[Question] Opinions on the Elite Four and Champion?

[Poke fan number 489]

Am I the only one who found the elite 4 this gen very underwhelming?
Rika, Larry, Hassel, and Geeta are wearing suits. Poppy has the most interesting design unique to the elite four, but I can't be excited for their battle because they look like a toddler. Larry was a gym leader, despite being the best character here. Hassel and Rika barely match their typing, all Poppy has is coloring and a big stupid key necklace, and Larry is meant to hide his flying theming despite having the strongest theming that doesn't look stupid. I hate that damn key necklace. Geeta lacks involvement in the entire story, and she isn't the final boss of the Victory Road storyline, Nemona is.

Their teams are mostly okay. Hassel has some good dragon types, and the region pseudo. Larry has some good flying types. Poppy has an excellent team, maybe the best. Rika has a Clodsire, so I can't complain.

Geeta is a complete joke. She has an Espatha, an Gogoat, an Avalugg, an Veluza without it's signature move that's an second psychic type, a Kingambit that might be tossed out third, AND A TOXIC SPIKES SETTER AS HER ACE. She is pathetic, and I've seen her toss Avalugg and Kingambit into a fire type before, while she had Veluza. Leon might have been hyped into the moon, but his team didn't make me laugh. I DON'T LAUGH AT AEGISLASH, BUT I ONLY LAUGH AT THE ICE TABLE. Diantha had a Mega, and a Goodra. Trace had a Mega. She has nothing, and her team is boring. Gogoat and Avalugg were boring in their region, and Kofu had a Veluza. Her ace is just wrong, it should be her lead. An ace is the most important part of a trainer, and a good one can become just as iconic. You hear just as many jokes about Cynthia's Garchomp being undefeatable as Cynthia herself. THE ONLY JOKES GLIMORA WILL GET IS ABOUT HOW BAD IT IS AS AN ACE. I don't care how good your character is, and she isn't that great, if you drop "I am utterly incapable of holding back" and are this pathetic then you deserve to be made fun of for decades.
Also she doesn't let you become champion for fun, so you can't just battle because you enjoy it.
Geeta banned fun.

 

[Sweet Serenity]

Am I the only one who found the elite 4 this gen very underwhelming?
Rika, Larry, Hassel, and Geeta are wearing suits. Poppy has the most interesting design unique to the elite four, but I can't be excited for their battle because they look like a toddler. Larry was a gym leader, despite being the best character here. Hassel and Rika barely match their typing, all Poppy has is coloring and a big stupid key necklace, and Larry is meant to hide his flying theming despite having the strongest theming that doesn't look stupid. I hate that damn key necklace. Geeta lacks involvement in the entire story, and she isn't the final boss of the Victory Road storyline, Nemona is.

Their teams are mostly okay. Hassel has some good dragon types, and the region pseudo. Larry has some good flying types. Poppy has an excellent team, maybe the best. Rika has a Clodsire, so I can't complain.

Geeta is a complete joke. She has an Espatha, an Gogoat, an Avalugg, an Veluza without it's signature move that's an second psychic type, a Kingambit that might be tossed out third, AND A TOXIC SPIKES SETTER AS HER ACE. She is pathetic, and I've seen her toss Avalugg and Kingambit into a fire type before, while she had Veluza. Leon might have been hyped into the moon, but his team didn't make me laugh. I DON'T LAUGH AT AEGISLASH, BUT I ONLY LAUGH AT THE ICE TABLE. Diantha had a Mega, and a Goodra. Trace had a Mega. She has nothing, and her team is boring. Gogoat and Avalugg were boring in their region, and Kofu had a Veluza. Her ace is just wrong, it should be her lead. An ace is the most important part of a trainer, and a good one can become just as iconic. You hear just as many jokes about Cynthia's Garchomp being undefeatable as Cynthia herself. THE ONLY JOKES GLIMORA WILL GET IS ABOUT HOW BAD IT IS AS AN ACE. I don't care how good your character is, and she isn't that great, if you drop "I am utterly incapable of holding back" and are this pathetic then you deserve to be made fun of for decades.
Also she doesn't let you become champion for fun, so you can't just battle because you enjoy it.
Geeta banned fun.

As for what I believe about the Elite Four this generation, they were easy just like most other sets of Elite Four. I very rarely expect a challenge from any of them. The most challenging Elite Four I could say that I faced was in generation 5. Generation 7 was also a little challenging as well. I don't think any other Elite Four ever topped them. Character wise, I'm not really a big fan of any of them to be honest. They're just not memorable. As for the poll, I voted "neutral." I don't like or dislike any of them.

I still don't understand the hate that Geeta gets. I agree that Geeta doesn't have the best team, but her team isn't as bad as people think it is. In addition, no champion in the entire Pokémon series has a truly good well put together team except Blue from Red, Blue, and Yellow and their remakes. The main issue with Geeta isn't really her team, but rather the order that she uses her team, poor movesets, and her ability choices. Despite the two Psychic types, her team actually has a pretty decent structure. I agree that her ace, Glimmora, should have been sent out first. Nothing is wrong with sending out an ace first, as Guzma always sent out his Golisopod first, which is ironic because it should have been sent out last. Glimmora could be used a great hazard setter. You might laugh at the "ice table" Avalugg, but Avalugg could be a fearsome physical wall if used correctly. If NPCs had any sort of good AI, they would switch in Avalugg every time you attempt a physical attack to completely wall you. Gogoat can be used as a decent defensive Pokémon as well, but not without Grassy Terrain on the field.

However, Gogoat is the main Pokémon that is really out of place for her and should be replaced, which I will explain later. Veluza is a good choice. With Filet Away and a Sitrus Berry, Veluza could be an extremely dangerous sweeper, especially with its hidden ability "Sharpness" with moves like Psycho Cut and Aqua Cutter. I know this personally because I use Veluza on one of my own competitive teams to great success. However, she doesn't seem to run Veluza this way, which is bad for her. Espartha is a very good Pokémon that I also use competitively. Because of its ability to learn Calm Mind and Speed Boost as a hidden ability, it would be a great special sweeper and could be used a great Baton Passer for another special sweeper such as her Glimmora. However, again, she doesn't run it this way and it doesn't have Speed Boost, which is, again, bad for her. You mention that it is bad that she has two Psychic-type Pokémon, but you forget that the gimmick for this generation is Tera Types. Because of that, it's fine to have two of the same type if you can change its typing when possible.

I agree that Kingambit should have been the Pokémon she saved for last as well. However, the main issue with her team is that she has too many weaknesses to Bug and Fire-type Pokémon. Other than that, her structure is decent, as she has a fair balance of special and physical attackers. It's just that the AI for her character uses her Pokémon for the wrong roles, which is not good. Thus, I can't really say that Geeta is pathetic. Her main issue is that the developers didn't have her use her team to its full potential. A lot of people say that this game was "rushed," so maybe this might be a reason for that. It also doesn't help that she is an NPC. An actual human player might be able to find some success with this team. If I had to make a major correction with her team, I am fine with replacing Gogoat with Kilowattrel. This Pokémon would remove a lot of her team's weaknesses, such as both her Bug and Fire weaknesses, and give her some extra coverage because Electric/Flying can cover a decent amount of types.

In addition, Kilowattrel can learn Tailwind, which can give her other Pokémon a much needed speed boost since many of them are slow, and because of its ability Wind Power, it would automatically get a boost for its Electric-type attacks from its own Tailwind. Kilowattrel is also a gen 9 Pokémon, which I believe a gen 9 champion should have more of. However, I don't even think that Geeta is the worst champion. I believe that title belongs to Diantha. She has Pokémon with 4 weaknesses to Ice, and 3 to Steel and Fairy. One top of that, she only has two physical attackers and four special attackers, which is bad balance. She was also extremely easy to defeat. One top of that, she is a full-time blockbuster actress. Being a Champion is only a part-time job for her, so she had no involvement in the story other than that early cameo when talking to Lysandre. Diantha is easily the worst champion in the entire series. With that said, it makes little sense to me to hate a character so much for having a "bad team" when hardly any champion has a good team to begin with, except for Blue. What champion do you believe actually has a good team?

 

[Orion☆]

I'll go straight to the point: They're the most infuriatingly overrated Elite Four in the entire franchise. I generally think that Elite Four members get way too much fanart for the small role they play in-game (with the possible exception of the original Elite Four, the Alola Elite Four, and Koga who got promoted there), but. My. God. I can't go looking for S/V fanart without R*ka, H*ssel, L*rry or G**ta popping up every other picture and I'm absolutely sick of it. I find all of them to be various combinations of shady, boring and/or unpleasant. They all look like a syndicate of hired killers or criminals too, which only adds to my pessimistic view of them. I also have insulting nicknames for all of them, but explaining them would take me more space than I'm willing to use.

Poppy is the only saving grace in this human cesspool, and the catch is that she shouldn't even be here. She's way too young to be on the League's payroll. I fear for her future if people like those four are the ones raising her.

 

[Poke fan number 489]

I still don't understand the hate that Geeta gets. I agree that Geeta doesn't have the best team, but her team isn't as bad as people think it is. In addition, no champion in the entire Pokémon series has a truly good well put together team except Blue from Red, Blue, and Yellow and their remakes. The main issue with Geeta isn't really her team, but rather the order that she uses her team, poor movesets, and her ability choices. Despite the two Psychic types, her team actually has a pretty decent structure. I agree that her ace, Glimmora, should have been sent out first. Nothing is wrong with sending out an ace first, as Guzma always sent out his Golisopod first, which is ironic because it should have been sent out last. Glimmora could be used a great hazard setter. You might laugh at the "ice table" Avalugg, but Avalugg could be a fearsome physical wall if used correctly. If NPCs had any sort of good AI, they would switch in Avalugg every time you attempt a physical attack to completely wall you. Gogoat can be used as a decent defensive Pokémon as well, but not without Grassy Terrain on the field.

However, Gogoat is the main Pokémon that is really out of place for her and should be replaced, which I will explain later. Veluza is a good choice. With Filet Away and a Sitrus Berry, Veluza could be an extremely dangerous sweeper, especially with its hidden ability "Sharpness" with moves like Psycho Cut and Aqua Cutter. I know this personally because I use Veluza on one of my own competitive teams to great success. However, she doesn't seem to run Veluza this way, which is bad for her. Espartha is a very good Pokémon that I also use competitively. Because of its ability to learn Calm Mind and Speed Boost as a hidden ability, it would be a great special sweeper and could be used a great Baton Passer for another special sweeper such as her Glimmora. However, again, she doesn't run it this way and it doesn't have Speed Boost, which is, again, bad for her. You mention that it is bad that she has two Psychic-type Pokémon, but you forget that the gimmick for this generation is Tera Types. Because of that, it's fine to have two of the same type if you can change its typing when possible.

I agree that Kingambit should have been the Pokémon she saved for last as well. However, the main issue with her team is that she has too many weaknesses to Bug and Fire-type Pokémon. Other than that, her structure is decent, as she has a fair balance of special and physical attackers. It's just that the AI for her character uses her Pokémon for the wrong roles, which is not good. Thus, I can't really say that Geeta is pathetic. Her main issue is that the developers didn't have her use her team to its full potential. A lot of people say that this game was "rushed," so maybe this might be a reason for that. It also doesn't help that she is an NPC. An actual human player might be able to find some success with this team. If I had to make a major correction with her team, I am fine with replacing Gogoat with Kilowattrel. This Pokémon would remove a lot of her team's weaknesses, such as both her Bug and Fire weaknesses, and give her some extra coverage because Electric/Flying can cover a decent amount of types.

However, I don't even think that Geeta is the worst champion. I believe that title belongs to Diantha. She has Pokémon with 4 weaknesses to Ice, and 3 to Steel and Fairy. One top of that, she only has two physical attackers and four special attackers, which is bad balance. She was also extremely easy to defeat. One top of that, she is a full-time blockbuster actress. Being a Champion is only a part-time job for her, so she had no involvement in the story other than that early cameo when talking to Lysandre. Diantha is easily the worst champion in the entire series. With that said, it makes little sense to me to hate a character so much for having a "bad team" when hardly any champion has a good team to begin with, except for Blue. What champion do you believe actually has a good team?

Cynthia has a great team several different types and strong mons, Leon has two type overlaps at worse and he has several great Pokémon like Aegislash, Iris despite being a dragon type user has a great team with a large amount types, Alder has a better team despite his gimmick being he uses less powerful Pokémon and is outta his prime, Diantha has a good team with Goodra and Mega Gardevoir, and none of them have such mistakes as using a set-up mon as their ace, not having a Pokémon built to be an last stand not be your ace, or using Gogoat. Blue is one of the lesser champion teams, not the only good one.

Likewise your defense of her team falls under three points. She doesn't have held items, She doesn't have those movesets/abilities, and she uses a Gogoat not a Kilowattrel. Also it doesn't matter what a human could do with her team, she should toss a damn Avalugg into a special attacking fire type when she has Veluza. If her team is fine if you ignore Abilities, Movesets, Gogoat, Order, and the lack of held items, then it's not fine. That five of the main aspects of a team.

Geeta's personality is just "Leon, but she's strict and half of the gym leaders dislike her". Namely Katy dislikes how Geeta wants her to hold back, Tulip thinks she has bad vibes, Grusha is worried about their job, and Larry is overworked. She's a champion who only treats it as a job, which isn't interest because of the main line I pointed out while ranting about her team. "I am utterly incapable of holding back" implies she likes her role, but her actions seem more in line with Larry's character of only viewing it like a job. At least it's not her part time. I also have to bring up the interview, because damn. You see beating Geeta doesn't give you her role, because despite being called the "Top Champion" she isn't the best. That means the role you're going for is the "Strongest Champion". However, despite being a role with no possible rules despite being the best, Geeta put in an interview. An interview you must have a great memory and always be serious for. I remind you, this isn't a job. You are gaining a title as the strongest, not becoming the "Top Champion".

Also her design isn't that fun, it's just a suit with funky sleaves and a stupid looking tie paired with with long hair with yellow streaks in it. Also her artwork makes her hands and legs look too long. Her pinky has three joints.

Finally, sure Diantha has almost no involvement with the main plot, but Geeta is three times as bad. There's three plotlines and she's only important in the Champion one, and she isn't even the final boss of it. I don't like Diantha, stop making me defend her.

I don't just hate Geeta because she has a bad team. I'm either neutral or negative toward almost every single part of her.

Also I missed this, Tera has no bearing on Veluza nor Espatha. They aren't her aces, and honestly if they were I'd dislike Geeta more.

 

[Sweet Serenity]

Cynthia has a great team several different types and strong mons, Leon has two type overlaps at worse and he has several great Pokémon like Aegislash, Iris despite being a dragon type user has a great team with a large amount types, Alder has a better team despite his gimmick being he uses less powerful Pokémon and is outta his prime, Diantha has a good team with Goodra and Mega Gardevoir, and none of them have such mistakes as using a set-up mon as their ace, not having a Pokémon built to be an last stand not be your ace, or using Gogoat. Blue is one of the lesser champion teams, not the only good one. Likewise your defense of her team falls under three points. She doesn't have held items, She doesn't have those movesets/abilities, and she uses a Gogoat not a Kilowattrel. Also it doesn't matter what a human could do with her team, she should toss a damn Avalugg into a special attacking fire type when she has Veluza. If her team is fine if you ignore Abilities, Movesets, Gogoat, Order, and the lack of held items, then it's not fine. That five of the main aspects of a team. You see beating Geeta doesn't give you her role, because despite being called the "Top Champion" she isn't the best. That means the role you're going for is the "Strongest Champion".

I disagree. Cynthia's team is pretty bad, mainly because of her terrible offensive balance and many weaknesses. Her strongest team has five special attackers and too many weaknesses to Ice-type moves. You can stop Cynthia dead in her tracks with a good special defender and wreck 50% of her team with Ice Beam or Blizzard. Leon's team is also not that great, as it has a ton of weaknesses and horrible offensive balance much like Cynthia's team. One of Leon's teams have five special attackers like Cynthia's team, which can be walled by a sturdy special defender, and several weaknesses to Ghost and Dark-type Pokémon. His ace, Charizard, being Fire/Flying also gets wrecked by Stealth Rock, as it takes half its health. As for Iris, her strongest team in Challenge Mode is actually well-balanced, as she has an equal amount of special and physical attackers, and each of her Pokémon have good moves. However, her team is horrible in terms of weaknesses. More than half of them get wrecked by Ice-types, many with double weaknesses to it, and half of them are weak to Fighting, Rock, and Dragon. Despite that, I would say that she is still arguably the toughest champion to defeat in Challenge Mode because of her held items and great movepool choices, as well as Dragon types being extremely broken in gen V.

As for Diantha, I made a mistake in my previous post. I forgot that Gourgeist is a physical attacker. With that, she actually has good offensive balance, with an equal amount of special and physical attackers, but her team does have many weaknesses. Her team has 28 weaknesses total, with more than half weak to Ice-types and the other half weak to Steel and Fairy, and 27 resistances, meaning that her team has more weaknesses than resistances. That's not good at all and only adds to why she is the worst champion. As for Blue, his best team is perfectly balanced. In his games, the physical and special attacking split didn't exist for individual moves yet, but he still had a good combination of mixed attackers, a small number of weakness, and a ton of resistances. Thus, it wasn't possible to wreck half his best team with a single type. He also had the classic Water, Fire, and Grass core in his team, and in the remakes, each of his Pokémon had good abilities and even a Psychic and Dark core. Each of his Pokémon was also capable of hitting every type super-effectively, meaning that Blue's team could literally handle anything defensively and offensively. Thus, in terms of team structure, Blue's team was definitely the best by far compared to any other champion in the entire franchise.

As for Geeta, as I said before, the problem wasn't that much her team, but rather the programming and move selection. The point I was trying to make was that Geeta had the potential to be much more difficult than she appeared if she simply had better moves, used Glimmora first, Kingambit last, and replaced Gogoat. Otherwise, her team itself actually has better structure than most other champions, even with Gogoat, as she has a good mix of special and physical attackers, and even good defenders. Her team also has a ton of resistances too, being able to resist every single type in the game with various different Pokémon in her team. I just personally think that she would be better off without Gogoat though, as it doesn't fit the theme of her team and gives her weaknesses to Fire and Bug. If she is switching Avalugg into a Fire-type special attacker, that sounds more like a programming problem rather than a team problem. As for getting Geeta's role when you beat her, many different types of champions exist in Paldea. Geeta's role is mainly linked to her position in the Pokémon League's board of directors than anything else. With that being said, I still don't understand all the Geeta hate from a lot of fans. If anything, the "hate" should be directed towards the developers who really fumbled making a potentially good team perform at its best.

 

[Corveone]

Here's one way we could improve the Elite Four and Champion in SV: Just don't make it Elite Four and Champion, call it 'Final Exam' or something else since their purpose isn't really the same as in the other games, and they aren't even the final challenge in the main story. The "Champion" title in Paldea has a different meaning, as there can be multiple champions, it's basically just a title that students gain upon graduating from school. The actual champion in these games are either the rival or the spoilers battle that comes at the very end.

I don't see anything to like or dislike about Geeta as a character, because there isn't much going on period, just another flat avatar with no development fulfilling its role, like most characters in the Pokémon universe. As for her team:

Spoiler:

Espathra: There's nothing wrong with this Pokémon on a champion's team at all. Just replace Quick Attack with something else, Lumina Crash is great, Opportunist is great, and Dazzling Gleam for coverage is nice.

Gogoat: Give it Earthquake instead of Zen Headbutt, since EQ takes care of Fire, Steel, and Poison, and for Fighting it already has Play Rough. Psychic coverage seems very situational here.

Avalugg: Give it Sturdy instead of Own Tempo so at least it can survive one attack and retaliate no matter how bad its Special Defense is. Why does a Pokémon that probably nobody will ever try to confuse have Own Tempo to begin with?

Veluza: Give it cutting moves + Sharpness. Fillet Away would likely not work since it'd be likely defeated before taking advantage of it.

Glimmora: Make it lead. Maybe give it an Air Baloon or Focus Sash for an extra chance of triggering its Ability.

Kingambit: Send it last. Give it Ghost or Flying Tera-type to mitigate its biggest weakness, or Water Tera + Tera Blast as a nasty surprise against Ground and Fire types.

She doesn't really need "a better team", just use that team more efficiently instead of sabotaging herself to babysit players. Maybe replace Avalugg or Veluza with a slow mon that can set up Trick Room, which could be deadly if done before Kingambit.

My second biggest complain about this Elite Four is how they use Terastal. In the game we see a few interesting Terastal usages, such as the Charge Beam Electric Mismagius, or Trailblaze Grass Sudowoodo. But the E4 have no strategy at all, they just Terastallize their last Pokémon into their first type, even if that puts them at disadvantage (like I mentioned in another thread, Flamigo into Tera-Flying in front of my Lycanroc, giving me a free Rock Slide ohko)

Terastal is my favorite regional gimmick, but it requires more brain and adaptability, something that the AI can't handle or GF didn't have the time to make it work as it should. Terastallization shouldn't have been scripted, and there's literally no reason why this "Must Terastallize my Ace" logic is even a thing. That worked with Mega evolution because Megas were something inherently scripted, but part of the fun in Terastallization is in not knowing exactly when it'll happen, or if it will actually happen at all.

Geeta is a lame champion, but lame champions is unfortunately the norm, rather than the exception.

I made this comparisson of the champions with fixed teams a few weeks ago (didn't include Blue, Leon, and others with three team variants depending on your starter). So if we analize them, most of their teams have some big flaws, questionable set ups, and ways they could have been better. We just spot these issues much easier as we grow and gain more experience with the franchise, but this has allways been a thing. Very few champions can be argued that they actually took their champion duty seriously.



And yeah, some Elite Four and Champion get improved teams in the rematches, but honestly, rematching is a silly concept because they are supposed to be the strongest trainers in their respective regions, they have no reason to hold back and not hit you with everything they have right away.

 

[Nah]

I like Hassel a bit, am neutral on the others.

I find fighting Geeta after the Elite 4 a bit odd though. I mean, it makes sense in that traditionally we've always fought the Elite 4 and then one other person after in order to become Champion. It's just that because in Paldea multiple people can hold the rank of Champion, you would think that all that is necessary is to beat the E4. Yet you still have to fight the "Top Champion", which implies that they're the strongest one, just to become a regular Champion. And then Geeta tells you that, despite that she supposedly never holds back in any battle, Nemona beat her without having to go all-out.

kinda though that the way things would go would be: beat the E4, become Champion-->fight Nemona becuz she'd be like "omg ur finally a champ i can fight you on equal footing now"-->challenge Geeta for the title of Top Champion as a post-game thing

I also have insulting nicknames for all of them, but explaining them would take me more space than I'm willing to use.

....the temptation is there to ask you what they are

 

[Squirtkipfan01]

Larry was a neat twist, but they ALL are boring design and battle wise. There just kinda there. Greeta might not be the worse champion, but she easily is my least favorite now. Boring ontop of unmemorable team, ontop of being easy

 

[Devalue]

Neutral. Found them easy (partially thanks to having a few levels on them, as the last path completed). Went in blind. Lost no Pokemon, on fake "Set" mode, without items in battle, and without Terastallization. (Noticed them not using items. Followed suit.) Found Penny and Arven more troublesome, due to the teamwide issue with Fairy or a level deficit.

Liked getting faked out by Larry. Expected Normal. Suddenly threw Flying at you. Did not care about the Elite Four's role throughout the story. Wanted to see them doing something interesting.

Covered Geeta's issues in the above posts. Was happy to see Avalugg in there (with Body Press, specifically). Watched a few people attempt this fight, all with Skeledirge. Really needed Sturdy + Mirror Coat. Would have been glorious to stop all those Torch Songing Skeledirges.

Views Nemona as the true "Champion", personally. Comes with 4 levels over Geeta. Did not really help, though. Won with the same restrictions as earlier. Only really feared Goodra (the only Special Attacker against a team of very physically defensive Pokemon).

 

[Sandslash Fan]

Geeta would have been better if she started off with her Ace to set up hazards. Also, since they don't seem to use potions, having their Pokémon use held items in the Elite Four and Champion fights would have been nice to see. Focus Sash and Life Orb on some key Pokémon for each member and it would have made the fights more interesting.

 

[Sheep]

Mostly positive, but primarily for the characters. Rika and Larry are awesome - some of the best NPCs in the game. Hassel is also interesting and I love his friendship with Brassius and personality where he cries easy. But Poppy is very out of place for me being so young.. I know we've had super yound kid trainers before but it feels odd to me to put a child who can barely speak proper English to something as prestigious as E4. :( I assume they have responsibilities other than just battling and she doesn't seem like she can fulfill some of them.

Geeta's team is super boring. Shame because I think she has potential as a character and could make for an interesting villain or something. But as it stands, she's definitely one of the weakest champions.

 

[Orion☆]

But Poppy is very out of place for me being so young.. I know we've had super yound kid trainers before but it feels odd to me to put a child who can barely speak proper English to something as prestigious as E4. :( I assume they have responsibilities other than just battling and she doesn't seem like she can fulfill some of them.

☝️☝️☝️

This so much. She seems like she's had a... rather unusual and not age-appropriate upbringing if she's even there. I don't care if she's a battling prodigy like so many people point out; it seemed to me from the get-go that she should be attending the Academy (or a branch thereof, like a kindergarten) with kids her own age, not serving as a member of the Elite Four. Her being there alone also tanked my view of the other three Elite Four members and Geeta, because they're enabling that situation in the first place. I mean... how morally bankrupt do you have to be to have a 5-year-old on your payroll or even let that kind of thing slip by? In light of what I have said above, it's especially jarring that Hassel, who is also a teacher at the Academy, does not comment on how effed up it is.

If I could change how the game handled Poppy, I would have had her be a sort of menteé to the player character who has a lot of potential but is sort of sheltered due to her background. She would only appear in post-game as a recent newcomer to the Academy, and your task would be to show her around, to help her get to know other students, and to develop her talent as a Trainer. And given some of the themes this game deals with, a fitting conclusion to her quest would be...

Spoiler:

...to fight her adult self, now the Champion of Paldea, brought from the future to the present by the time machine in Area Zero or a Celebi. At the end she would thank you for helping her get to where she is, while playing coy about what became of the player character at that point in the timeline.

 

[Nah]

Sometimes I wonder if maybe Poppy just looks like a kid but is really an adult (or at least a teenager)

But this is also a series where a kid who is on average the age of 12 takes on the regional mafia while the adults do nothing so uh.....

 

[moon]

As someone who haven't played the games, all I have to go on are vids and art I've seen and what other players have told me.

I really like this E4 compared to... Well, maybe all other regions? I love that they wear normal clothes. Larry is the best character. Rika is hecking cool. Hassel is adorable. poppy is smol child eh why is she there. Geeta seems very mysterious and cool, but in a "i make larry work too hard" way heh.

I'd take this bunch over several of the other weird costume themed bunches, at any rate.

 

[Janp]

I can barely recall what they looked like or what Pokémon any of them used. Aside from Larry, he's one of the best characters in the game. I know one is Aaron lookalike, one is Acelora lookalike and the final one is... I have no idea.

I know some of them appeared in the story, but I never felt like they were important or well-written. And their battles were usually over before they could even start.

 

[Sweet Serenity]

I can barely recall what they looked like or what Pokémon any of them used. Aside from Larry, he's one of the best characters in the game. I know one is Aaron lookalike, one is Acelora lookalike and the final one is... I have no idea.

I know some of them appeared in the story, but I never felt like they were important or well-written. And their battles were usually over before they could even start.

I agree. A lot of these battles were extremely easy and many of the characters simply aren't memorable. Yet, that's perfectly fine for me because I just enjoy the open world anyway!

 

[Hashimi]

I recently cleared the path at hand and I can say I did appreciate these characters. My favourite being Hassel, thing I told Clavell too when he asked me about who the teacher I liked the most was. Rika is funny and Poppy I think she has the best team out of them all. I enjoy Larry as well but he's not really my style of character overall.
As for Geeta (who I nicknamed "Glimmora haired woman") her team is okay, but I'd rather have replaced Avalugg with Cetitan, Veluza with either Dondozo or Tatsugiri - since she already has Espathra as a psychic Pokémon - and finally gave her ace, Glimmora, the hidden ability corrosion with toxic as a move and a poison type tera jewel instead of rock.

 

[ReKoil]

I battled all of them yesterday and already forgot them and their teams tbh.
I bopped every single Pokemon except one of the champion's Pokemon in a single hit.

 

[Alex_Among_Foxes]

Since I voted 'Neutral' to them, I'm going to split my review of the Elite 4 in two.

The things I liked about them:
I'll start with Hassel. As someone who actually did all the classes before the E4, I really liked him. He was a bit... Much at times,
but that was okay because I got to see what he was like outside of just being a boss character, and he seems like a nice person.

Larry was alright, I wasn't very fond of recycling a Gym Leader as a member of the E4, but I though some of the gags revolving around
his 'Ive been working for 72 hours straight and I just want to go home and sleep' personality were pretty funny, so I'll give him a pass.

While I was not at all fond of the terrible idea to force the player go through that absolutely horrendous 'interview',
I don't hold that against Rika. I liked her 'mostly' no nonsense personality, I liked her style, and I liked the way she interacted with the other
E4 members. I'd even say she was my favorite member of them this Gen.

I didn't really care too much about their pokemon or team composition, I honestly would've skipped this path altogether if the game
didn't require me to complete it to access Area Zero. I mostly like pokemon games for the 'Gotta Catch'em All(TM)' aspect anymore.
And that's mostly because I'm board of the single battle only format that the main series games always run with. (double or triple battle only mode please)

That ends all the good points I had about them. Now for the things I didn't like so much:

Poppy gave me the creeps. I think they made her character act way too young, like how am I meant to believe a dang toddler made it into the E4,
when in most games the protag is already 10+ years old and they still don't even have a pokemon of their own yet?
And there are even some games that FORCE the player to go to the pokeschool for newbies! Yet this (non ESP gifted BTW) child probably
barely out of diapers, is A MEMBER OF THE ELITE PSYDUCKING (as they say on this site) 4? NO. WAY.

I'm only going to say a few thing about the 'Top' Champion. Personality? Hated it. Team? Hahahahahaha!*
Her style? From the neck down is fine, but why did they design her head to look like a dang space alien? And her hair... Yeesh. Though I will say, I didn't dislike
her more than Diantha, so she's got that at least.

*(for context, I one shotted her last pokemon with my Grass Cat's crit only move. I wasn't even trying either, she Tera'd her pokemon from a Rock/Poison
to Rock only, WHILE my GRASS/dark pokemon was ON THE FIELD! I was going to hit her pokemon once with that move just to soften it up and then dip,
but with her AI's zero brained move I ended up OHKOing it! L.O.L.)

 

[PageEmp]

Okay, some brief thoughts, based on my first SV Nuzlocke…

Geeta:

Spoiler:

Yeah, this really was kinda easy for a 'champion', although it could also be because I had an insanely overpowered Meowscarada who destroyed two thirds of her squad and if it weren't for that cat, I might have lost a team member and emphasis on might. Suffice to say everyone here suggesting ways she could have been better are not wrong.

Rika:

Spoiler:

There was one thing preventing my battle against her from being balls easy and that was her Clodsire, who I did not expect to have Water absorb, as the Clodsire I used in my run did not have that. Seriously, I don't know why they brought back the fixed order E4. It usually means the first member is gonna be a joke because most people would grind for the champion's levels.

Poppy:

Spoiler:

I present to all you guys: the easiest boss in the whole game for me! No really, in my run, she was the only major boss, INCLUDING earlygame ones, where I only needed ONE mon to defeat. That would be my Camerupt. No I didn't even need X items (even though I planned to) nor did I need any boosts. Camerupt just simply MOWED through her.

Larry:

Spoiler:

Both times fighting Larry, one of my specific mons took out the majority of both his teams. No, it wasn't a Fighting/Ice/Rock/any combination of those, it was Pelipper. Pelipper cheesed him back at the Normal gym, and she also took out a great chunk of his squadron here as well. Overall not too bad except for my ghost nearly dying to Close combat. The Flamigo I owned did not have Scrappy as an ability.

Hassel:

Spoiler:

Was just unmemorable altogether. Was worried for his Noivern that could outspeed everyone and potentially have Flamethrower, but it never used it. His Altaria did have Flamethrower but it wasn't as threatening because Altaria isn't known for high attacking stats. So yeah in general, E4 were pretty easy here. Although not that I'm complaining.