. If the league is rushed as well or if Ash loses in a stupid way (which would be extremely trollish considering he's been a Gary Stu when it comes to beating trials so far), Sun & Moon will officially end its run as my least favourite Pokemon series of all time.

Yeah. As bad as BW was (the only good things about that series were Charizard making a grand reappearance and probably Iris, TBH), at least it made an effort to try and allow Ash to compete in a league from the start. Removing the league from the anime via SM just destroyed the entire point of the anime. And yeah, let's hope that this time, Ash actually wins and doesn't lose. It's bad enough that Ash lost prior leagues, especially Kalos when they if anything made it seem as though Ash was actually going to win this time around, but if they have him lose this particular one especially when it's the first annual league in Alola, all I'm going to say is that, even WITH Misty and Brock returning, the franchise is officially beyond the point of return. We can only stomach so many losses before it becomes unwatchable.

 

[Hikamaru]

Yeah. As bad as BW was (the only good things about that series were Charizard making a grand reappearance and probably Iris, TBH), at least it made an effort to try and allow Ash to compete in a league from the start. Removing the league from the anime via SM just destroyed the entire point of the anime. And yeah, let's hope that this time, Ash actually wins and doesn't lose. It's bad enough that Ash lost prior leagues, especially Kalos when they if anything made it seem as though Ash was actually going to win this time around, but if they have him lose this particular one especially when it's the first annual league in Alola, all I'm going to say is that, even WITH Misty and Brock returning, the franchise is officially beyond the point of return. We can only stomach so many losses before it becomes unwatchable.

I agree. Having Ash not win the first Alola League would be what I call absolute trolling by the writers and a sign that the anime is dead as we know it. Considering how much more immature and childish Ash has been acting in SM (even if his battling skills didn't reset like in BW) I feel a possible way Ash could lose would be him forgetting about the league and running late or even worse, be like Cameron and forget to bring a full team, which I could see happening if Ash wants to pull a Hoenn/Unova/Kalos and only use his regional team with no reserves.

 

[dragonAB]

Even if Ash loses he should lose to Gladion and no one else.

 

[janejane6178]

I showed a friend of mine, who watched only the OS series LONG LONG time ago, a picture of SM Ash and she immediately was like : " What did they do to Ash ?? " LOL

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

I agree. Having Ash not win the first Alola League would be what I call absolute trolling by the writers and a sign that the anime is dead as we know it. Considering how much more immature and childish Ash has been acting in SM (even if his battling skills didn't reset like in BW) I feel a possible way Ash could lose would be him forgetting about the league and running late or even worse, be like Cameron and forget to bring a full team, which I could see happening if Ash wants to pull a Hoenn/Unova/Kalos and only use his regional team with no reserves.

Yeah, especially when there's nowhere else for him to go but to win thanks to Kalos having Ash become runner up. With Johto, DP, and Kalos, at least he advanced in the ranks even if he didn't necessarily win. And honestly, having him lose in the manner you described would be even WORSE.

And your comment about only using his regional team with no reserves reminds me, I'm actually a bit surprised he didn't even bother using his reserves for Kalos, considering that they could have at least used his Hoenn team for promotional material for ORAS. Though to be fair, he did technically use Charizard in Unova, which is technically one of his reserves. But yeah. Either way, let's hope they don't blow this opportunity for Ash to actually WIN a game league for once. Having him win would more than make up for not just the loss in Kalos, but how utterly pointless of a loss it was due to forcing him out of doing a league afterwards until now. Honestly, the whole issue of forcing Ash out of the league, out of his goal, was bad enough that I'm even willing to tolerate the bad art style for SM if it at LEAST meant seeing Ash win a league just this once.

 

[Hikamaru]

Yeah, especially when there's nowhere else for him to go but to win thanks to Kalos having Ash become runner up. With Johto, DP, and Kalos, at least he advanced in the ranks even if he didn't necessarily win. And honestly, having him lose in the manner you described would be even WORSE.

And your comment about only using his regional team with no reserves reminds me, I'm actually a bit surprised he didn't even bother using his reserves for Kalos, considering that they could have at least used his Hoenn team for promotional material for ORAS. Though to be fair, he did technically use Charizard in Unova, which is technically one of his reserves. But yeah. Either way, let's hope they don't blow this opportunity for Ash to actually WIN a game league for once. Having him win would more than make up for not just the loss in Kalos, but how utterly pointless of a loss it was due to forcing him out of doing a league afterwards until now. Honestly, the whole issue of forcing Ash out of the league, out of his goal, was bad enough that I'm even willing to tolerate the bad art style for SM if it at LEAST meant seeing Ash win a league just this once.

I mean, with my statement of Ash being so immature he'll forget the crucial parts of a league, another thing I see with Cameron is that SM Ash's outfit reminds me of Cameron. Ash for the first time is not wearing long pants for a regional outfit, but shorts. This makes me concerned that wearing shorts coupled with the childish persona he's had in SM means he'll be just as dumb as Cameron, if not dumber and we all knew Cameron was a disaster.

I do agree that Ash should have brought back the Hoenn team in XY for ORAS promotion, but they instead decided to force it onto Sawyer with his Sceptile. I mean, during the XYZ portion Ash did get too obsessed with Ash-Greninja that he lost a battle because of it not activating.

We know that Ash is terrible at school stuff, as in projects and book stuff. Having him forget what to do at a league will be even worse than losing to Cameron or the extremely controversial loss to Alain. It's clear I don't tolerate characters who act dumb.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

I mean, with my statement of Ash being so immature he'll forget the crucial parts of a league, another thing I see with Cameron is that SM Ash's outfit reminds me of Cameron. Ash for the first time is not wearing long pants for a regional outfit, but shorts. This makes me concerned that wearing shorts coupled with the childish persona he's had in SM means he'll be just as dumb as Cameron, if not dumber and we all knew Cameron was a disaster.

I do agree that Ash should have brought back the Hoenn team in XY for ORAS promotion, but they instead decided to force it onto Sawyer with his Sceptile. I mean, during the XYZ portion Ash did get too obsessed with Ash-Greninja that he lost a battle because of it not activating.

We know that Ash is terrible at school stuff, as in projects and book stuff. Having him forget what to do at a league will be even worse than losing to Cameron or the extremely controversial loss to Alain. It's clear I don't tolerate characters who act dumb.

Yeah, no kidding regarding Cameron, he made even Unova Ash seem like a genius. And I really don't want Ash to sink down to even his level. And yeah, I'm not fond of characters who act dumb, especially when they definitely should actually know better. I could tolerate it with green characters since they're starting out, but not with characters who are veterans. Let's hope Ash actually WINS this time around and that the writers don't blow it.

 

[Hikamaru]

Yeah, no kidding regarding Cameron, he made even Unova Ash seem like a genius. And I really don't want Ash to sink down to even his level. And yeah, I'm not fond of characters who act dumb, especially when they definitely should actually know better. I could tolerate it with green characters since they're starting out, but not with characters who are veterans. Let's hope Ash actually WINS this time around and that the writers don't blow it.

Ash is meant to be a skilled trainer, not a trainer who doesn't know what he's doing. It made sense for the Original series since he was starting out, but not for the current series. SM has already broken one anime tradition which was adventure through the region and having a larger group, so surely the writers could break the status quo that comes with a league as well.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

Ash is meant to be a skilled trainer, not a trainer who doesn't know what he's doing. It made sense for the Original series since he was starting out, but not for the current series. SM has already broken one anime tradition which was adventure through the region and having a larger group, so surely the writers could break the status quo that comes with a league as well.

Yeah agreed. Then again, we also thought the same thing with XY where they averted him getting the grass starter, actually getting Goodra back, among others, yet they STILL stuck to the status quo. On the other hand, after the really negative responses on Twitter to the Kalos win, I'm doubtful they're going to be repeating that mistake, not unless they actually WANT the audiences to hate them. After all, the writers don't want to be like the NFL or Disney and side with things that would lose them money, right?

 

[Hikamaru]

Yeah agreed. Then again, we also thought the same thing with XY where they averted him getting the grass starter, actually getting Goodra back, among others, yet they STILL stuck to the status quo. On the other hand, after the really negative responses on Twitter to the Kalos win, I'm doubtful they're going to be repeating that mistake, not unless they actually WANT the audiences to hate them. After all, the writers don't want to be like the NFL or Disney and side with things that would lose them money, right?

It's actually true, because while Kalos did break some traditions it didn't break the losing the league tradition. And as the response on Twitter indicated, the writers must have realised the worst mistake they ever made, especially with the hugely clickbait Japanese title. If I was someone in charge of the anime, I would have fired those writers because it's something you'll never live down.

I mean, the writers are really trying to make me hate Ash, such as having SM turn him all dorky and childish, which I cannot relate to because I already feel like I'm a horrible person with my autism and I also had a fear the SM portrayal of Ash is making him into an offensive stereotype towards autistic people. Doesn't help that some disabilities make people unattractive that they stick out like a sore thumb.

Ash is meant to be a character kids can look up to, and having him act dumb is going to spread the wrong message to them. Another problem is that Ash doesn't seem to care about his friends anymore, and will only seem to do something with them if he's dragged into it, which was not like he acted in previous generations. SM Ash just feels so heartless when you look at it, which makes me so sad because I care about likeable character traits and so far SM Ash is showing the opposite of that.

If the writers make Ash lose the inaugural Alola league, then it's clear that they are nothing but Ash haters and believe the whole "winning the league means the end" thing.

 

[Pinkie-Dawn]

All the usual suspects on this subforum still think the SM anime is a disaster? You're either too nostalgic for the older series or got spoiled by the Kalos saga. Next week, SM's plot will start to get really good now that Nebby and the Aether Foundation are coming soon.

Even if Ash loses he should lose to Gladion and no one else.

Ash already lost to an edgelord trainer last gen, I don't think fans will appreciate him losing to another edgelord trainer.

 

[Hikamaru]

All the usual suspects on this subforum still think the SM anime is a disaster? You're either too nostalgic for the older series or got spoiled by the Kalos saga. Next week, SM's plot will start to get really good now that Nebby and the Aether Foundation are coming soon.

Remember that it was a mess when it started out, and while the Nebby and Aether Foundation arc may be the start of something serious finally happening, Weedle (or at least I think it was him) said that the anime has dug itself into a hole it can't get out of.

SM has been the most divisive anime to date so far, due to the extreme mixed reception when it was announced. It's like the writers seem to always experiment with stuff every time a new generation starts, and to be honest it doesn't seem to work. You can tell if something is not working out with the target audience based on the bad ratings as of late, with XY being a ratings flop in Japan while SM is doing better (likely due to the Yo-Kai Watch influences on the format) but still not enough.

 

[janejane6178]

Remember that it was a mess when it started out, and while the Nebby and Aether Foundation arc may be the start of something serious finally happening, Weedle (or at least I think it was him) said that the anime has dug itself into a hole it can't get out of.

SM has been the most divisive anime to date so far, due to the extreme mixed reception when it was announced. It's like the writers seem to always experiment with stuff every time a new generation starts, and to be honest it doesn't seem to work. You can tell if something is not working out with the target audience based on the bad ratings as of late, with XY being a ratings flop in Japan while SM is doing better (likely due to the Yo-Kai Watch influences on the format) but still not enough.

I agree with every word and I think that the SM anime is horrible. It made my interest in Pokemon get straight down.