Tug o' War Pokémon edition

[𒈟Lavemu𒐫]

99

W O O F

 

[~Cinderace~]

100

Someone:

Fire breathing Dragon vs fire breathing dog which would win?

Me:

Dragons!!

 

[Zeostar]

99.

I agree with lavender. Woof.

 

[FeraligatrMaster]

100.

I've never been a dog person.

 

[ReKoil]

99.

I'm not big on dogs in general, but Arcanine is a good one.

97




It was from anime, where Aerodactyl was taunting him, which forced him to evolve into Charizard !!

Ah the Anime... I don't watch it tbh.
Saw Indigo League as a kid and I mainly remember Ash being a baka and not much else.

 

[VisionofMilotic]

Hello there !!
Nice to meet after you after long time !!
👋
I was surprised that Rock Slide is not available, but still we had got Wild Charge. So let me go by it :

Spoiler: Case 1 : Charizard with Choice Band + Jolly

"image removed"


There's 43% chance to KO with Earthquake, but can change to 100% KO with Attack boosting Nature, but then Charizard will be slower than Arcanine, and with Choice Scarf, Wild Charge will be guaranteed OHKO.

And do note that Wild Charge is guaranteed OHKO here.

Spoiler: Case 2: Slowing Arcanine....

"image removed"


By having 196 EVs for speed, and remaining 60 in defense, Jolly Nature Arcanine makes sure that he can survive Earthquake from Charizard with 95% probability. One can may think for changing to Adamant Nature and equip Choice Scarf, but then 196 EVs are enough to outspeed that version of Charizard.

Spoiler: Case 3: Impish Arcanine

"image removed"


This Arcanine will be slower than any variant of Charizard, so Adamant + Choice Band is the best bet for later. But then Charizard fails to beat him straight away. Then one can say that, since Charizard is faster, why not invest 252 EVs in Defense instead and make Charizard bulky :


"image removed"


In this case, since I know that Arcanine will be outspeeded, hence I accepted that and invested in Wild Charge instead. Electric Gem boosts the Wild Charge on first hit, then survive an Earthquake and then go for Extreme Speed to revenge Kill. Also tried giving Ground Gem to Charizard, but damage growth is not much, and Choice Band Arcanine will get guaranteed 2HKO, and Choice Scarf doesn't helps to Charizard, as damage will be guaranteed less than 50% with Earthquake, so revenge kill will be easy.

And since this is 2HKO scenario and Arcanine is slower, I will prefer to equip Weakness Policy as one Earthquake will make Arcanine's attack sharply raised, and that can get better winning chance for Legendary Pokémon !

99

😁😁😁😁😁

100.

It's exciting to get to know you too, welcome to the forum! I hope you are having fun.

Now here is a strategy for equipping Charizard with a waccan berry to reduce the power of electric attacks. Again, you would not normally see this over choice specs, life orb, heavy boots and Charizard's other go-to items, but the purpose of it was for matchups against Regieleki in VGC 2021. If I gave it that, then even a wild charge from a banded Arcanine becomes a guaranteed 2hko against a Charizard with 0 defense evs. This Charizard would not stay a physical attacker but go back to being a special sweeper with it's timid nature, and instead of earthquake use scorching sands on Kantonian Arcanine. It's a guaranteed 2hko, on the choice band Arcanine with max attack, speed and 4 special defense, but since it will have the health to hit twice thanks to the berry this is not a problem.

Spoiler: Charizard

https://postimg.cc/5jxnpnBG]
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Arcanine does like defensive ev spreads and nature, as you mentioned, it's a versatile pokemon that can attack or defend, but if it's a choice band set though I would say it's not really made for that kind of investment, you want to keep all the speed and offensive presence for sweeping potential. It can be a good wall, bulky support mon and pivot, but you it would not be fun to lose the freedom to hold items like leftovers, rocky helmet and use non-damaging moves like status-inflict, phasing and healing.

The gems could be really powerful, but they are not legal any more, which is kind of a bummer but I guess I can see why Game Freak though they were too overpowered to keep in the games. If we could go back and use any set though I would be pulling out the mega charizards! :)

 

[FeraligatrMaster]

101.

I think Game Freak thought Fire/Dragon would've been too powerful for Charizard back in Gen 1.

 

[Alex_Among_Foxes]

102

I think Game Freak thought Fire/Dragon would've been too powerful for Charizard back in Gen 1.

I agree with their views on it back in Gen 1, but these days there are plenty of common ways to easily handle Dragon Types. I say they should make a regional Charizard that's Dragon/Fire!

 

[VisionofMilotic]

103.

And I think they also didn't want to steal thunder from the Dragonite, intending dragon to be this one-of-a-kind almost holy grail of an encounter like a legendary. At least Chazard does have wings though and can fly through the air since it is the image of a medieval dragon, it's more of a stretch that to me that Gyarados is a water flying type. While eastern dragons, which Gyarados is based on, are associated with the sky/heavens as well as the sea, if that is what they were going for why not also make it a dragon when it mega evolves, instead of a water/dark type? At least now though we can make our own dragons with tera types. I love all of these pokemon by the way.

 

[FeraligatrMaster]

104.

If Charizard gets a regional form, then we also need to give a regional form to a Water and a Grass type starter. Maybe Venusaur and Blastoise?

 

[ReKoil]

103.

Poor Charizard's Poke Ride in gen 7 got reduced to what is basically a fancy loading screen
Would've been far cooler to actually fly around on it like you can in LGPE, even if it's only in postgame in LGPE.

 

[𒈟Lavemu𒐫]

102

Or like the Latis in ORAS.

 

[VisionofMilotic]

103

2024 is the year of the dragon, according to the Chinese zodiac. What better way to celebrate the dawning of a new time, and a new trivia game, than with our own version of a dragon- Charizard? What makes this matchup also intriguing is that in astrology the dragon sign is supposed to be opposed to the dog sign, so as fate would have it, the dog pokemon and dragon are fighting one another here in this thread.

 

[Devalue]

104

May not have really used either Pokemon. Brought along a Growlithe in the last Get-Together challenge. Mainly caught it to satisfy a rule. Never accomplished anything. Grabbed it late too, after leveling a ton in other segments. Would not have been great in the Elite Four either, given how much it would have had to carry (despite being a strong Pokemon overall).

Also had a Charmeleon (from Wonder Trade, originally Charmander) in a Moon playthrough. Chose between dropping Ninetales (with Drought) and Charmeleon. Dropped the latter. Fought with the level cap a lot because of the trade-boosted experience.

 

[Delta Crowned Sword]

103

Arcanine(H) with Focus Sash + Head Smash + Extreme Speed to keep things simple and direct.

 

[FeraligatrMaster]

104.

It'd have to be lucky to not get flinched with Air Slash.

 

[Fact Checking Gardevoir]

103

Let's give some more love to the best big dog!

 

[ReKoil]

102.

Air Slash is a 30% flinch chance though. Arcanine is not the one that needs to get lucky.
Charizard is the one that has to get lucky to get that 30% chance.
70% chance on average for Charizard to lose, as no flinch = Charizard loses guaranteed.

Could boost that a bit with King's Rock, but that's still not going over 50%. nvm Bulba says it only gives moves that don't already have a chance to flinch a boost.

"Grants all attacking moves that do not already have a chance to flinch a 10% chance of causing each target to flinch."


Punched in a Charti Berry (that berry that reduces super effective Rock type damage) holding Charizard just out of curiosity. Hisui Arcanine's Head Smash would do still do 185.8 - 218.8% of HP in damage, despite the berry.

So unless Charizards gets the flinch, a Focus Sash or Air Balloon holding Hisui Arcanine would obliterate it.
Good luck relying on that 30% chance. It's dead the remaining 70% of the time =P


Edit:

There is a bit of an accuracy problem with Head Smash. I checked Smack Down & Power Gem as those are 100% accurate, but they don't deal enough damage to a Charti Berry Charizard to be able to finish it off on turn 2 with ExtremeSpeed.

Fortunately there's Rock Tomb, which is 95% accurate just like Air Slash, which deals a minimum of 74.7% damage against a Charti Berry Charizard. Which is enough for ExtremeSpeed to kill it on turn 2 with a minimum damage of 33.3%.

Could potentially run Arcanine specially in which case Power Gem would do a minimum of 80.8% hp in damage after Charti Berry damage reduction, if Arcanine were to be made Timid and with Sp. Attack EV's maxed instead of Attack.
Extreme Speed would then still be able to finish it off with 24.2% minimum damage.

 

[Delta Crowned Sword]

101


Currently I am busy in building an original reptile-dragon a.k.a Salamence, as today is Salamence Community Day....

(Rather than finding yet another way to defeat Charizard !)

 

[FeraligatrMaster]

102.

If Salamence was in Charizard's place, I'd be voting down right now. But since it isn't, I'll keep voting up.